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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Is splitting the only advice people on here are ever capable of?

654 replies

MrsCs · 21/02/2015 23:16

When someone is being abused, or someone is unfaithful, fine I get it, that's good advice.

On the other hand.....I've only been on this website a short time and every blinking thread about relationship problems gets 'why are you together?' 'what are you getting from this?'.

Relationships are hard work, they have good times and bad times, and it might help if people on here had a bit of creativity with their advice! Separations and divorces are very hard on everyone involved, and if it can be avoided it's most likely for the best, unless a couple are genuinely deeply unhappy.

OP posts:
JohnFarleysRuskin · 22/02/2015 20:08

I agree sliceofsoup, and what this thread reveals is that some people really, really dislike that being questioned.

But lets talk some more about me ;)

ToYouToMe · 22/02/2015 20:08

@sliceofsoup: It's clear that most people on MN who urge other women to LTB have never been in the same situation and have never LTB.That is not the feeling I get from MN at all

Me neither. Most of the LTB posters come across as bitter, mean angry at men in general. Why would you be like that if you'd had a lifetime of loving relationships?

JohnFarleysRuskin · 22/02/2015 20:09

But really, tobee, have you genuinely seen that, a thread in relationships with no empathy or compassion, just a command?

If I had seen that, I would agree with you.

tobee · 22/02/2015 20:09

So we shouldn't have any angst about leaving a relationship and walking out the door, with or without kids? We should just be beaming away about everything?

tobee · 22/02/2015 20:10

Yes, john, not all the way through, but even just 5/6 times in a thread seems too many to me.

Twinklestein · 22/02/2015 20:11

The thing is, it's the same old posters who crop up on every thread, copy and pasting the same old paranoid drivel, it's ok reading self help books but for goodness sake at least separate the information that your reading and parroting back on a public forum from your own personal feelings and experiences

I see certain regular posters on different threads, the ones that immediately spring to mind offer wise, subtle advice.

I've not seen the C&Ping of 'paranoid drivel' nor much advice that comes from self help books, other than some astute books such as Lundy Bancroft's 'Why does he do that' etc.

I have seen before the assertion that much advice on here comes from people in failed relationships. My impression is that the majority of women here are happy in relationships and taking time to help posters in difficult situations.

Perhaps we're reading a different threads...?

sliceofsoup · 22/02/2015 20:18

Of course anyone leaving their relationship will have angst about it.

But the angst at the idea that leaving a relationship is a very viable option...that's what I am seeing on this thread and its sad.

tobee · 22/02/2015 20:22

Well the angst at the idea of leaving a relationship doesn't sound so terrible, so don't feel sad about it. As long as the right decision is made.

Lweji · 22/02/2015 20:24

It's clear that most people on MN who urge other women to LTB have never been in the same situation and have never LTB.

Most of the LTB posters come across as bitter, mean angry at men in general. Why would you be like that if you'd had a lifetime of loving relationships?

Interesting that people accuse others who often say LTB of either hating men and being in failed relationships OR of not knowing what an abuser is or having been through the difficulty of leaving a relationship.

I think you'll find that people who say LTB are from all perspectives. They are in good relationships and want other women to be in good relationships too, or have been through abuse and bad relationships and know exactly how it is to leave. Or both, have been through abuse and are not in good relationships. Or have been in bad relationships and are surrounded by good relationships and see what good men are like.
Don't forget that the people who have been with abusers are often more attuned to abusive behaviour, they don't have to defend abusers because they are no longer putting up with them.

The opposite could be said to those who advise women to stay in bad relationships. That they are trying to justify staying with bad partners, or their own abusive behaviour towards their partners.

Twinklestein · 22/02/2015 20:24

Most of the LTB posters come across as bitter, mean angry at men in general. Why would you be like that if you'd had a lifetime of loving relationships?

Where are all these mean, bitter, angry women? Can you find some examples. I don't see them.

I think some people are very insecure and anxious about women questioning or criticising male behaviour. They seem to think that if you criticise a man you are mean or must hate them.

I love men personally, I'm very close to many men in my life, but there's a lot of behaviour I simply wouldn't put up with. Luckily, I've had a 'lifetime of loving relationships', probably because I have high expectations and weed out anyone who doesn't meet my standards.

There are women on here who are having or have had bad experiences with men, and I'm happy to spend time supporting them and telling them that there are good men out there, and they don't have to put up and shut up.

JohnFarleysRuskin · 22/02/2015 20:25

I've just skimmed through some of the current relationship threads.

They seem very kind and empathetic, with lots of varied advice. Maybe the bitter mean angry at men in general posters are waiting for darkness to fall and they can come out of their coffins.

tobee · 22/02/2015 20:28

Oh and I was never brought up to feel a relationship was my only goal in life, never felt that myself, and would be very surprised if my daughter or son thought so.

I fell into a relationship with my husband nearly thirty years ago, only married him 3 years ago because he has a life threatening illness, would rather it was a civil partnership, don't take anything for granted, hope I would know when/if it was time to leave. And yes, would likely turn to mumsnet if advice was needed!

Twinklestein · 22/02/2015 20:29

Snap John I can't see them either.

I've heard the bitter mean angry at men in general line before many times with regard to feminists.

iwashappy · 22/02/2015 20:31

If you insist we talk about you some more JohnFarley then here goes! John is lovely, gives good helpful advice and I don't see any reason why there should have been criticism of her on here.

I agree that there are posts sometimes that are a simple LTB or similar but in the majority of cases posters suggesting this do normally back that up with some good advice and thought processes.

I think that posters sometimes are more likely to comment on subjects that they have experienced themselves or have some knowledge of. Yes there might be some projecting sometimes but with experience comes insight and that can be invaluable.

I don't agree that comments are nasty and abusive, occasionally yes, but in the vast majority of cases I think people are trying to be helpful to the poster. If someone is clearly in a bad relationship and is obviously unhappy but not in the right frame of mind to actually make the decision to LTB people tend to want the best for the OP hence some of the more forthright comments sometimes.

At the end of the day it is down to the individual what they decide to do, but maybe them starting to question the relationship might be the first step to making the decision to leave a relationship that is making them unhappy.

For the record I did LTB and got a lot of great support and advice on here.

sliceofsoup · 22/02/2015 20:31

But it is sad. Its sad that smart and capable women are still so ready to defend the rhetoric that relationships are hard work, and use it as an excuse for terrible behaviour from their partners.

tobee · 22/02/2015 20:31

Twinkle, ask my husband if he thinks I have a problem criticising male behaviour!

tobee · 22/02/2015 20:33

My relationship is hard work but my partner doesn't behave badly to me. But maybe I'm in denial, who knows? Not you.

RedHairedGeek · 22/02/2015 20:35

wow!

What a ludicrous accusation. I'm not bitter or angry at men. I feel like I won a prize. I got out of a terrible relationship and in a parallel universe I could so easily still be there. I'm happy, and grateful. Not in any tiny tiny way am I bitter. My X was the ambassador for himself and not for any other man and I do know that. Any man that comes in to my life now is a good man. It was my own low bar that attracted a man who behaved so badly to me.

Wow. I am just slack jawed at the lack of insight there.

JohnFarleysRuskin · 22/02/2015 20:39

Ah, Iwashappy, you are lovely - as always. I follow your thread and see how you sound so much stronger all the time.

(I don't feel I've been criticized as such - I think the op was defending herself vigorously, which is fair-dos, I was going on a bit.)

iwashappy · 22/02/2015 20:41

I agree with Twinkle that a lot of the posters who offer advice on a lot of threads give good, helpful advice. I for one appreciate the time that people like you have given in supporting posters going through bad experiences.

Lwej too talks a lot of sense that posters want other "women to be in good relationships." No relationship is better than a bad one, however hard it can be to leave sometimes.

sliceofsoup · 22/02/2015 20:45

You just seem very defensive for someone in a happy relationship tobee.

I am sorry to hear that your husband has a life threatening illness, but if that is what you mean by your relationship being hard work, then I have to say that we obviously see it differently. I see that as life being hard and throwing a horrible and incredibly difficult situation at you both, not as your relationship being hard work, especially as you say your husband does not behave badly towards you.

Twinklestein · 22/02/2015 20:45

My post wasn't referencing you tobee

JohnFarleysRuskin · 22/02/2015 20:47

Tobee, that sounds a tough situation. Flowers

gildedcage · 22/02/2015 20:49

No one has the right to tell anyone what to do.

The reason I use this forum is because it gives you the benefit of other people's experience and opinions whilst being reasonably anonymous. Of course you only hear one side of the story, but that's no different than if you were speaking to a friend.

Sometimes posters do sound as if they are goading OPs, however in the main I look at uncomfortable questions as being thought provoking. Some people don't want to think to deeply, which is understandable, time has taught me that you don't always have to be reactionary.

I am slightly offended that I may be considered dysfunctional. Certainly I have never suffered abuse and both my parents and my dh's parents had long happy marriages. I have been with my own dh for 20 years. I would never say something as glib as LTB. However reading some of the posts here I am amazed that you would say tough if out when partners are abusers, rapists, using prostitutes etc...these are not usual occurrences in happy relationships.

iwashappy · 22/02/2015 20:50

Tobee I think people may have different definitions of what constitutes hard work in a relationship. There will be ups and downs in most relationships.

I think a better definition of a good or bad relationship personally is how it makes you feel. If you are happy/content most of the time and feel loved, valued, respected and cared for then all good otherwise not so good.

Thank you John, I am making progress and you don't go on!