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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

I have destroyed my own tangled web of confusion

191 replies

spidergurl · 11/10/2015 18:11

WARNING: This is going to be long, so thank you very much to whoever reads all the way through. And please make sure you're comfy before you start ;-)

I (20s) met him (40s, let's call him Tom) last November. We went out together twice and even though I liked him, our chemistry was amazing and the kissing wonderful, I was going through some kind of existential crisis in which I was questioning everything about my life, and I vanished from his. Poor, I know.

In July, I felt I was getting back on track and moved to his part of town. After eight months of zero romance, not even so much as a kiss, I had met another guy who I had very casually started seeing. Yet I sent Tom a message apologising for having disappeared and asked if I could buy him a drink.
I was beginning to feel better about life and I was enjoying getting back into dating. That same night, I went back to his house and slept with him. It was wonderful and I was reminded just how much this guy made me laugh, just how well we clicked. That morning as we were having breakfast, he got a text, which he ignored, then a call, which he ignored, then his doorbell rang, and when he ignored THAT there was the sound of a key in the door. He rushed down to 'sort it out'. Turns out he'd been seeing this married woman (had given her a key to go to the shop and back the week previously and had forgotten she still had it). At this stage I wasn't emotionally involved with him and could offer him some advice and an ear. I asked whether he loved her, and he said 'it's not that simple'.

Our relationship progressed nicely over the next two or three weeks. It was now early August. I was still seeing the other guy, too. Things with both had progressed to the stage where I didn't think it was right to be seeing two men anymore. I spoke to both of them individually about it, and Tom was pissed off that I'd been continuing to see this other guy. Personally I felt that we didn't feel like a couple and it was such early days that there wasn't much wrong with dating other people - especially since there was the married woman scenario, which sort of made me think him a little hypocritical.
From early August to early September, we continued seeing each other twice a week. We loved spending time together, never a dull moment, so in sync with each other. But I should mention that this is set against a backdrop of quite a lot of alcohol consumed (both of us), and very regular cocaine use (him). As soon as I started to feel emotionally involved, I started 'acting up', by which I mean I became oversensitive and started walking off on a regular basis. I suppose deep inside I was insecure about where we stood. Every now and then when his phone would go off near me, I'd instinctively look down and see he'd received a message from the married woman. Obviously I never read the messages, and he reassured me that she'd moved and they were just friends (he did see her at a festival in August, and there was the niggling thing of....a friend who texts at 8 in the morning?), but that coupled with the sometimes offhand way I felt he could be (maybe the coke?) resulted in me storming off for almost no reason fairly often. I just felt unsure and insecure, and like he didn't take me seriously, and I'm not sure why, when he was so tender with me and we had such a good time together. One time for seemingly no good reason, I started crying and said 'I wonder if I made the right decision, to stop seeing that other guy'. I suppose I didn't like the sometimes too casual way he would act with me. After I said that I calmed down, we went to the pub, and he left me there after an hour and wouldn't answer my calls.

In early September, the final straw came. He invited me round to his, I felt he was being a little standoffish and 'lazy' with me, and without warning I jumped out of the bed in the middle of the night and left. As I left I told him I wasn't an app, I didn't want to sit around just being someone's narcissistic mirror, as that's what it sometimes felt like. I left and received a text from him saying he couldn't take the drama, that this was the 6th time I'd done this to him and he couldn't take it anymore. I didn't hear from him for 10 days.

I suppose this would be a good point to mention that I'm starting to realise one of the main problems is that we were viewing 'us' in two different ways. We never spoke about what we were, or had. And I'm starting to think that he saw me as his girlfriend, whereas I was convinced we were just 'seeing' each other (I would have wanted more). I'm not sure why we had these two different views of it, but I think that was one problem. From my perspective, the fact that we rarely met during the day, and that we'd never had a full day together (we'd go out together, have sex, wake up, have breakfast, then one or the other would leave) didn't make me feel like we were in a proper full-on relationship.

The 10 days of silence from him passed. The final day was a Sunday. I had given up hope. I was devastated. I couldn't stop thinking about him and how I'd fucked things up. So I made a really stupid mistake. In a desperate attempt to make myself feel better, I created a Tinder profile on Sunday afternoon. I don't know what I was thinking, I didn't even think I'd use it. I'm sure a lot of women here can relate: my logic was I could dull the pain of one man's rejection with the comfort of another. I don't think I was going to act on it. But I think I had to feel like I was doing something to get control over myself again. I felt heartbroken. That same afternoon, I went out with some friends. In one last final attempt to reach out, I texted him that what we were doing was great, and I just wished he could be there with me to share it. To my total amazement, he replied. He suggested we go to his local for dinner that night.

