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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Is splitting the only advice people on here are ever capable of?

654 replies

MrsCs · 21/02/2015 23:16

When someone is being abused, or someone is unfaithful, fine I get it, that's good advice.

On the other hand.....I've only been on this website a short time and every blinking thread about relationship problems gets 'why are you together?' 'what are you getting from this?'.

Relationships are hard work, they have good times and bad times, and it might help if people on here had a bit of creativity with their advice! Separations and divorces are very hard on everyone involved, and if it can be avoided it's most likely for the best, unless a couple are genuinely deeply unhappy.

OP posts:
sliceofsoup · 22/02/2015 16:33

I don't claim to be anything. Nor does anyone else on MN. There is a disclaimer at the top of this page to that effect.

I say IME and IMO all the time in my posts, but I don't have to. Everything any one of us writes on here is our own opinion based on our own unique life experience.

If I come across as patronising to you then I think that says more about you than it does about me. There are a lot of posters on here who are saying the same things as me, yet twice now you have singled me out. If something that I am saying in my posts is bothering you enough to do that, then I hope you will take some time to ask yourself why, because nothing i am suggesting on here is damaging to anyone.

People in good relationships don't need advice, people in bad relationships just might. So I will continue to tell women they deserve better, and that it is ok for them to LTB if they want to.

Lweji · 22/02/2015 16:35

I thought the question was
"what are you getting from this relationship?"

There are always times when we "get" less than the other person and times when we get more.
The problem is when someone constantly gets less.

Nobody asks that question when someone complains that for the last month their partner has had a lot of work, or is ill. They get it when they take off constantly without a second thought leaving their partner at home with the children, and without ever a break, for example.

IMO Grin

IamaRedHairedGeek · 22/02/2015 16:37

johnfarleyruskins I think it's great that you have ended relationships just because you wanted to without any work. I tried for about 3 years to cling on to the idea of staying together with my children's father but he was so dreadful, i was pushing water uphill really. The two relationships I've had since, one man was very nice but we kind of ran out of things to say and I ended it instantly and I think he was shocked by how quickly I pulled the rug from under us. the next guy, it was a big thing or it felt it to begin with, yet the minute he started telling me what I thought!!!! only about 4 months in, I told him off for it, and when he didn't SEE what he had done and back down with an apology, i ended it in the NEXT BREATH literally.

I see this as real progress for me. I wish I had been like I am now twenty years ago.

tobee · 22/02/2015 16:39

Maybe I should have said, Lweji, "it's interests me that you think that, I'm happy to look at it differently, and prepared to find I may well be wrong"

I like to listen people,rather than lay down dogma, at any time.

tobee · 22/02/2015 16:44

Fair enough, sliceofsoup, but there are others who disagree. Maybe it's because your initial comments were intimidating, but sure, it's likely to be my fault that I find that.

IamaRedHairedGeek · 22/02/2015 16:44

tobee when the posters themselves are giving you the 'evidence', that they're not supported, not respected, that they do all the work, their voice isn't heard etc..........or whatever, ''the regular'' posse respond to what they're being told.

Seriously, unless your view is that it's better to stay in a very bad relationship then it's not ''dogma'' to suggest leaving a bad one. Unless an agenda to persuade somebody to stay in a bad relationship is dogma Confused, it's the logical and predictable reaction to reading a poster detail the litany of disrespectful behaviours that she has endured.

FIND me a thread where somebody has advised a poster to leave over a disagreement about watching too much football, or dirty dishes in the sink

Lweji · 22/02/2015 16:44

Same here, Iama.

I tried as much as I could with exH.
Not after him.
If something is not fundamentally right, or if it needs a lot of explaining or work, then it's a danger to continue. A danger for me, and my DS, who I don't want to go through a bad relationship and break up again.
At one point I too thought sometimes relationships had to be worked on, and that they might need to be hard work. That conflict could be exciting and fun.
Well, not so much now. Not after 14 years of arguments for petty things.
In my 40s, if it's not easy enough, it's not worth it.
This is mainly because we can't change how a person is fundamentally.

IamaRedHairedGeek · 22/02/2015 16:47

I guess, there are a lot of women who are quite heavily invested in to the belief that it's better to be in a relationship that gives them nothing and makes them unhappy than it is to be single. Obviously that is a bizarre conclusion so quite a bit of denial and cognitive dissonance is required to hang on to that belief. Demonising people who call out bad behaviour for one. It's sad.

sliceofsoup · 22/02/2015 16:48

So now my posts were intimidating? Confused

I am sorry but I will say it again, you are reading something from my posts that just isn't there. I am not an extremist, I don't lay down dogma, and I have no intention to be intimidating or patronising.

There is a reason that you are reading my posts in this way, and it isn't a reason I have any control over.

IamaRedHairedGeek · 22/02/2015 16:51

I don't see how they were intimidating.

