Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

I have destroyed my own tangled web of confusion

191 replies

spidergurl · 11/10/2015 18:11

WARNING: This is going to be long, so thank you very much to whoever reads all the way through. And please make sure you're comfy before you start ;-)

I (20s) met him (40s, let's call him Tom) last November. We went out together twice and even though I liked him, our chemistry was amazing and the kissing wonderful, I was going through some kind of existential crisis in which I was questioning everything about my life, and I vanished from his. Poor, I know.

In July, I felt I was getting back on track and moved to his part of town. After eight months of zero romance, not even so much as a kiss, I had met another guy who I had very casually started seeing. Yet I sent Tom a message apologising for having disappeared and asked if I could buy him a drink.
I was beginning to feel better about life and I was enjoying getting back into dating. That same night, I went back to his house and slept with him. It was wonderful and I was reminded just how much this guy made me laugh, just how well we clicked. That morning as we were having breakfast, he got a text, which he ignored, then a call, which he ignored, then his doorbell rang, and when he ignored THAT there was the sound of a key in the door. He rushed down to 'sort it out'. Turns out he'd been seeing this married woman (had given her a key to go to the shop and back the week previously and had forgotten she still had it). At this stage I wasn't emotionally involved with him and could offer him some advice and an ear. I asked whether he loved her, and he said 'it's not that simple'.

Our relationship progressed nicely over the next two or three weeks. It was now early August. I was still seeing the other guy, too. Things with both had progressed to the stage where I didn't think it was right to be seeing two men anymore. I spoke to both of them individually about it, and Tom was pissed off that I'd been continuing to see this other guy. Personally I felt that we didn't feel like a couple and it was such early days that there wasn't much wrong with dating other people - especially since there was the married woman scenario, which sort of made me think him a little hypocritical.
From early August to early September, we continued seeing each other twice a week. We loved spending time together, never a dull moment, so in sync with each other. But I should mention that this is set against a backdrop of quite a lot of alcohol consumed (both of us), and very regular cocaine use (him). As soon as I started to feel emotionally involved, I started 'acting up', by which I mean I became oversensitive and started walking off on a regular basis. I suppose deep inside I was insecure about where we stood. Every now and then when his phone would go off near me, I'd instinctively look down and see he'd received a message from the married woman. Obviously I never read the messages, and he reassured me that she'd moved and they were just friends (he did see her at a festival in August, and there was the niggling thing of....a friend who texts at 8 in the morning?), but that coupled with the sometimes offhand way I felt he could be (maybe the coke?) resulted in me storming off for almost no reason fairly often. I just felt unsure and insecure, and like he didn't take me seriously, and I'm not sure why, when he was so tender with me and we had such a good time together. One time for seemingly no good reason, I started crying and said 'I wonder if I made the right decision, to stop seeing that other guy'. I suppose I didn't like the sometimes too casual way he would act with me. After I said that I calmed down, we went to the pub, and he left me there after an hour and wouldn't answer my calls.

In early September, the final straw came. He invited me round to his, I felt he was being a little standoffish and 'lazy' with me, and without warning I jumped out of the bed in the middle of the night and left. As I left I told him I wasn't an app, I didn't want to sit around just being someone's narcissistic mirror, as that's what it sometimes felt like. I left and received a text from him saying he couldn't take the drama, that this was the 6th time I'd done this to him and he couldn't take it anymore. I didn't hear from him for 10 days.

I suppose this would be a good point to mention that I'm starting to realise one of the main problems is that we were viewing 'us' in two different ways. We never spoke about what we were, or had. And I'm starting to think that he saw me as his girlfriend, whereas I was convinced we were just 'seeing' each other (I would have wanted more). I'm not sure why we had these two different views of it, but I think that was one problem. From my perspective, the fact that we rarely met during the day, and that we'd never had a full day together (we'd go out together, have sex, wake up, have breakfast, then one or the other would leave) didn't make me feel like we were in a proper full-on relationship.

