The difference between sex & making love

[Exasperatedmrs]

After 15 years of pretty regular sex with dh I've become frustrated. I don't feel emotionally connected during sex. I've tried to be 'loving & gentle' towards him to guide him towards what I'm looking for. He doesn't make eye contact, there's no deep meaningful gazes, no gentle stroking of my hair or face, no gentle kisses on my face, no handholding, no gentle stroking with his fingertips. Does anyone know what I mean? Maybe it's me- I've tried to explain how I feel but he doesn't seem to 'get it'. Don't get me wrong. Sex can be very good with him but sometimes it's porn like when all I want is to feel really loved & cherished. I feel that I could be anyone, not special. He has a high sex drive,was way too into porn in the past & has had an affair while married to me. Do all/most married women get what I'm not getting or aibu?

[Exasperatedmrs]

Maybe he has used porn during our time together, I won't ever know because he's told me so many lies in the past. You are exactly right silver, it's s 'feeling' I'm looking for from him & I don't get it. There's no point massaging me if there's no feeling behind it & there's no point gazing at me with empty eyes. He says he used porn out of frustration when he was younger/ all his pals seemed to be getting sex but he claims to be a late starter (early 20's how 42). He's into giving oral in a big way but didn't receive it from ow. That just tells me he was more into her than her him. No he's not romantic atall, there was no proposal we just kind of got married, I didnt get an engagement ring & I didn't get a birthday present to open on my birthday-wouldn't normally be a big deal but I just thought he would given what he's done to me. My birthday was August but by Christmas he made an effort & I got some nice things. Maybe the penny is beginning to drop with him.

[AnyFucker]

So sad to see any woman having such low expectations for herself

[silverfoxofwarwick1952]

Life is the most amazing gift we are given. You have loads left. Sadly it's finite and this is no trial run. Don't wait too long.

[flightywoman]

I'm not convinced that you're that happy with him really OP. You say you want to stay with him, but do you really? I mean really?

He bangs away like a storm door in the wind with no apparent thought for what you might like, he doesn't seem to be doing much to convince you that you are love and cared for, he doesn't seem to be doing much at all to be making you think you've made the right choice.

I just don't see what there is about him to make you talk so lovingly about him...

[Exasperatedmrs]

I know I do love him. However he has broken my heart by having an affair. I'm distraught some days. I can't bear the thought of him with anyone else. I mean that, it's the most painful experience of my life. Maybe I'm just taking a very very long time to see sense, but I hate the thought of my life without him in it.

[HootOnTheBeach]

I don't think you get the kind of emotional connection you want from a sexual technique, you get it from feeling emotionally close to begin with and then when you have sex it pushes those feelings into overdrive.

[Destinysdaughter]

This man is a twat and you're a fool for putting up with it.

[Millliii]

If he says he had an affair just for the sex, why? Did he feel that he wasn't getting it from you? Also you have said he was way into the OW than she was into him. That's not good, is it?

[Lovehandles]

Agree with hootonthebeach
I think the problem here is not so much the sex but the fact that he had an affair ... you don't sound happy with him OP

[Millliii]

Also how did you come to be back together?

[ObsidianBlackbirdMcNight]

You're only 8 months on from the affair, so it's bound to still be raw. Plus you haven't had any of the reparation work from him that he really needed to do to repair your marriage.
Those are the issues, the crap sex is just a mirror to how generally unappreciated and Unvalued you feel. Maybe you accepted the crap sex before the affair but now it's more like a kick in the teeth than fun?
Fwiw I completely understand what you mean by 'making love'. I'd never use that expression in real life but of course there is a difference between unconnected fucking and sex with a connection. To be honest even if I'm getting fucked and it's all dirty and shit I still expect a level of connection, a bit of eye contact or some frantic kissing is hot and reminds you that you're having an experience together. Your man sounds deficient, to be honest.

[Exasperatedmrs]

I think he's the type who finds the offer of sex too hard to refuse & that's why he did it. She was a work colleague so the saw each other every day , they got away with it once so it became a habit. I have known her for several years, she knew he was married & knows our children. She is most definitely the 'type' to offer no strings sex. I can see why this appealed to him. I knew it was going on & confronted him several times to be met with denial- he almost drove me out of my mind. We never separated so there was no "getting back together". I think I need to feel special to him & that's why I brought up the sex issue. I didn't before because he hadn't been unfaithful before. I want to feel I'm valued more than her but currently I don't. You're right- the affair is a big issue for me. Sex was happening at home , he didn't need to go elsewhere. She Persued him relentlessly till he gave in then she dropped him to move on to someone else.

[HandyWoman]

Oh dear OP. I think you are hurting and looking for a 'connection' with him - a connection that sounds like it was never there. And now that he's had an affair you need the connection badly to reassure you you were right to say.

But the sad truth is he sounds like he isn't capable of giving it to you.

Sex is more than about technique. It is blended with emotion and connection, to different extents on different occasions.

Sounds like his only sex education is porn. He has no need for the emotional connection with sex because he doesn't associate the two.

OP you are never going to get loving sex from him. He is deficient and probably 'damaged' by porn.

Perhaps you are wrong to stay with him.

I think if you get him to leave for a bit and go into therapy you can start to work this all out.

[DrMorbius]

Op - dispassionately as possible read through this whole thread again, as if it was about someone else and see what your opinion would be.

I think he's the type who finds the offer of sex too hard to refuse & that's why he did it sorry that's bullshit. There is no "type" like that. It is always about consequences. What you really mean was he didn't care about the consequences of random sex. Getting caught, giving you an infection, all those risk factors didn't outweight his love, respect, admiration of you. I'm sorry to say, but in simple terms his randhom work shag meant more than losing you.

