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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

He's not a bastard but he's behaved like he is. Confused.

875 replies

ComeDownToMe · 12/09/2015 12:55

DP and I have been together nearly 2 years. We live together and it's great. We get on fantastically, he's witty, engaging, kind, supportive. The sex is amazing and we enjoy each other's company.

It started out as a casual relationship and I had a lot stronger feelings for him than he did me. But we ended up spending a lot more time together and grew a lot closer and our relationship turned serious.

The thing is one of my closest friends recently discovered her DH (now STBXH) was cheating on her and I've seen at first hand how broken she has been. Her ex has been an utter cunt and makes my blood boil.

My DP cheated on his then wife and she slung him out so I know everything I've said about my friend's ex I could equally say about my DP. I didn't feel good about this before but it's even worse now.

Can men really compartmentalise to such a degree they don't think about how much hurt they would cause someone they love.

I will probably be criticised for this and rightly so but I wasn't particularly judgemental on men having affairs before as long as no one got hurt. Now I've seen the hurt it feels a bit different.

I don't think of my DP as a bastard but he's done a lot worse than my friend's ex and I've called my friend's ex every name under the fucking sun.

How do I resolve this in my own mind.

OP posts:
summerwinterton · 17/09/2015 10:48

If you accept he is a bastard, you have to accept that you played a part in his awful behaviour. And that is a bitter pill to swallow about yourself.

Duckdeamon · 17/09/2015 10:54

What a charmer he is. He assumed he would get away with all the cheating and that his wife was too thick/trusting to find out. was very angry with his wife for becoming suspicious and looking at his phone. And about being kicked out: presumably his wish was to have his cake and eat it. Under the guise of this somehow being the best thing for the DC!

Of course his relationship with eldest DC is strained! Shitty, selfish parenting.

You say having DC isn't a priority for you: but was it an option in your mind before this relationship? this man is a shit bet to have DC with and clearly not worth giving up the prospect of motherhood for (if that's what you want, if not fair enough).

Of course things are good between you now: he has a younger, higher earning partner with a nice home, willing to ignore his past behaviour and do most of the domestic work to boot! Wonder if he'd stick with you long term if you earned less, had a child or became fat or ill.

Of course he wants to marry you: the risk is almost all on your side!

WhereYouLeftIt · 17/09/2015 10:55

Please OP, use the fresh eyes your friend's devastation have granted you, and look again at all the things you are accepting as gospel. Try to review things he has said to you from a neutral standpoint, applying no judgement or emotions, just logic.

Something that has jumped out at me - money. Two things you've posted, the source of which can only have come from him:

  1. "I couldn't care less what he earns. He's self employed and doesn't pay himself too much because he doesn't need to."
  1. "He's not paying himself any less than he did while they were married. He has been financially responsible towards his family. He's not tried to screw her over."

When you say 'he doesn't pay himself too much', what do you mean? Do you mean he doesn't earn much, or that what he earns is somehow retained by the business? Not knowing the nature of his self-employment, it's difficult to know. So the scenarios I could think of are:

If he had set himself up as a limited company, it is tax-efficient to take a smallish wage as an employee of the company, and a larger dividend as a director of the company. But wage or dividend, it's all income to the same person.

If he is a sole trader/contractor such as a plumber or an IT professional, to pay himself a small amount he either has to charge his customers not very much per hour, or not work many hours. You've said he's a workaholic, so (assuming all those hours he says he's working he actually is working) it would have to be that he doesn't charge very much. Why would he do that? Only two possibilities - 1. Charitable, or 2. People would not pay any more for his work (artist/musician/just not very good at whatever he does?)

Now the second half - ' because he doesn't need to'. (And from the second statement above, he 'didn't need to' throughout the marriage either.) That's such a loaded statement. We all need to earn enough to pay the bills, keep a roof over our head, food on the table, clothes on our backs. It's one thing to not be materialistic, it's quite another to not provide for your family. He was a workaholic, not pulling his weight domestically - AND he wasn't even bringing home the bacon from all those hours working Confused. Generally people choose to earn less (by working less) to have more time with their family, but as a workaholic that wasn't the case here.

Can you see the lack of logic, OP? Especially in the earlier years, children are expensive. A bigger home than you'd otherwise need, a bigger car, food, toys, clothes and shoes constantly being outgrown, school uniform - my god they're expensive! If you're in control of how much you earn, you maximise it, because it's tough enough raising children without being poor to boot.

So think about it OP. You termed it as 'paying himself' rather than 'earning'. Again, loaded words. 'Paying himself' is about choice and control. It's one thing to make that choice for yourself, quite another to impose your choice on your dependants. Is it really his choice to work so many hours for such poor reward? And if it is, why is that? Because I can see no reason at all. I think you need to dig a little deeper here.

ToGoBoldly · 17/09/2015 10:55

"I do feel so guilty for hurting innocent people. I hate myself for being the sort of person who's caused my friend so much devastation."