When I arrived at the pub, he was completely off with me. Talking to anyone but me and actively making me feel uncomfortable (pretending not to hear me, getting me to repeat myself, etc.). I was confused as I thought he wanted to make up. I grit my teeth and did my best to chat away with his mates, who I like. At closing time, he walked me home and we sort of had it out.

He said I had abandonment issues and needed therapy (he has a point). He told me I couldn't just relax without his undivided attention (true, but only because I felt the whole relationship was an insecure environment). He said a lot of other things that resonated with me.

And then: he pulled his phone out his pocket and said "And I saw -". And then stopped. I said "saw what?" and he said it didn't matter. We walked back to his. He said I "scared" him. He said he was sure he was just a transient thing for me. I denied that. The next morning when I got back home, I deleted my Tinder account.

Since that night, one month ago, I took everything he said on board. I started therapy. I tried to completely turn my attitude around and it worked. We've had a month of great times, although I did feel he was slightly more pulled back now, warier. I just thought I would have to regain some trust, and accepted that. It became left up to me to organise all of our meetings. I think he wanted to see me "work for it", if you get me. So I did. We did non-booze related things together. It was brilliant. He said "I adore you" and "I think about you all the time". And I feel, felt, the same. I love every minute I spend with him. He makes me happy. He makes me laugh, he makes me feel supported and protected. This Friday he sent me a text at 11pm inviting me round to his for cocktails, but I was shattered. I suggested we go down to the sea the following day (Saturday). And so yesterday I texted him at 5pm asking if he wanted to meet in an hour. No reply. Two hours later he called, jovial, said he was at the skate park, etc. I was a bit gutted as I thought we'd be going down to the beach together, but invited him to join me and my mates at our local later.

When he arrived at the pub last night, he was clearly off with me. Didn't even come over and greet me. Spoke to everyone but me. Got up from the table when I started a story, you get the idea. I tried to shrug it off and focus on his mates and mine. At closing time, me and my mate went back to his for drinks, but he was still being passive aggressive with me, not communicating, not smiling, despite having invited me back (??). When we got in, I let some little catty aside out, mainly at the frustration of having just spent 6 hours basically being ignored by the man I so care about. He went apeshit. I couldn't even finish a sentence. He was steamrolling all over me. He said it was bullshit how I only asked him to go down to the sea at 5pm, when he'd been waiting all day (I just wanted to go for dusk - I would have thought he'd initiate a text if he wanted to go earlier). He called me manipulative. He called me desperate for male attention (I'm not a flirt, I don't act or dress provocatively at all, so I can only assume he means talking to his mates - which I would have thought any guy would appreciate it). He called me emotionally abusive. Then the real slap came: "And I saw your fucking Tinder profile".
Wow. That profile had been online for 16 hours only, a month ago. I said so he must have been on Tinder too. He said "just keeping tabs on you". We didn't meet online, by the way. I began to feel panic and regret. It was impossible to get him to understand my reasoning for having that profile up. I couldn't get him to understand it had been up there for only 16 hours. He seemed convinced I was sleeping with other men. I told him I hadn't slept with anyone else since July. But he was getting louder and louder and less and less willing to hear me. Finally, he told me to fuck off and all but frog marched me out of his house. He told me to get lost and said he would discuss things another time.

I'm so upset. I feel like I've really fucked this up, but there are so many things I don't understand. I don;t know how to fix it. I tried calling him once this morning (went to voicemail). Then I sent a massive text telling him we needed to have an honest conversation where we get everything out on the table. I said I felt like our relationship had started with mistrust because we were both seeing other people at the start, and we needed to have a frank discussion about everything so we could nip this in the bud instead of always hiding away from it, whether with socialising/drink, or me storming off, or him throwing me out. No reply.

I'm hurt, I don't know what to do now, I can't bear the thought of such good potential going to waste. I haven't felt so in tune with someone in a long time, but what the hell am I going to do about this now?

I needed to write all this down. If you've read this far, thanks again. If you could give me any outsider insight that would be very appreciated. I should point out that I realise the drinking and his drug use are NOT conducive to healthy behaviour - I do know that and it should be something that changes.