Terrifying perhaps for a poster who's carefully constructed cognitive dissonance slips for a moment and they process the information in a different way. Their h is horrible to them all the time and for a moment they think 'i should leave' and that's terrifying! (not ''intimidating'').

tobee · 22/02/2015 16:55

Well we will just have to agree to differ.

Original poster
MrsCs · 22/02/2015 16:56

Thanks for the advice gallic, it's not a case of deliberately missing threads, I'm still learning to navigate the site effectively.

OP posts:
Vivacia · 22/02/2015 17:03

The question that has become common currency, used all the time by a certain poster and now used by other posters when she isn't there, is...

TalkMeDown I wish people would name who they are referring to. I think that it's mealy-mouthed to do otherwise.

Vivacia · 22/02/2015 17:04

MrsC can you describe a few specific examples where you thought posters were wrong to advise LTB?

didyouwritethe · 22/02/2015 17:11

"Terrifying perhaps for a poster who's carefully constructed cognitive dissonance slips for a moment and they process the information in a different way."

What a very interesting sentence.

GallicIsCharlie · 22/02/2015 17:16

Vivacia - "What are you getting from this relationship" is frequently asked by the indomitable AttilaTheMeerkat :) I ask it, too, when I'm hoping the OP will start to evaluate the balance of power in her relationship for herself.

Twinklestein · 22/02/2015 17:20

Is the question so controversial?

I've always asked friends in difficult relationships 'what's in this for you?'

Isn't it a fairly obvious point?

Lweji · 22/02/2015 17:21

I think the problem with the question was the "now" in the end. But I don't remember anyone using the "now". Does anyone add "now" to the end of the question?

Vivacia · 22/02/2015 17:23

I don't add "now".

2rebecca · 22/02/2015 17:31

I agree that I've not usually seen "now" in the question. It can sometimes lead to a poster posting a more balanced view of their partner though as sometimes there is an initial rant about a bloke with no obvious redeeming features that would make anyone wonder why any woman would spend more than half an hour with such a man let alone several years.
It's hard to give a requested opinion on a relationship without knowing what the man's good qualities are and what made her think she wanted to live with him.
The now can be relevant if the poster can only think of positive things in the relationship several years ago and things have gone steadily downhill, as her relationship is with the man as he is now.

AliceinWinterWonderland · 22/02/2015 17:34

I think the beauty of it is that on MN nobody has a "stake" in the relationship. No history, no relationship, no favourites. So they can often see it much more clearly and pick up on things in a (dare I say it?) less emotional/more clinical manner.

For the purpose of this, we'll say it's the man in the relationship that is behaving badly....

His family - invested. His bad behaviour and the ultimate separation will change family dynamics and mean they will have to face the idea that he is not the lovely bloke they think he is. Many are simply not willing to admit this, so they support his view of things in which he did nothing wrong.

The couple's friends - invested. The couple splitting up will change the dynamics of the friendship. Who is whose friend now? Do they take sides? No more socialising together obviously. What a mess! Better the couple works it out, right? Surely it can't be that bad!

Her family - invested. They want her to have a happy ever after. He's always seemed like such a nice bloke, maybe she's misunderstood something. Is she pregnant? It's just hormones!! or maybe she's not putting the effort into the marriage. Or making a mountain out of a molehill.

Everyone has a stake in it. On MN, they don't. They can call it as they see it. Trust me. It's helpful. No history, no stake, no part of the relationship. Sometimes it's the only honest feedback someone can get.

Lweji · 22/02/2015 17:37

Most of the redeeming points end up being something like:
he is a good dad and he loves his children, although he takes off on holiday without any of them
he makes me laugh, when I'm not crying
he is a hard worker, and for that reason he keeps all his earnings and doesn't contribute towards housework (but he is a good dad, even if he does shit all for the children)

and why are you in the relationship, often end up being,
it's too complicated to leave
I couldn't get him to move out
he'd go mad
how would I do for money
what would everyone think
it would upset the children

GallicIsCharlie · 22/02/2015 17:39

Presumably an OP got something out of the relationship when she started it Grin So it's logical to add "now".

DeliciousMonster · 22/02/2015 17:42

The "now" part of this bothers me. Relationships aren't all about now. If a financial advisor said "what are you getting from this pension plan now?" you would sack them because the answer is "nothing, it's costing me more now than I get. But it's not for now, it's for later".

A financial adviser should be telling you that your stake can go up as well as down. With a relationship, many posters say 'I've put x years into this relationship, I'm not just leaving like that'. But a relationship is so far from a financial investment and you do not get interest that racks up as the years go by.

RedHairedGeek · 22/02/2015 17:47

but why would a man treat you very badly now if he could treat you better, or plans to treat you better in the future. Unlike with money, there is no limit on a man treating his wife well. Like, he's saving up his energy to treat her well in the future!

what!