But the OW in your friend's situation did not cause the devastation, the partner did. You did not cause the devastation in your situation, the partner did. You were a bit part player, but if it wasn't you it would have been someone else. You're focussing the blame on everyone except the one who actually cheated, which is how you then come to the completely illogical conculsion of "But I don't want to leave him, he's really great with me and I really do love him"

SevenSeconds · 17/09/2015 10:58

OP I can understand it's hard to finish it. After all, many of the women on here struggle to leave an unfaithful / abusive partner, so it's not surprising that it's hard for you to think about leaving when yours hasn't even been unfaithful to you yet but only to someone else who you don't know very well. It's all a bit abstract isn't it?

Maybe it would help to think about his current selfishness, as well as the huge issue of his past infidelity. Do you really want to be with someone 20 years older than you? I have a friend who reluctantly ended a good relationship for this reason alone. Do you really want to waste your fertile years on someone who doesn't want to have kids with you? Wouldn't you prefer to be with someone who spoke about his ex graciously and pulled his weight around the house?

Look, you've been together for 2 years. It's fine for the first couple of years to be about fun and sex, but now is a good time to start thinking more seriously about whether this is the man for you in the longer term.

And if you do leave, please promise yourself you'll never, ever have an affair with a married man again.

Duckdeamon · 17/09/2015 10:58

If he's self employed and not earning much does he have reasonable pension provision (after what's agreed for his ex)? Or is his plan also for you to subsidise and care for him in his future retirement?

Duckdeamon · 17/09/2015 11:02

Why WOULDN'T you care about money stuff? What sensible woman wouldn't?

Has he by any chance said or implied things about financially grasping women / exes?

ToGoBoldly · 17/09/2015 11:06

Yea if you do nothing else in your blind love, make sure you keep a firm hold of your own finances

RandomSocks · 17/09/2015 11:13

Hoppipolar I also believe that people can change, and the people who had an affair in the past can build character and become steadfast.

However, it doesn't sound as though OP's DP has changed, or even that he has expressed a willingness to change. He doesn't see what he did to his wife as wrong, and therein lies the danger for OP.

RandomSocks · 17/09/2015 11:16

I missed loads of posts.

I couldn't tell my partner whatever excuse he used knowing I was going off to have sex with someone else.

Maybe you couldn't, op, but your dp has demonstrated that he can.

WakeUp9 · 17/09/2015 11:18

I had to register simply to ask, how has NO ONE noticed this is Sid's not so choosy floozy posting? More likely, someone reading and copying I washappy's threads.

Look at the posts through the thread. She is having to hint harder and harder to get you all to realise. First, ages and dates and situations. Length of marriage etc. No mention of being the OW. Reluctantly admitting it at last. Then, after everyone still failed to get it, stronger hints about his serial adultery, not mentioned to start with. Then the the flat and the houses. Can't marry because divorce not quite through. Finally, the hint that she has cleared out for a few days for him to have time with his child at their new house.

I think you're all wasting a lot of time with this one and giving someone a lot of fun.

ToGoBoldly · 17/09/2015 11:20

Who is Sid?

BathtimeFunkster · 17/09/2015 11:20

No, a few of us clocked it almost straight away.

Given the dodgy happenings around the original Sid thread, I think there are many of us that are taking this with a massive pinch of salt.

It's still fun, though.

UnderTheGreenwoodTree · 17/09/2015 11:22

I wondered if this was for real actually. There's something not quite right about this.

ToGoBoldly · 17/09/2015 11:24

Ah right. If it is real then it's depressing that someone is that deluded, if it's not, kudos for the effort.

RandomSocks · 17/09/2015 11:25

The sex is mind blowing and he is very charming and pays me a lot of attention. He does make me feel good and we haven't had a major disagreement.

Affair sex is exciting, even intoxicating. I think you may still be in the affair bubble. How long will that last and what happens when your relationship becomes normal?

Does the two years that you say you are together include the affair? How long have you actually lived together? Did he move in with you after his wife threw him out? That would worry me a bit.

BathtimeFunkster · 17/09/2015 11:25

It's the mirror thread of a long running series of affair recovery threads, but this one is written from the OW's perspective.

Everything matches up, right down to the wife not finding out about the repeated infidelities until after affair with most recent OW was discovered.

RandomSocks · 17/09/2015 11:28

Ah. Boots and all that, as well as self-employment. Well-spotted, WakeUp. I was had.

ToGoBoldly · 17/09/2015 11:30

Can they post on eachother's threads? That would be more fun...

TheStoic · 17/09/2015 11:36

Gosh, that's cruel, OP.

Iwashappy is a real person.

BathtimeFunkster · 17/09/2015 11:41

Well, people believe she is a real person.

But her first thread was deleted for containing more than a few porkie pies.

Now we have this very obvious "reverse" thread...

ToGoBoldly · 17/09/2015 11:46

Well I hope their getting paid, it would be a shame to make so much effort purely for the entertainment of seeing people state the obvious about a scenario which could be real even if it isn't.

YouBastardSockBalls · 17/09/2015 11:51

I thought this all seemed familiar! Couldn't understand why the OP kept coming back for more kickings.

Sadly, there probably is a real affair at the heart of all this.

ScrambledSmegs · 17/09/2015 11:54

The correct thing to do, if you have suspicions, is to report and not raise it on the thread.

I'm pretty sure that's what an awful lot of people have done Wink

AndDeepBreath · 17/09/2015 12:58

I would love this to be a troll thread, please let that be the case. Would actually cheer. No one is this deluded, no one.