Why was he on Tinder? As I said, it was up for 16 hours: that's quite a stroke of luck, isn't it, to log on to Tinder in the small 16-hour window in which it was visible? Why would he wait a full month, holding on to that Tinder profile thing? How could he spend time with me and be tender with me to suddenly lose it over this information he's been guarding? What pisses me off is how he started this fight after a month when I'd really been trying and things were going so well. He may have complained about my walking off in a strop, but his way of completely shutting down (not reply to me) is also very distressing and a little controlling.

Ultimately - do you think I've fucked this up beyond all repair? Obviously you don't know the guy - but what the hell could his POV be? How could he be feeling? Do you think I've behaved badly? Obviously I know I have - I'm just not sure it warrants this explosiveness and 'punishing'. Do you think he feels mistrustful of me? Does he not give a shit? I just can't tell, I don't know what's true anymore.

OP posts:
RunRabbitRunRabbit · 15/10/2015 22:14

He won't give you closure. You have to make it for yourself.

spidergurl · 15/10/2015 22:23

"He won't give you closure"

But why not! Surely for his own peace of mind (and peace and quiet) he would want to.

Anyway I'm not going to reach out anymore. If only because I have too much pride to go any further than I already have. It just makes me feel confused and adrift.

OP posts:
spidergurl · 15/10/2015 22:24

Gatewalker thank you for writing this. I feel as if you've seen right into me. You must have had a pretty rough experience yourself. I'll be holding on to your message and re-reading in moments of weakness.

OP posts:
spidergurl · 15/10/2015 22:28

Why would you rather have to ignore calls when you've been told you can simply text "it's over". I know I won't get any answers guys, I'm just ranting 'out loud'. This feels cruel. In a way it might be good. I'm starting to feel much more angry than heartsick.

OP posts:
spidergurl · 15/10/2015 22:36

This weekend I've got a lot of good creative stuff planned. I think I'm going to delete his number. At least then I'll feel a bit more control over the situation.

OP posts:
uglyswan · 15/10/2015 22:40

OP, he won't give you closure because he enjoys withholding things from you - affection, security, attention - he gets off on doing that. Don't give him that power. And as a former high-drama twentysomething, here's one thing I've found out. Other people can't give you closure, even if they want to. As Rabbit says, you have to make it for yourself.

I'm sorry, you've made some really terrible choices with this manipulative loser (not to mention the drink and the drugs and the drama). But you can close this dismal chapter of your life yourself. Re-read the excellent advice you've been given here. Get yourself some therapy. And look forward to the time when all this will simply be a distant cringey memory. I promise you, it will.

springydaffs · 15/10/2015 22:52

Let this be a wake-up call - abstinence from shitty, lacerating, high drama men who get off on jerking you around. Xx

MissStressBum · 15/10/2015 23:08

OP, deleting and blocking his number will be the best decision ever. When I had a shitty, unhealthy relationship that kept exploding into drama, the only way to move on was the cut him out totally. Giving him options to let you know he no longer wants a relationship is just giving him power to hurt you and use you. Empower yourself by making the decision to move on from him. You must give yourself the closure you desire by being strong.

spidergurl · 15/10/2015 23:14

I've deleted his number and all texts and messages from him so now have no way of contacting him and can't obsessively read back over stuff. Feel a little sad but a bit more settled too.

OP posts:
WanderingTrolley1 · 15/10/2015 23:23

He used

WanderingTrolley1 · 15/10/2015 23:24

He used you.

You can do better. Move on.

gatewalker · 15/10/2015 23:59

(((( spider ))))

Yes, I've been there. It was a rough experience. Well - actually - both were rough experiences. I guess I didn't get it all the first time round.

They have been my biggest teachers, both of those men. And I love them still. But they taught me that I can love them, and love myself more; and loving myself more meant loving myself enough to break away from them. It has been a slow process of 'two steps forward, one step back'.

Thing is, when you do that enough times, one day you're permanently one step ahead :)

Castrovalva · 16/10/2015 00:00

Because it feels like I love him

And that right there is something you need to take into therapy. Why does toxic drama feel like love to you? What sort of dynamic did you grow up with that thought you this?

It isn't love. But You know that, Don't you.

Once you can recognise that, you can start to explore what a loving relationship actually DOES look like (hint - no drama)

I'm 20 years older than you and have only just managed to start to unpick the difference, after a lot of fucked up shit.

