If your father left you to die [Trigger warning for addiction/alcoholism added by MNHQ]

[WildeWoman]

By leaving you to die, I mean 'she's an alcoholic, what can you do'.

And you later found out that he may have been complicit in welfare fraud..........

Would you report him?

And how you supposed to know if they've reached a genuine turning point? I mean perhaps there have been a hundred Rock bottoms and you just have nothing left to give emotionally to someone who has been killing themselves slowly. Slowly killing you.

Yes it's sad for Zoe but it's not her family's fault if they truly couldn't face another day.

Expecting repeated and unconditional help is the definition of entitlement, in my opinion. I say that after trying to help several friends and loved ones through addiction. You can't expect people to keep on giving.

And one thing I do know, an alcoholic can spin a good 'woe is me,' yarn. The shit that my mother would say about her own children to get sympathy, to get another drink. To make sure that everyone knew she was the victim and we were all nasty, bullying Abusive children. How we just abandoned her in her hour of need. If only we had just given that little bit more. All her siblings blamed us until they had to see for themselves and saw first hand the reality of her alcoholism.

Until you've actually supported someone with alcoholism and walked in their shoes too don't be so quick to judge.

captain - I'm sorry for appearing to judge, I wasn't in general. I would have thought there was only one "rock bottom" because that would be the one where the person involved actually did change and sort themselves out. I admit I have no direct personal experience (nearest is my sister's MIL, who has been "dry" for 20 years now) but that was my understanding of how it works.
Anyone who hits a "rock bottom" and doesn't change, hasn't really hit "rock bottom", I wouldn't have thought?

I'm not justifying what your father did OP, but you do not seem to be accepting any responsability for what happened. Surely part of the cure is accepting responsability for our own actions, rather than just blaming other people.

I commented earlier, but I can't sleep this thread has really upset me and brought back a lot of painful memories.

To have a child with a addiction problem is the worst pain imaginable, it broke my heart but I couldn't walk away.
I watched my beautiful daughter turn into a stranger before my eyes and I couldn't made it better.
I always knew deep down how it would end I used to tell her repeatedly.
If I could have her back tomorrow I would and I'd take everything that came with addiction just to have her here.

there is no manual, what may seem like rock bottom to you and I might not be for an alcoholic. Addiction is a cruel and nasty affliction, it's not just the addict but those having to live with it too. Often being judged for walking away, when in reality I doubt anyone walks away easily.

the problem is thumbwitch you can't know when its actually the bottom, or when its a tale you are being spun. There were dozens up dozens of times when I thought this was 'it' she was finally ready to get better, but after 20+ years of hearing how it was different this time there reached a point where for my children's sake and my own mental health, i couldn't have her in life anymore. and honestly, even if she does get sober now, its too late. Which makes me desperately sad, but I'm not prepared to destroy myself over it anymore.

Thinking of you coco, your post really moved me and brought me to tears. X

I couldn't stand by and let a 19 yo girl be released from rehab into a halfway house miles from her home, but if the clinic were aware that other residents were using they should have looked for an alternative and I have to wonder whether Zoe's family were advised to keep their wallets in their pockets stand back by well-meaning but misguided professionals, Garlic.

These are for Zoe and for all young people who are as tormented and conflicted as she was.

It's all but impossible for anyone other than the individual to know when they've made the decision they need to turn the corner. It's usually as a result of there nearest and dearest taking some drastic actions. My father was an alcoholic and occasional tyrant with it. It took my mother kicking his ass out the door for him to get his head sorted. Pretty sure that was his rock bottom but only because my mother was mentally strong enough to stand by her decision which in hindsight probably added a few healthy years to his life. Smothering an alcoholic with unconditional love and generosity does not cure them. Empty threats and actions does not change the pattern, in my experience.

This is terribly tragic for all concerned. Some people are more susceptible to addiction than others, so it coud be genetic. So it is hardly the alcoholics fault.

But on the other hand, the people closest to the alcoholic have to put up with their extreme selfishness, and often dishonesty where getting the next drink becomes more important than consideration for others.

An alcoholic depends on drawing on the emotional reserves of others, they are 'takers'. The people closest to them are put in the position of having to put up with and make allowances for, the consequences of the alcoholic's behaviour and have no choice to be 'givers' sometimes until their emotional reserves are depleted. Sometimes they crack under the strain.

You op, assume your father is emotionally strong, you berate him for his treatment of you. But what about your treatment of him over the years? May be has tried in the past? We don't know his side. He might be at his wit's end. May be he has chosen to protect himself after years of emotional abuse from you.