Please wake up and stop being an apologist for his shit behaviour She is most definitely the 'type' to offer no strings sex She Persued him relentlessly till he gave in then she dropped him to move on to someone else do you REALLY believe that bullshit that you wrote???

I think I need to feel special to him & that's why I brought up the sex
I want to feel I'm valued more than her but currently I don't
The guy is treating you as a grade A blow-up dolly (sorry), the living breathing type. That's how "special" you are to him. How often do you initiate the different positions?

I am sorry to be so harsh but I have watched your thread and did not comment previously, because (to me) it is plain you don't want to face up to the fact that this man is a shit. But your last post practically exonerating him while blaming the woman was the last straw.

[Exasperatedmrs]

I do not exonerate him of all blame, he was married he should have known the difference between right & wrong. & no one forced him to do what he did. With regards to her perusing him - I know that's true as I witnessed it I read some of her texts. "I want you" bla bla bla. She would phone him at night & on his days off. When you live in a village everyone knows everyone and believe me this young lady comes with quite a track record. My husband was the butcher, she's had the baker & now it's the candlestick maker. She did the majority of the chasing but of course I acknowledge he was complicit. I think she behaves like this to boost her ego. There is no excuse for his behaviour. She's had several hidings & verbal warnings from wives & girlfriends. I have never approached her, I will not let her reduce me to fishwife behaviour or scraping in the street. However, if I thought my dh had had some sort of mid life crisis I want to try to help him. I want to forgive him but he's not making that easy. Yes I think porn has brainwashed him & he doesn't associate sex with love. It's more like a bodily function to him -a release. He says he loves me but I need to feel it.

[HandyWoman]

He says he loves me but I need to feel it

That's true. For everyone. I think if you really sit with all this and think about yourself -

...you would have to question whether this man gives you what you quite rightly need and deserve.

I think the affair has brought you pain and hurt and need for extra validation. You are sort of doing the 'pick me dance' but he can't even see it.

This affair seems to have brought into sharp focus that this man does not and can not love you. Not in the way you (and most people) need to be loved. With emotions, respect, connection. I think being married to this man will always lack that.

[firesidechat]

Why do you love him? What do you love about him?

I genuinely would like to know because it is a recurring theme on the relationships board, so not just you op.

Women come on here with examples of terrible behaviour and relationships and yet almost always add that they really love this man. Why?

Love needs feeding, not with expensive flowers and grand gestures, but with kindness and respect for each other, amongst many other little things. Why doesn't love just shrivel up and die when the object of your love is treating you so badly. Perhaps our ideas of love are different to each other.

[ScarletForYa]

OP, the affair aside. Some people just aren't 'love makers'. Your description of it makes me want to tear my skin off. I can think of nothing worse than all that light touching, simpering and eye gazing. Point is, some people will just never, ever want or enjoy that.

Was he ever into it?

It sounds like you have two totally different sexual styles. You associate sex with love. Whereas to him it's just a pleasurable physical experience.

I don't think you'll be able to change that. It's just the way people are hard wired.

[ObsidianBlackbirdMcNight]

What's that book people recommend to heal from an affair?
I'm really sorry op but he's basically done none of the things a cheater needs to do and so your marriage isn't going to recover. Getting over an an affair is fucking hard.

[firesidechat]

I think you are deluded op.

If my husband slept with a women who had in turn slept with every man in our city, I would still blame my husband for his actions. He wouldn't do this, by the way.

Answer me this op. For lots of women, the porn, the affair, the selfish sex would have killed the relationship. Why hasn't it for you? What are seeing that the rest of us don't?

[DrMorbius]

FFS - I tell you your DH treats you as a blow-up doll, doesn't care about your marriage, could have given you a serious disease and you reply wasting 200 words on it was all the scarlet woman's fault!!!!
Whatever you say, whatever "magic" you think the scarlet woman used, whatever her past was. Your husband voluntarily put his dick in her.

You do know she is probably not the only one don't you.

[Exasperatedmrs]

Scarlet yes I think that's right. He was much more experienced than me & he admits he had issues with 'hard' porn. I have never had a ons in my life because I didn't see the point. I am shy therefore I wouldn't get anything out of it so why bother. I only ever wanted my husband to know me in that way & I knew that from a young age. He never has been tender with me in the bedroom but everything seemed fine & I accepted it as just the way he was. As I say until his affair, I needed to be shown in loved. You've all answered my original question & I thank you for taking the time to do so. You've given me much to consider.

[ScarletForYa]

You're two totally different people when it comes to sex, that's not something that will change.

People sexual preferences and styles are hard wired I believe.

You're in a difficult spot.

[Exasperatedmrs]

What do I see in him? I honestly can't put my finger on it but for me it's definitely there. I wish I could tell you what it is but I can't describe it. I think I would say I 'adored' him & maybe the reality of the situation hasn't hit me yet. Please understand I thought -I was sure -I was married for life. I've had an enormous shock. He has completely pulled the rug from below me. On a practical level he's done what he can to reassure me, changed jobs to get away from her & he's signed the house over to me . If the marriage does fail he will walk away with nothing, I have that on paper. He would accept total blame. I don't want grand gestures I just wish I believed he loves me.
(Yes I do realise he could've given me a disease & we both went to gum clinic immediately when the affair was exposed). I know what he has done to me is horrendous but if we could get back to where we were before this bomb exploded I think it is worth fighting for.

[firesidechat]

On a practical level I'm not so sure about him walking away with nothing. Signing the house over to you is irrelevant as it would still be seen as an asset of the marriage and he would be entitled to 50% of it, give or take a bit. Signing the house over to you was in all probability a meaningless gesture. Do you really think that he would say "oh ok you take the house, sweetheart" if you split up?