The 10 days of silence from him passed. The final day was a Sunday. I had given up hope. I was devastated. I couldn't stop thinking about him and how I'd fucked things up. So I made a really stupid mistake. In a desperate attempt to make myself feel better, I created a Tinder profile on Sunday afternoon. I don't know what I was thinking, I didn't even think I'd use it. I'm sure a lot of women here can relate: my logic was I could dull the pain of one man's rejection with the comfort of another. I don't think I was going to act on it. But I think I had to feel like I was doing something to get control over myself again. I felt heartbroken. That same afternoon, I went out with some friends. In one last final attempt to reach out, I texted him that what we were doing was great, and I just wished he could be there with me to share it. To my total amazement, he replied. He suggested we go to his local for dinner that night.

When I arrived at the pub, he was completely off with me. Talking to anyone but me and actively making me feel uncomfortable (pretending not to hear me, getting me to repeat myself, etc.). I was confused as I thought he wanted to make up. I grit my teeth and did my best to chat away with his mates, who I like. At closing time, he walked me home and we sort of had it out.

He said I had abandonment issues and needed therapy (he has a point). He told me I couldn't just relax without his undivided attention (true, but only because I felt the whole relationship was an insecure environment). He said a lot of other things that resonated with me.

And then: he pulled his phone out his pocket and said "And I saw -". And then stopped. I said "saw what?" and he said it didn't matter. We walked back to his. He said I "scared" him. He said he was sure he was just a transient thing for me. I denied that. The next morning when I got back home, I deleted my Tinder account.

Since that night, one month ago, I took everything he said on board. I started therapy. I tried to completely turn my attitude around and it worked. We've had a month of great times, although I did feel he was slightly more pulled back now, warier. I just thought I would have to regain some trust, and accepted that. It became left up to me to organise all of our meetings. I think he wanted to see me "work for it", if you get me. So I did. We did non-booze related things together. It was brilliant. He said "I adore you" and "I think about you all the time". And I feel, felt, the same. I love every minute I spend with him. He makes me happy. He makes me laugh, he makes me feel supported and protected. This Friday he sent me a text at 11pm inviting me round to his for cocktails, but I was shattered. I suggested we go down to the sea the following day (Saturday). And so yesterday I texted him at 5pm asking if he wanted to meet in an hour. No reply. Two hours later he called, jovial, said he was at the skate park, etc. I was a bit gutted as I thought we'd be going down to the beach together, but invited him to join me and my mates at our local later.

When he arrived at the pub last night, he was clearly off with me. Didn't even come over and greet me. Spoke to everyone but me. Got up from the table when I started a story, you get the idea. I tried to shrug it off and focus on his mates and mine. At closing time, me and my mate went back to his for drinks, but he was still being passive aggressive with me, not communicating, not smiling, despite having invited me back (??). When we got in, I let some little catty aside out, mainly at the frustration of having just spent 6 hours basically being ignored by the man I so care about. He went apeshit. I couldn't even finish a sentence. He was steamrolling all over me. He said it was bullshit how I only asked him to go down to the sea at 5pm, when he'd been waiting all day (I just wanted to go for dusk - I would have thought he'd initiate a text if he wanted to go earlier). He called me manipulative. He called me desperate for male attention (I'm not a flirt, I don't act or dress provocatively at all, so I can only assume he means talking to his mates - which I would have thought any guy would appreciate it). He called me emotionally abusive. Then the real slap came: "And I saw your fucking Tinder profile".
Wow. That profile had been online for 16 hours only, a month ago. I said so he must have been on Tinder too. He said "just keeping tabs on you". We didn't meet online, by the way. I began to feel panic and regret. It was impossible to get him to understand my reasoning for having that profile up. I couldn't get him to understand it had been up there for only 16 hours. He seemed convinced I was sleeping with other men. I told him I hadn't slept with anyone else since July. But he was getting louder and louder and less and less willing to hear me. Finally, he told me to fuck off and all but frog marched me out of his house. He told me to get lost and said he would discuss things another time.

I'm so upset. I feel like I've really fucked this up, but there are so many things I don't understand. I don;t know how to fix it. I tried calling him once this morning (went to voicemail). Then I sent a massive text telling him we needed to have an honest conversation where we get everything out on the table. I said I felt like our relationship had started with mistrust because we were both seeing other people at the start, and we needed to have a frank discussion about everything so we could nip this in the bud instead of always hiding away from it, whether with socialising/drink, or me storming off, or him throwing me out. No reply.