Op, it is sometimes best to let go of people you find toxic. We don't know if he was the cause of you becoming alcoholic in the first place, or one of them. You haven't said he was. Was there a cause? Sometimes there isn't one. He doesn't meet your needs, how old are you?

Perhaps he is old and needs someone to care for him rather than being demanded to care for you. There is often a subtle turning point at a certain age. Sometimes people just get tired and broken and give up after years of emotional upset. Perhaps that is what has happened.

Either way op, please don't berate others for their shortcomings when you you clearly have shortcomings of your own. It sounds as if you have reached a turning point in your life. That is positive.

Please try and turn your positivity into seeing the good in the world instead of focussing on the toxic and negative.

What and who are the good things in your life op? You only get one life so please look ahead to a brighter future as it sounds as if you have been to hell and back.

Good luck

Part of addiction is only being able to see ones own needs and wants. Having been on the other end of this unlimited entitlement my unconditional love is reserved for children and animals.

For those, like me, who had to walk away from an alcoholic or addict remember that there are two sides to every story. Wilde has told her side. I daresay we'll never know her father's.

But we know our stories, don't we? We know why we chose to stop enabling and instead walk away. Walk away and tell them to get help and let us know when they got sober. And what it took to do so. In my case, my brother did hit bottom and got the help he needed, the help that I couldn't give him.

Wilde I won't judge you. But please don't judge me, either. Because there are two sides to every story. Mine had a happy ending. I hope yours does, too.

Oh coco I am so very sorry for your loss and I'm moved to tears at the thought of the heartbreak you've endured.

I wish had words to comfort you, but although the passing of time may enable you to reach some accomodation with your grief it will never ease the pain of losing your beautiful dd after you did everything humanly possible, and more, to save her.

I hope you are able to get some sleep and that your lovely girl is in your dreams tonight and every night.

I also think the ' left you to die' is typical of addiction in my own experience - everything is life or death - every item stolen to sell is saving thier life, every childs birthday/contact day/school play etc missed was because of an emergancy, every name called was because they were driven to it by the other person, it is never an addicicts responsibility and its always more important than anything else.

great post wotodoo

I feel for you, my dad is the type who will use his own holidays, new extensions and new cars as an expression of how he knows how to do things and you don't. Bothe his children struggled in poverty and he was always on the world's side against his kids.. I am not alcoholic, but he puts me in that box, I am not unemployable but he puts me in that box, if I ask for advice its only given in a 'you need to stop being as useless as you are'

you can't do anything to damage yourself enough that he will help if he is of this mind..its an excuse on his part...

he has been too mean for too long, and that has probably helped an emotional distance become problematic.

It can be amazing how some parents will attack and put their own kids through worse than anyone else. My dads doom laden dissatisfaction is present even with a success story....

Was going to add my tuppence happeny but Wotoodoo basically summed it up better than I ever could.

Hope you turn your life around OP.

My stepfather is an alcoholic. OP, you have no idea what living with an alcoholic is like, you have not looked at it from anyone's perspective but your own. Only you can make yourself better, you have to own your choices, not blame the bystanders. I hope you continue to recover, but relapse is frequent, sadly, so never be complacent. Keep working on owning your demons, for your sake but also for the sake of your family and friends, if you can care even a little bit about them.

I was also going to say my piece but Wotoodoo has said how I feel. My mother was an alcoholic and I had to walk away in the end. She could see no other point apart from her own and everyone else was to blame. I would love to hear your fathers side of the story.

I think you are forgetting all the bits before, where you made a decision to keep drinking.

The bottom line is that you made the choices that resulted in you being homeless, not him.

Maybe he reached the end of his tether. You letter to him screams immaturity. Maybe he didn't want to keep bailing you out for the rest of his life, maybe he wanted you to want to help yourself? I think it's very easy to project him into being the problem.

this shit about 'enabling' addiction needs to end.

I've heard this ^ rubbish trotted out before by addict and ex addicts, just like Wilde has.

Unless you have lived with an addict you have absolutely no idea what hell it can be like. Sometimes enough is enough.

It sounds as if you haven't reached the part of recovery where you take responsibility for your own actions. Have you actually stopped drinking?

Your letter and reporting him out of pure malice screams immature. Everything you've put him through and this is your climax. I don't believe he hasn't tried to help you, I think as with all addicts you cant see what you don't want to see.

If you have stopped would you have if he had helped you off the streets or was that your rock bottom?

Your letter and reporting him out of pure malice screams immature. Everything you've put him through and this is your climax. I don't believe he hasn't tried to help you, I think as with all addicts you cant see what you don't want to see.

I completely agree.