And loose thAt 'but I NEEEED closure. I jus want him to TALK to meeeee' shite. That's just the fucked up drama lama that's a parasite inside of you shouting when it thinks you are trying to kill it off. Hit it with a shovel and bury it in the desert. I know. I had one too :)

mathanxiety · 16/10/2015 00:03

^^This.

Iflyaway · 16/10/2015 00:09

You have been given excellent advice here, so no need for me to expand on it.
Suffice to say I've been there too.

Well done for taking the first step of extricating yourself from this toxic situation.

You know, there's really no point in racking your brain and wasting your energy in wondering why he acts the way he does.

Because he's a coke head and that will always be uppermost in his mind.
Attractive, eh, in your 40.s....? Hmm

All the guys I knew who got heavily into coke turned from lovely guys into complete selfish nasty assholes. You are just asking for a life of misery when you get involved in that kind of lifestyle.

daddyorchipsdaddyorchips · 16/10/2015 14:48

Two words: skate park.

Seriously, get a grip and DO NOT give any more head space to this utter loser of a man.

And you need to have a word with yourself. You sound like proper hard work mate.

mum2mum99 · 16/10/2015 15:06

dependency for you. Get over him he is a waste of space. And do not look back. Asked yourself how you want to be treated and settle for no less.

Weefreelassie2 · 16/10/2015 16:01

Don't think you are alone in this situation at all, honestly. And it gets better.

I too was involved with an arse of a bloke who could have been your ex partners soul twin, if the buggers had a soul ,that is !
The relationship was painful, the break up worse even though it was me who ended it but now I look back and see all that he did and that he was a waste of my tears, time and energy. Except that I learned from it and worked though it and now I have a healthy relationship that makes me happy. I needed the comparison to be able to tell the difference though, as emotionally abuse relationships were a pattern and had a root cause .

This too shall pass .

And if buggerlugs comes running , be strong and walk away . If he is persistent, then have a chat with the police as it may fall into the harassment category . My ex harassed me once he realised I had slipped off his hook, and a wee visit from the local constabulary put a stop to that leaving me free to heal and move on . Therapy acessed through my GP helped enormously .

One day you will look back on this and realise how far you've come and see with real clarity how toxic and manipulative this relationship is .

Good luck and warm hugs !

Lassie

AtrociousCircumstance · 16/10/2015 16:23

I've been there too OP: addictive destructive older man, endless booze and his drug use...

It is an addiction, not love. The highs and lows are exhilarating and a distraction from the real issues you have that need your attention.

Probably focused on your unavailable dad, who let you down badly.

Reassure yourself: it's not love and you haven't fucked anything up. The relationship you have with him (periods of excitement and then punishing withdrawal) is the only one possible. There is no potential here. There is no other type of relationship possible.

And by the way, as you no doubt know, "I adore you," does not mean "I love you".

It will feel hard to completely disengage, like a come-down, like wading through drab grey lifelessness and loneliness, but it won't be either - it will be you moving closer to everything that you really need. And that low feeling won't last long. You'll feel so proud of yourself.

Good luck and hang in there Flowers

Lndnmummy · 16/10/2015 16:24

op, it is too much. Way too much. You are in your 20s. He is 40 and still living/acting as if he is your age. Move on OP

AtrociousCircumstance · 16/10/2015 16:25

Ps clarification: the relationship you have with him is the only one possible with him.

A real relationship with someone else is very very possible.

Jux · 16/10/2015 17:08

Over the course of this thread, you have moved on a fair bit, spider! Well done for that Star

Keep moving in that direction, don't look back as there's nothing you want there.

You have much time ahead of you to make your life what you want it to be. The first little bit of it, now, won't be that easy, but get over this hump and you'll be flying.

Have a great life, spider, you can make it!

stoppingbywoods · 16/10/2015 17:54

Good for you OP Flowers

NumbBlaseCold · 16/10/2015 18:47

I understand the need for closure but you will never get it.

Even if he told you his motives- which are as people have said, to control you- you will not find closure because you won't understand them.

You won't understand them because they aren't your motives, you'll just wonder why and how and what if.

Even when people know why a relationship has broken down, or why a spouse has justified betrayal or cheating, or why they are being broken up with...it still doesn't give closure.

Instead it just brings more questions.

SmallLegsOrSmallEggs · 16/10/2015 19:20

Well done for deleting.

The reason he wouldn't give you closure is he gains nothing by doing it.

Swipe left for the next trending thread