I'm hurt, I don't know what to do now, I can't bear the thought of such good potential going to waste. I haven't felt so in tune with someone in a long time, but what the hell am I going to do about this now?

I needed to write all this down. If you've read this far, thanks again. If you could give me any outsider insight that would be very appreciated. I should point out that I realise the drinking and his drug use are NOT conducive to healthy behaviour - I do know that and it should be something that changes.

Why was he on Tinder? As I said, it was up for 16 hours: that's quite a stroke of luck, isn't it, to log on to Tinder in the small 16-hour window in which it was visible? Why would he wait a full month, holding on to that Tinder profile thing? How could he spend time with me and be tender with me to suddenly lose it over this information he's been guarding? What pisses me off is how he started this fight after a month when I'd really been trying and things were going so well. He may have complained about my walking off in a strop, but his way of completely shutting down (not reply to me) is also very distressing and a little controlling.

Ultimately - do you think I've fucked this up beyond all repair? Obviously you don't know the guy - but what the hell could his POV be? How could he be feeling? Do you think I've behaved badly? Obviously I know I have - I'm just not sure it warrants this explosiveness and 'punishing'. Do you think he feels mistrustful of me? Does he not give a shit? I just can't tell, I don't know what's true anymore.

OP posts:
mix56 · 27/10/2015 16:49

Glad you liked it. Sadly this sums it up.

CalonDu · 27/10/2015 16:50

I think we've all been wasting our breath.

Fontella · 27/10/2015 16:52

I think we've all been wasting our breath

Yep.

pearpotter · 27/10/2015 16:53

Forget him. Forget dating. Sort yourself out. You both sound like a bit of a nightmare, TBH.

popalot · 27/10/2015 16:55

sure, if you like self obsessed cokeheads who mess you around for their own pleasure

saltlakecity · 27/10/2015 17:01

I mean this kindly but to avoid this kind of soap opera lifestyle please surround yourself with normality. You both sound like awfully hard work. Take control of your life and fgs just stop agonising over every last detail so much. Calmness is good.

spidergurl · 27/10/2015 17:03

It just feels like an actual addiction

OP posts:
TheCreepyContessaOfPlumperton · 27/10/2015 17:03

Oh, go shag him then. You clearly have no boundaries so nothing we say will help.

Enjoy your emotional torment in about 1 month's time.

thestamp · 27/10/2015 17:08

it is an addiction.

you are seeking out the high that comes from the bonding hormone (oxytocin), which rushes out when he is nice to you.

it's literally exactly the same thing as craving heroin (or coke).

he knows this - as most fuckwits do - and treats you mean to keep you keen (i.e. he knows that whenever he makes you feel bad, it starts a new craving, which means he can get whatever he wants from you because you become desperate to please him and get that "hit").

this is how abusive relationships entrench themselves.

go have a look at my thread ("aibu?") if you want to see the outcome of pursuing this rs...

craving something doesn't mean that it's a good idea to go get it. if it did, heroin addiction would be no big deal.

go and have a cold glass of water/hot cup of sweet tea, and write some poetry, and have a bath, and take care of yourself. the craving will pass as all cravings do

people who follow their cravings, even when they're a bad idea, end up miserable in gutters (literally and/or figuratively)

spidergurl · 27/10/2015 17:11

Thanks thestamp, it makes a lot of sense. As with all cravings, it comes and goes. Sometimes I feel completely fine, other times it's almost physical.

OP posts:
exWifebeginsat40 · 27/10/2015 17:15

never mind all that nonsense. has anyone asked yet why in the OP, Tom (40s) was at the skate park?

the skate park?

spidergurl · 27/10/2015 17:16

Errrm....well, he likes to skateboard.....

