Husband's affair - Tom is moving on

[tomatoplantproject]

I took a break from mumsnet for a little while. It has been an eventful little while. Mumsnet keeps breaking and I'm sorry but I can't link my previous threads.

My husband had an affair with an Italian, I found out over 2 months ago. I kicked him out and since then have been trying to rebuild my life whilst keeping things stable for my little girl. I have an amazing family and friends who have been looking out for me.

We have had various discussions since I found out and have been seeing a Relate counsellor. Various posters have been warning me to be wary given how he has been behaving.

He was due to go to Spain last week on his own for a holiday - he cancelled at the very last minute after I asked him not to go and has been spending time with dd and I. Things were starting to thaw between us and we were building at least a friendship.

I had a job interview this evening and he did dd's bedtime routine for me. When I came home he sat me down and told me he was going to be honest with me. He has been in touch with the Italian Job since I found out, and they were due to go to Spain to see if they had a long term future. He pulled out on the Sunday after I asked him not to go.

I won't ever trust him ever again, and he hasn't put me first or respected my wishes that he is not in touch with her. So I am done. Once and for all. I can now move on.

You were all right. I just wasn't ready to believe you.

Sadly it does indeed look as if Tom is still thinking of reconciling with her husband. What's coming across is the same message we were hearing before she knew about the holiday, and now the bank account, and I'm of the same opinion as Blood - just take him back and get on with the future.

I'm sorry if that sounds harsh but I'm in a busy departure lounge.

Xxxxx

I too think if you decide now you might get back with him, you are also deciding not to have any more children.

And Christina is spot on. Tom really doesn't know how twisted and screwed up her husband is.

Do you know what is so compelling. It is the opportunity for being a family, having more children, dd growing up with brothers and sisters. That is his hook. Giving that up is what makes me cry.

His behaviour for months and months and months is such a headfuck. And last night I was in such a good place and physically felt beaten down when he said all those things.

I'm also a sucker for someone in a bad way. I can't walk past when I see someone struggling. I was sat last night with one part of me going "here we go again" and the other part wishing I could take his pain away.

Its like walking up a hill with a heavy backpack. Just as I think I've got there, found a resolution, I turn round the corner and there's another steep climb.

Part of my problem is that I'm really good at climbing up hills.

What blood said about what the next few months would be like if we got back together has helped enormously. It won't work. I don't think I'll ever be properly carefree with him in the way that I have been in the past.

If you get back together and have some more babies...what are they going to learn, growing up? What will they see in your relationship?

You could dump this selfish, arrogant wanky little fuckwit - and find someone that's decent, who shares your values and who will really share with you this big happy family you dream of. Instead of attempting this with someone who will always put himself first.

"I'm also a sucker for someone in a bad way. I can't walk past when I see someone struggling."

Tom, that's a lovely thing to say, and it shows you value your own ability to care for and nurture others, but the person struggling and in a bad way is you. Direct your care where it is most needed and deserved.

You can have that. The perfect nuclear family idea is a fallacy. Yes it exists, of course, but the majority of people either end their marriage when it has outlived itself or stay in an unhappy marriage they are incapable or unable to change. Not all, the majority when asked. Don't be one of the latter. That seems to me the saddest option.

I can't imagine how much worse it would be to get pregnant again by this man, be that vulnerable to someone you couldn't trust, to be at home again while he is off 'providing' for the family wherever he wants, doing what/who ever he wants, all the time your reliance on him increasing.

I think you need to turn your natural compassion round onto yourself. He IS NOT IN A BAD WAY! No more than a crying screaming child is when they have been punished for something awful they've done. He is deep down furious and afraid and guilty and frustrated. That's very very different. It is YOU who is in a bad way. You have been betrayed, fucked around, lied to, further betrayed, belittled and damaged massively through no fault of your own. It is you who deserves this compassion you describe. This means being kind to yourself and not putting yourself in positions where you are available to be manipulated and hurt by him and his self-pity. If he really cared about you he would be managing all that himself and using the last few months to care for you in your pain and confusion, not breaking down like a twat because he gave up going on a romantic holiday with another woman for nothing. Twat.

Your image of a backpack makes it sound like you have a tendency to embrace burden. Be careful that is not why you are drawn to him. What happens if you put the burden down and start climbing for yourself? This is why you need to go to individual counselling. Your vulnerability to him is quite a specific thing and you need to explore that, whichever route you take.

When I suggested that you take some time Tom I meant before you actually start the legal proceedings, having - as I thought - made the decision to finally end things. That you had in fact told him that. If I got that wrong, I apologise.

I just think that you need to be a bit stronger emotionally before getting into the headfuck that is divorce. Just a little while to set up all the things you have talked of doing. Getting your new life sorted. I also get the feeling, from what you say, that he is coming to the house more than is perhaps good for you. I realise that's for DD's sake, but it's creating a false illusion, for all of you. Of course, if you are still considering reconciliation it doesn't matter.

He cheats on you, lies to you, manipulates you, grinds you into the dust with the constant unsettling sense that things are very wrong - all while you are the main emotional ballast to his child - and then when his affair is revealed persuades you to keep trying, and then it turns out he was playing eeny, meeny, miny, mo... and he thinks that he is the one in pain? And has convinced you of this, to the point you "want to take his pain away"? HIS pain? Seriously?!

Fast forward thirty years. Your DD is in this scenario. A man is doing this to her. Tell me, what is your view of him? And how likely is it that he will be a good father?

The sooner you move on, the sooner you can meet one of the lovely men who DO exist, who ARE out there, and who will share your dream of the happy, relaxed, engaging family you so hope for. He can't, won't, and doesn't. This is a sunk costs fallacy - you've invested heavily in the dream of this future and now you know what he's like, you don't want to accept that a dream was all it was. So you're considering throwing good love after bad.

I think your h is going to have a real crisis when the reality hits him. You will have to walk past him then. You can't save him.

Do you know what is so compelling. It is the opportunity for being a family, having more children, dd growing up with brothers and sisters. That is his hook. Giving that up is what makes me cry.

Tom, your husband was having an affair while you were undergoing medical procedures. He was thinking about leaving you. Even last week he was half way to leaving you. Children don't really figure in his plans unless it suits him and to be honest to bring another child in to this mess would be unfair on the child because this isn't going to get any better.

And yes, turn your compassion onto yourself, save yourself, because if you wont no one else will.

I'm listening. You must all be so frustrated with me. I'm frustrated with me.

A little while ago I wrote a timeline for everything that happened and I haven't just made them up. I've been looking at it again. He truly has been awful. I really don't think I can ever trust him again regardless of what he does. I can't trust him to ever put me first.

I'm struggling with staying strong in the face of what he says to me. It feels like he just ups the ante - just as I make a decision and find some peace he says something which just yanks me back enough.

I was thinking the other day that I wouldn't tell him I was over until I felt a bit stronger and here I am, back in turmoil because I told him before ai was ready and I wasn't strong enough to face down his reaction.

I have a headache. I can't think any longer.

I have to get my head around letting go of more children. I am 38 next week and I've struggled with infertility already so its unlikely I will meet someone in time to have any more biological children. I don't want to put that kind of pressure on myself.

I'm going to tell you about my cat. We wanted a dog and mum started to keep her ears open for a pup for us. She then met a pup looking for a home, fell in love herself with it and we quickly realised how much work they are. So we agreed on a cat.

When dd was 6mo we decided now was time for a kitten so I went off and found a litter of moggies for sale, visited and chose a kitten. I wanted a girl and carefully examined them all to find the one for us. I had rejected early on a poorly looking boy.

I went outside to excitedly phone dh and tell him before I did the deal. He was busy at work and indifferent, so I took an executive decision, did the deal and went in to get my cat. All the kittens had changed place but I picked up the one I thought I had chosen.

You can guess the rest. I had picked up the poorly boy. He nearly died but I looked after him, took him to the vets, and he is now a lazy, enormous, furry boy who is currently curled up on my lap. I wouldn't change him for the world (although he gets beaten up by the local cats).

Dh never liked him and when he was tiny would bellow at him if he was being naughty. Puss has always been scared of him since then.

Whats silly is that he is beautifully behaved. He has only recently started getting his claws out with dd. she used to drag him across the floor by his tail and he would just look at me with his dopey eyes.

I've had cats growing up but I've never had one like him.

Cat sounds lovely. H not so much.

If H was going to be away for a week, why doesn't he back off and keep away for a week and therefore not see his DD at all.

Then you and DD and furry cat have a week to yourselves to heal and regroup.

Tell H you want this. And explain to DD that daddy is having a 'holiday'... which is what you would have told her I expect had his liason gone ahead.

I think you need a break from all this emotional blackmail and manipulation so you once again think straight.

^^^^^^^
And this is all you really wanted from your husband. Just his undying love, several noisy, happy children, and appreciation for being you.

I so wish you could have that Tom.

I'm also a sucker for someone in a bad way. I can't walk past when I see someone struggling. Don't be a sucker. He is doing all this struggling in front of you for a reason.

To continue this backpack analogy... It's very useful to be able to carry a heavy backpack up a steep mountain, if when you get to the top exhausted, it contains nourishing, healthy, important things - like food, a blanket for warmth, something to drink, a cushion to lay your head on. But if the backpack is full of things which make you uncomfortable, or harm you or hold you back - rotting food, itching powder and stinking bullshit, you ditch it.

He was pretending to struggle in front of you while he was planning his long term future with his girlfriend.

His struggling, his tears, his looking broken, his latest "realisation" - it's all the same old bullshit he's been giving you since D-Day.

You are right - he ups the ante every go around, but nothing actually changes.

You can't let the dream of future children keep you in this broken relationship.

WeeBirdie is right - it would be really unfair to bring another baby into this broken family any time in the next few years.

If having more children was the only consideration, the your best chance would be trying to meet someone new in a relationship that at least had a chance of being functional within your fertility window.

Oh Tom!

Your H is not a poorly Cat just in need of some TLC to restore him to the man you THINK you married.

While you were thinking he's 'got it' and wanted to work on your relationship, whatever it took, he was booking a romantic break for the OW. This was AFTER he had seen what the affair had done to you, not before, not in the midst of the subterfuge. This was AFTER his family knew what he'd done, AFTER he'd seen you distraught, AFTER counselling, AFTER you had told him what he needed to do...He was still arrogant enough to think he could 'drive' you.
He knows you are a sucker for tears and he's using them to control you now.
He was doing this while you were undergoing tests and procedures-the idea of another baby or your existing one were not enough to stop him before. The tears are anger that you are not playing his game and manipulation to your good heart.
I don't believe 'once a cheat always a cheat' but this guy really hasn't shown anything other than contempt for you and your marriage. He will always come first. You were so kick-ass last week and now you sound apathetic and waiting for the next kick in the guts from this bloke who only cries when his toys get taken away. Whatever you choose you will have support on MN, you are lovely and I hope you see your worth soon.

Tom, your cat sounds like the runt of the litter we acquired by accident after it fell from under the bonnet of my car, and it was only when one of the kids looked back to check if the gate had closed that he saw it lying on the road. Anyway, the cat was bloody bonkers, so bonkers that none of dared turn our back on it, and if you passed it in the hall you'd be wise to keep your back to the wall. Well, everyone that is except my youngest son who the cat was totally in tune with. A very big part of my sons autism is severe sensory issues and getting him to eat was very difficult, he lived on toast and ribena at one stage, so one day I put some Spaghetti Bolognese on a saucer and in desperation put it down beside him on the little rug he liked to sit on. Of course he pushed it away but that was when the cat went and sat down across from him - and pushed the saucer of dinner back towards him. My son looked at him and pushed the plate away again, only for the cat to push it back and sit there and just look at him as if to say - come on now, eat it, I have all day to sit here. And of course my son did eat it, in fact he then went on to eat if for 3 years morning, noon and night

The cat was even involved when we were toilet training him. My son was about 7, we'd take him to the loo every 15 minutes, and after a few days the cat would go in with us as well.

Then there was when my son would have his bath and the cat would sit on the end of the bath and run the tap for him, then when my son was in the bath the cat would run the tap again.

Im allergic to cats but I was quite happy to live on antihistamines for many years.

My dads borders collies also had a special bond with my son. Whenever we'd visit one of them would park itself inside the garden gate so my son couldn't try to get out, and when we'd be on walks along the bridle paths beside my house the dog would run on ahead and lie in wait for my son so he couldn't get too far in front of us. My son would run along the lanes without a care in the world and people coming the other way knew not to worry he was out of our sight because they knew Meg was just lying in wait round the corner for him like something out of Country File.

I've been doing a lot of thinking. The decision to leave him is the right one. I've been getting really panicky thinking about us having a future together - I felt so peaceful and full of hope the other day planning a future without him.

I need to stay away from conversations with him. Next weekend we have a long weekend with my parents and they can help me. My mum is no fan of his at all. They haven't been around this last month for various reasons but are all mine again if I need them from this weekend on.

X-post weebirdie

That has just brought a tear to my eye. Animals are amazing and its incredible that they just knew how to keep your little boy safe. Astonishing.

My parents had a lovely dog. My granny lived with them for the last couple of her months alive and this dog spent her whole time sitting next to her. Not wanting any fuss or attention but just keeping watch. It was like she knew how to help pitch in and care.

I felt so peaceful and full of hope the other day planning a future without him.

Hold on to that thought and lean on your folks just as they'd want you to

Glad you're listening to yourself, listening to that panic at the thought of staying with him. That's your "gut reaction" if you like, telling you what you know inside.

And a big Yes to staying away from conversations with him, they feck with your mind, men like him, with their manipulations and "steering" - how sinister is that.

I had a run in with my STBXH yesterday. It wasn't nice and I had a lovely reminder of his temper. From his later text I have no doubt that he thinks it's all my fault. I was unreasonable for not happily accepting another of his outrageous proposals. I think he'd lulled me into a false sense of security, in future it's Needs to Know basis only. I suggest the same to you, Tom. And be aware of Flying Monkeys. Google the term if you need to.

It's so very creepy that he was planning this holiday with ow.

Feeling peaceful and optimistic as you plan another new future without him is very telling.