Is splitting the only advice people on here are ever capable of?

[MrsCs]

When someone is being abused, or someone is unfaithful, fine I get it, that's good advice.

On the other hand.....I've only been on this website a short time and every blinking thread about relationship problems gets 'why are you together?' 'what are you getting from this?'.

Relationships are hard work, they have good times and bad times, and it might help if people on here had a bit of creativity with their advice! Separations and divorces are very hard on everyone involved, and if it can be avoided it's most likely for the best, unless a couple are genuinely deeply unhappy.

wrong person to ask i'm afraid - i've always floated around up here and maintained this high vibration the butterfly catchers didn't get me.

Interesting Twinklestein.

Rising up, rising up, dydufig ufif igig (something incoherent). Anyway, who first used that rising up term? Was it you my lovely dearest Bath?

But a lot of people fear submission in relationships because it has been abused

Do they? Or do they just think that submission has no place in a healthy, functioning relationship? Or on a wider social context, in a democracy.

All this subordination and submission talk is a bit BDSM.

I don't usually post on relationships (as I'm not in a relationship) but I think it is so valuable that somewhere exists that people do get told that it's ok to leave if you're "just" unhappy. That and to point out all the subtle signs of abuse, that you can leave before it gets really bad.

The relationships board is by women for women, and I think it's obvious why some posters are hugely threatened by that, and I do think it's really important that posters defend the board. Mumsnet would be a less good place if people weren't told to LTB sometimes. Telling people that leaving is always an option is hugely important.

It's also worth considering that often women are told to sacrifice their own happiness for the sake of their children but this is rarely said to men. Yes, divorce can have a detrimental effect on children- but you should not stay just for the children. Women have a right not to be miserable and sometimes shock horror they are allowed to put their own needs first!

MrsC It seems like you're very new to internet forums in general. In general, most forums will have an established etiquette/tone and questioning it when you are new is seen as bad manners, and you should expect to be put down sharply. If you are not in the sort of state to deal with the sort of replies you will get on a controversial thread, the best idea is not to post one. It's also a good idea to do a forum search before posting as these sorts of threads do appear a lot and are often posted by trolls or MRAs, and it's a good idea to avoid these topics.

Also, women are not under any obligation to care about men, ever, especially not in a space that is predominantly for women.

Slice, frank is absolutely right.

Take responsibility for your actions! You chose a nasty abusive man, you had a relationship with him, and then you found the strength to leave him.

Bloody well done!

I love the idea that on the first date the bloke says, "by the way, I intend to control you, belittle you and hurt you", and you say, "oh gosh yes, that sounds super."

Frank are you aware that a lot of abuse starts when the woman is pregnant?

Bloody women not being bloody psychic enough again.

:o

fearing 'submission' seems pretty rational to me. i'm not a dog nor a porn star or slave.

are women supposed to be submissive to men then? is that where it's all going wrong?

I don't think I can take anyone seriously who blames a victim of abuse for their own abuse. Wtf.

I got my 1st punch in the face after 3 years.

Being psychic would have helped enormously.

I hold my hands up. I fear submission and rail against it whenever and wherever I can. Both in real life and online.

Both for men and women. In relationships and outside.

It was 10 years for me before the physical side started. Damn my stupid not-being-able-to-predict-the-future.

It's hard to be cross with Frank, his ideas are just so silly :)

Universal paranoid advice to marry, not to promote family values and a loving stable environment to bring up a family..
Er not quite, another MM mantra to protect the woman from the inevitable abuse that will happen being with a man.. Bit like an insurance policy..

How do you know what a good solid marriage is like if all you have is a negative experience..

Ah, so anyone who has been in an abusive relationship should not post because their 'negativity will spill out'.

And anyone who has not been in an abusive relationship should not post because...'they've got no idea'.

O-kayyy. So that may just leave you Frank.

What is it about this board that you find so threatening I wonder?

Marriage isn't family values.

Marriage is a legal contract between two people.

I take it posters not subordinate at work..

"Are not"....

That doesn't make sense.

Xpost.

Are you at work, Frank?

What on earth are you jabbering on about? What has being subordinate got to do with working? I worry about you Frank. You don't make a lot of logical sense.

Yes I find this board extremely intimidating and threatening.. That's why I post.. It's interesting... Carry on..

A marriage is not a "management/employee" arrangement.

I have posted here about relationship problems and been encouraged to leave - also had lots of support.

Two things I wonder about are the effects across the whole life-course eg. old-age with no companionship. I know that many women do find new relationships, but what about those who become single empty-nesters?

Also, finances. Lots of women are encouraged to leave on the basis that tax credits will see them through - but tax credits are just a political policy. A new government could shrink the welfare state dramatically... A friend's parent has had several divorces and is now living very precariously, entirely dependent on HB - despite having worked for most of her adult life.

I think that unless the situation is very clear cut (which mine is not) the prospects are daunting.

Every day for society to function correctly humans choose to be subordinate, otherwise life would be chaotic.. There's nothing wrong with being subordinate, it's normal for relationships to function in this way and is interchangeable depending on the social situation ...

Frank if it suits you to have a series of relationships with dominatrixes (dominatrices? What is the plural?) then that's fine. I'd prefer to be in a partnership of equals. You clearly like your way. Meh.

I think frank is confusing comprising with subordination.

In the workplace there are specific roles of hierarchy in order to get the job done.

In relationships there is a view that couples are equal with compromise. Unless you are either a;

Abuser
Dominatrix
Stepford wife

Hth frank.

What an extraordinary idea Frank. For society to function correctly humans need to regard each other as equals and treat each other as such. We have laws that underpin this.

Societies run on the lines of subordination tend to look like Saudi Arabia or totalitarian regimes.

No idea why you are so desperate for subordination to be a part of your life. Nor Christian Grey either. Issues I guess.

• compromising