OP posts:
thestamp · 27/10/2015 17:18

glad it made sense.

realise that it IS actually physical. very physical. not "almost" physical.

those bonding hormones are extremely intense. we wouldn't have survived the stone age if women didn't latch on to men/babies didn't latch on to mothers/etc. there was a time when we really really needed each other physically or we would be eaten by sabre tooth tigers or starve to death in the winter etc.

thing is it's not the stone age anymore and we don't need to cling desperately to each passing ship. now we get to choose who we invest our time in.

choose wisely. choose things that will improve your life. choose nice people.

spidergurl · 27/10/2015 17:19

By the way, I don't want you to feel like I'm ignoring advice, because I'm not. Your words have been so helpful, and I've reread this thread countless times in moments of weakness. The therapy is really helping and I feel pretty positive in moving on from this. I haven't tried to contact him in a week. I posted on here today because I was having a wobbly moment. I don't mean to throw everything back in your face. I am listening and grateful.

OP posts:
spidergurl · 27/10/2015 17:21

Thanks, thestamp. It's going to be really useful, to remind myself that my body is playing tricks on my mind - and I have the power to ignore it.

OP posts:
stardusty5 · 27/10/2015 17:25

Take the power and DO NOT TEXT HIM. He thinks he knows you oh so well. He thinks he just has to click his fingers and you'll come running. He thinks you're going to be going out of your mind obsessing about him. He thinks you're desperate.

Even if that's how you feel, show him it's not true. Show him that you don't accept this shit from anyone, let alone 40 year olds who frequent skate parks Hmm

Then arrange to do something nice with some friends. Absolutely do not 'accidentally' go somewhere you think he might be.

Fake it til you make it. It really works. Been there.

Offred · 27/10/2015 17:35

Have just RTFT...

I knew you deleted the number and didn't block because you wanted to hear from him and re initiate all this drama...

But what is his point? Why send me such a weak message after that long?

Because he can. Because he knows that he has you on the hook. Because he has been enjoying ignoring you and he knows that 2 weeks is enough time but not too much.

And as for; I was considering initiating a purely sexual relationship with him. What do you think?

Hmm are you actually just enjoying this drama? Everything you are doing in relation to him is about desperately keeping it going. The fact there is loads of drama in this 'relationship' does not make it a great love story. It simply makes you a glutton for punishment with a death wish and him a total knobend...

BLOCK HIM. Do not reply. Delete everything again.

saltlakecity · 27/10/2015 17:42

Offred. Some people do love the drama don't they. Others never seem to have drama in their lives (because they have calm, sensible lives? )

Offred · 27/10/2015 17:42

I suspect if you persevere with the therapy you will likely discover all this is actually about your father and the reason you can't let this one go so easily is actually because you have issues relating to abandonment by your dad.

exWifebeginsat40 · 27/10/2015 17:44

oh sweet jesus.

MairzyDoats · 27/10/2015 18:09

Haven't posted yet, just lurked, but for the love of God, PLEASE block his number. And then feel smug that you're not the silly little worthless plaything he believes you are. And FGS, proper grown ups don't hang out in skateparks. He's got a pathetic Peter Pan complex.

Jux · 27/10/2015 18:22

Don't, spider. You know exactly how that will work.

He is a master manipulator. You are not. He will win. You will be posting exactly the same thing on MN as you are now.

KKCupCakes · 27/10/2015 18:25

Ecky thump honey, I did indeed read to the end! I think you need to chalk this up to experience and totally forgive yourself. You're really being way too hard on yourself. I get that there was chemistry there, but really this sounds like a mahoosive heart ache narrowly avoided TBH and I think you're actually better off well out of it, some chemistry is explosive you know! I would dust yourself off and fall in love with yourself all over again before you even consider dating (I speak from experience) xxxx

NumbBlaseCold · 27/10/2015 18:52

I was considering initiating a purely sexual relationship with him. What do you think?

Monumentally bad idea.

You liked him a lot.

You had feelings for him.

You did not block him because a part of you hoped he would contact with apologies and things would become good again.

He has texted you a weak and minimal excuse to see if you will be weak and jump at the minimal contact eagerly.

And if you do reply then he knows he has you.

spidergurl · 27/10/2015 22:33

I ended up replying. I'm such a total fucking IDIOT

OP posts: