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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

How to fix me...

903 replies

WaitWhatOh · 08/03/2015 17:46

I don't know where to start, except I know I need to say something or go crazy overthinking. I am struggling massively and pretending it's all fine. I feel so very very unimportant and somewhere around priority 257 on everyone's list. I know -how fucking needy I sound/am. DH is very busy. Works hard, always on the phone even on evenings/days off. Very stressed very important. Kind of pat me on the head attitude towards me. He's far too busy to do much with me, he is home only to work from home or sleep or eat. so I threw myself into activities and hobbies. Trying to keep busy but feeling desperately lonely underneath. Occasionally I attempt to say how I feel and get caught up in some row that always ends up being my fault and me apologising. That man can seriously sulk!! Today he gave me the lecture about being so needy, insecure and 'fucking mental' I needed to hear it apparently. :(
Despite thinking he's an arse for speaking to me quite like that I know he has a point. I am lonely I do want to spend more time with him and I do wish I was fabulously important to him and top of his list some days. What a shallow needy creature I am. What do I do... How do I feel better? how do I fix me?

OP posts:
WaitWhatOh · 17/04/2015 21:28

Yesterday was horrible.
I had to say no you can't come home yet. He had no idea really and was so very hurt. I hated feeling like such a bitch.
He then spent an evening sending me pictures of us together. Saying and pleading.
Promising.
Really hurting.
And it nearly killed me. It doesn't matter how many people think he's just saying all that... I don't know. This was probably the first time in twenty years he realised I could go.

This morning I woke to a 4am email of sorry and how he can fix it all.

And this evening a pissed off being alone text.
He's like WEEKS behind me on this thinking and sorting process.
After a few curt texts tonight I said I'm booking counselling and he had to show up and engage.
My theory being we either have a guideline and agreement to try one last time or he royally screws this up with his tantrums and arrogance and it comes back to bite him at divorce.

No I don't see it working but yes I will go. I don't feel quite so weak anymore. I've already 'left' in one sense, living apart, so bring this on. Let me underline my effort against his.
That possibly makes no sense to anyone else but. Important to me.

I also said tonight that for gods sake I haven't had ONE text free day in my head clearing time.

This took him back. He then apologised and said he didn't really realise, as his closest friend it was me he chose to text all the time. And that he would stop.

I felt awful again.
I say nothing about feeling awful out loud to him but oh I do.

OP posts:
pocketsaviour · 17/04/2015 21:59

Well done on telling him he can't come back yet Star

If you were really his closest friend he wouldn't treat you like he does.

I know you're dead set on couples counselling. Can I just say, be very very careful. Because he will sit there and charm the counsellor and be very persuasive and gaslight the fuck out of you, and it'll be back to "Oh how can we fix poor Wait".

Can you see a counsellor solo for at least a handful of sessions before going into joint counselling?

CharlotteCollins · 17/04/2015 22:35

I can see why you want to give it one more go, when he spouts crap says things like that.

Watch out that you don't become responsible for his change - if you have to watch out for signs of progress or earning signs of him slipping back to his old ways, then he's not taking responsibility and you will be blamed if things go wrong.

There is also the troubling question of how many "mistakes" you let him make in his quest to be a better husband.

There is a useful section in the Lundy Bancroft book about signs that show he's not changing. If you really want to do this, have a look at that.

cakedup · 17/04/2015 22:54

Maybe I'm an optimistic idiot but a part of me thinks that maybe he could change? Doesn't that ever happen? You are being very strong WaitWhatOh.

Newbiecrafter · 17/04/2015 23:13

Wait, you're being more than fair. All you're asking for is more time so you can think.
You're considering joint counselling and you've asked him to stop texting all the time.

You have done nothing that is awful. In fact you're giving him a chance which is more than most people would.

You should feel really proud of yourself. It does feel like you are in control and that you getting stronger with every post.

I wonder like cakedup, could he change? If he does think of you as his best friend, and you've quietly put up with his ways, could it be that this is the first time he's actually realised that he has taken you completely for granted and not been very nice to you. I'm probably being naive but no matter what, you are amazing!

Also agree with pocket that individual counselling could be a good idea for you too.

Take care
Xxx

Anniegetyourgun · 18/04/2015 09:30

could it be that this is the first time he's actually realised that he has taken you completely for granted and not been very nice to you

Apart from all the times she's tried to raise it and he's gone off into either a tantrum or a sulk, you mean?

He never listened before because he thought he didn't have to. Now he stands to lose something, he is considering what he has to do not to lose it. That is not the same as caring two fingers about another human being's feelings. The former is a change in behaviour, which nearly everyone can learn if they really want to. The latter is a fundamental change in outlook, I might almost say personality, and that cannot be learned overnight if ever.

Newbiecrafter · 18/04/2015 10:59

Annie, of course your right. I was being naive. Sorry.

CharlotteCollins · 18/04/2015 11:08

Quite, Annie.

That's reminded me the other thing I wanted to say last night. I realised after I gave my then H a second chance that he had only ever listened to me once, and that was when I told him I didn't want to be with him any more. Would I have to threaten that to get him to take me seriously in the future?

He realised that, too. Within weeks he was talking about it as though I had done it to manipulate him into changing, when a good, loving wife would accept him as he is. Therefore he was the big, gracious one and he was doing all the hard work and what was I going to do? Out for I not believe marriage was a two way street?

Meanwhile he hadn't even booked counselling.

I truly believe, Wait, that the only situation in which it is remotely possible that he will change is this: he completes an accredited perpetrator's course, while remaining out of the house and having no contact with you.

Of course, the chances of him doing that are vanishingly small, as is the chance of you believing that is a reasonable thing to ask, if you are anything like me.

Reread Lundy Bancroft. There's a metaphor of a tree, I think, which shows what him changing would look like and what it would involve.

CharlotteCollins · 18/04/2015 11:10

"Or did I" not believe

chocolatefingersandtoes · 19/04/2015 10:08

How are you doing OP?

cakedup · 20/04/2015 16:07

Hope you are ok OP and that you know you can come back if you need to, whatever your situation.

WaitWhatOh · 23/04/2015 07:34

I am okay.
I feel stronger. Leaning less on my lovely handholding thread.
We are writing an agreement that we are going to attempt to adhere too.
We are booked for counselling-joint and separate- and that's part of my conditions too. I also have personal counselling arrange that he is unaware of.
I have set the conditions for trying again. I am also proud of my knowledge now - we can reach this point of splitting up again and I will be okay. I know my rights. I know our bank and bill details. I'm not so scared.
I guess at the moment I feel more equal, if not in fact a little stronger.
We shall see.

OP posts:
Anniegetyourgun · 23/04/2015 10:12

That's good to hear Smile

CharlotteCollins · 23/04/2015 10:24

That must be a long agreement. Wink (Hopefully longer on the stuff he needs to do than the stuff you need to...)

Good to hear that you're feeling stronger.

What kind of changes in him are you looking for? How long will you give him to learn new patterns of relating?

(Not demanding answers on the thread, just suggesting questions that need to be thought through.)

pocketsaviour · 23/04/2015 10:27

Glad to hear you are feeling stronger :)

WaitWhatOh · 25/04/2015 06:29

It's the circles of this that kill me.

Our meet up went really well. Until I asked questions about taxes and business. I got cross and frustrated. I didn't understand and found his replies very belittling.
As soon as I got cross he started yelling how crazy I am.

Now he's left and extremely angry. Horrible texts. Threats to sell everything. Instructions to get a full time job immediately.
Gone is Mr nice guy. And gone is any strength I thought I had.
He has the kids for two nights and one of them is poorly and it's breaking my heart they aren't home in their own bed.

I feel I only have two options now.
I either agree I need lots of help. Take anger management classes as he says. Cope with the my poor wife is crazy attitude. Everyone gets their life back.

Or I see a solicitor. And take on his wrath. Which he's declared is the last thing I ought to do. He will literally take me to the cleaners.
Don't feel strong enough for either

I'm so so stupid. I do indeed live in a fairyland like he says. Thinking I could fix everything. Ha. :(

OP posts:
Fishandjam · 25/04/2015 08:58

Except, with option 1, everyone doesn't get their life back, do they? You don't.

Anniegetyourgun · 25/04/2015 09:48

Well that didn't last very long!

You felt you had to try. It appeared H was on the same page. He wasn't - but you gave him a chance to be. He really, really didn't want to tell you about the finances, did he? So on the pretext of explaining he pressed all the wind-up buttons, exploded and flounced off. It's so transparent - but here you are, seven weeks on from the start of your thread, again half-believing you are a needy, temperamental creature who would irritate a saint.

Take a deep breath, relax, read your post from Thursday and try to recover that strength. It does indeed go round in circles, as you say; and it's the hope once again snatched away, even more than the aggression, that saps your energy. Were you so positive because you believed it might actually work? That was never very likely (although even we outsiders were hoping against hope that it would).

Plan A was the one where you made an agreement and went to counselling together and gradually learned to relate to each other as adults in a healthy relationship. Plan B kicks in if/when the party of the second part blows Plan A out of the water. You said you will be okay, you know your rights; this is correct, you will and you do. You need not be afraid.

He'll take you to the cleaners? Oh yeah - how? He gets his own way with you by emotional manipulation and intimidation. This simply does not work in a court of law. The judge doesn't know him and doesn't care. The judge will see a marriage which has irretrievably broken down, total marital assets, number of dependent children and two relative earning capacities. It is the court's job to make a fair split on the basis of those factors. Neither one of you can or should be able to take each other to the cleaners. I know your H won't play fair, he'll hide assets and all sorts of dirty dealings, but you will not come out of this with nothing. He is lying, plain and simple, when he tries to tell you it works like that.

3teenageboys · 25/04/2015 09:56

Oh Goodness Wait, with regards to finding out about taxes & business. I would approach your accountant direct. I know you said that he is a friend of your husband, but you are part owner of the company.
I would make an appointment or phone the accountant explaining that you would like copies of all files,taxes etc. Tell him that you are entitled to these. TELL HIM THAT IF he informs your husband about your request, that he is in breach of his own professional Code of Conduct & that you will forward his details to said professional body for breach of confidentiality. It might work. YOU ARE LEGALLY ENTITLED TO THIS. TAKE NO SHIT FROM YOUR ARSE OF A HUSBAND OR HIS MATE THE ACCOUNTANT.

YOUR HUSBAND IS OUT TO SHAFT YOU.

It might just work. How dare he speak to you like that. Stay strong x

pocketsaviour · 25/04/2015 10:14

I either agree I need lots of help. Take anger management classes as he says. Cope with the my poor wife is crazy attitude. Everyone gets their life back.

Anger management?! Jesus he is gaslighting the hell out of you.

Or I see a solicitor. And take on his wrath. Which he's declared is the last thing I ought to do. He will literally take me to the cleaners.

Well he would say that, wouldn't he...? He is used to putting you in your place by threats and intimidation. Why change the habit of a lifetime, he probably thinks Hmm

I'm so so stupid. I do indeed live in a fairyland like he says. Thinking I could fix everything. Ha.

You're not stupid and you're not away with the fairies. It's not stupid to want to be treated with respect. It's not stupid to assume that people actually mean what they say. It's not stupid to want to fix your marriage rather than walking out the door.

You have been treated so poorly by him, Wait. Flowers

WaitWhatOh · 25/04/2015 13:57

What do I say when he says
How do I live how do I eat you have the house! The grocery budget! It's not fair

I don't know what to say

He's sat waiting for me to learn my lesson - I feel. I feel so damn stuck.

OP posts:
MelonBallersAreStrange · 25/04/2015 15:10

*What do I say when he says
How do I live how do I eat you have the house! The grocery budget! It's not fair *

Say "You are a grown man. You can work it out."

You are not responsible for fixing his problems.

StaceyAndTracey · 25/04/2015 17:38

I wonder if the reason that you feel stuck is because you are waiting for him to change , to realise, to understand . And if that's the case, Then you are stuck . You could wait forever .

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