My sister wrote a letter about me to the guardian.....

[FergusSingsTheBlues]

It got published. It was full of wild accusations and assumptions and was really unfair.

I only just found out.

She's pretty much permanently depressed so I cant really go mad, but I'm so hurt I really don't want much to do with her. I'm had a go at her yesterday, shouted at her for the first time ever, then ended up consoling her over a cup of tea. I always suck up this sort of thing. And we've always been really close....I thought.

To make things worse, she told my best friend who couldn't face telling me so it's double humiliation. For some reason that's made me much more upset.

I'm mortified because anybody who knows me will have read it as all my friends read the guardian....

What do I do now?

I haven't dismissed it at all! I've been on her side all the way and have never abandoned or belittled her. I totally agree with her view of events actually esp wrt our family. Read my previous posts please, before you come to that conclusion.

Fergus, this thread seems, sadly, to be full of people who see themselves as "scapegoats" and want to blame you for your sister's behaviour and make you responsible for fixing her.

They are wrong.

She is not your fault and you can't fix her.

The thing that is missing here from you is any sense that you matter, that your happiness is important.

She is quite obviously playing you like a violin - you actually believed (believe?) is her obviously fake remorse. You allowed her to turn a situation of her choosing that damaged you into another pity party for herself.

She has told you to "get out of her life".

I think you owe it to yourself to take her at her word on that.

It doesn't have to be forever, but some break in this toxic relationship will help you draw boundaries and stop feeling like her problems are your fault.

OK, this is controversial and obviously I am biased, so treat this with a big ole handful of salt.

I agree that there are no 'winners' in a scapegoat/golden child situation. I very much agree that BOTH children are victims of bad parenting. However, I do think the behaviour towards the scapegoat is likely to be felt by the majority of people to be more damaging than the behaviour towards the golden child, because even 'fake recognition' of someone's personhood and self is more affirmative than the utter contempt with which the scapegoat is often treated. (A bit like those psychological effects where if you force yourself to smile and be breezy, your mood does improve a bit).

I also think that the vast majority of people will tend to accept positive reinforcement, even if they know it's not entirely sound. When someone tells us we look good, even if we know it's a bit of a porky, it makes us feel better.

I'm not saying this is black-and-white, and that one party has it easy and one doesn't. I'm definitely not saying life is straightforward for golden children. I'm simply saying that in my opinion, being scapegoated is likely to be more psychologically undermining than being the golden child, on the whole for the majority.

I think the OP sees this - all of her posts suggest that she recognises this, and has spent a great deal of time and energy trying to compensate her sister for what she's suffered. She has shown remarkable fortitude and patience in dealing with behaviour, which tells you that she's not your average, huffy, self-righteous person. I think that behind the apparent argument between posters on this thread there is actually agreement, that the OP isn't solely responsible for 'correcting' the situation. What I would suggest is that the current way that things are isn't 'soluble' at all, and that OP is exhausting herself trying to achieve something that is, in fact, impossible - which is to transform the situation with the family dynamic intact.

Instead, what the OP could do would be to build a united front with her sister against the parents, to affirm her sister's view of the family dynamics, and to ensure that it doesn't continue into the future. Obviously, this is a difficult task for either of them individually, but together they could actually have a big impact. I'm not saying that there needs to be some big confrontation with parents or anything, but there can be a firm decision not to tolerate certain attitudes and behaviours that comes from a place of solidarity together. I would suggest a heart-to-heart conversation about what the OP's sister actually would reasonably need to see from the OP to change this - it could be anything from altering beneficial childcare arrangements through to firmly and gently setting behaviours straight when they occur.

I believe that this validation would then be easier for the OP's sister to take some responsibility for certain behaviours (and for the OP to be able to ask, fairly, that she does so, and to support her through therapy, which she clearly needs). I also think it would make it easier for OP's sister to see that the cycle was broken, and that she could move on.

Just to add: I think victimhood is one of the most seductive positions going. It's sooooo easy to get sucked in to the self-righteousness of it. I know, I've done it myself! The fact that the OP is resistant to that, and is trying to think of creative ways to help and solve the actual issues WITHOUT allowing herself to be bulldozed gets massive props from me.

Another factor is also perhaps that while being the scapegoat forces you into a position of victimhood and low-self-esteem, being the golden child forces you to take on excessive responsibilities, act like a parent and be constantly worrying about getting everything right.

It just so happens that these qualities / approach to life tend to stand you in good stead for academic and career success. While you may be messed up (and as a golden child I certainly am, massive anxiety issues, phobias, OCD, depression you name it and I dread to think what I've cost the NHS) - you are at least generally able to "achieve" and get a self-esteem boost from that. And that can upset the scapegoat even more.

LadyJinglyJones - I think that's probably right! The responsibility-taking part in particular, which can lead to issues with anxiety/control that are unbelievably hard to manage. I suppose that would link with the idea that the OP is trying to do the Herculean impossible in solving this problem by herself.

[The next bit is a personal derail, sorry]

The success thing depends a bit, too. The fact that I was the scapegoat made me try really, really hard academically to try to 'win' the love of my parents. I ended up with first class academics, despite terrible schools, right to the highest level. But nothing I achieved was ever good enough. I think that may be partly why I didn't ever develop the social confidence to pursue a career or to engage in any other activities that might test social esteem. For instance, I have never in my life thrown a party because, despite the fact that I have friends, I fear that no-one would show up and I would be rejected. I am trying for the first time in my mid 30s to get over these problems and I am frankly terrified at the prospect of rejection and failure that I'm opening up, but I know I need to woman up and deal with it!

Yes, funkster, not many seem to be listening to me when I say I've tried everything including speaking to my parents, in fact I've fallen out with my mother over this stuff. I know I've done what u can and my sister even admits it.

There's just a lot if people venting.

I never labelled myself a GC, btw it was other posters, likewise I was most definitely my dads enemy growing up, so I've been scapegoated too. Far more damaging for a mother to dislike you than a father though, so I'm pretty much unscathed.

Belly....my sister too, she never graduated or pursued a career and even now, refuses to do so as she doesn't have the confidence. Which is quite frustrating as she's way cleverer than me. I do believe that self esteem is more important than intelligence when it comes to superfices of " success"

Fergus - what do you want us to say? As in, what would you really like to hear? That she's outrageous and that you should give up and go NC?

You don't have to answer in public, but thinking about the true answer to that question might be helpful.

Thanks holly. i just do t have the self pity thing, really. I'm glad, think it can be massively destructive.

(Sorry, I didn't mean that to sound aggressive! I just meant - there are clearly answers here that you are finding emotionally soothing, and others that you aren't. Of course, whether something is 'easy' to hear is not a guide to whether it's good advice. But I find that sometimes when I feel conflicted and my will pulls in one direction but duty says 'no!', recognising what I want can be useful, even if I decide that the right thing to do is actually the opposite!).

for you Fergus. I think it's abundantly clear from this thread that you have enormous patience and selflessness!

You don't have a duty to fix your sister.

You don't even have a duty to ever see her again, should you choose not to.

It's OK to choose a path you find "emotionally soothing", particularly in a situation (such as this one) where you are the injured party.

Self-pity is a horrible quality, but self-preservation is vital.

You know she will hit out at you on purpose to damage you for things that are beyond your control.

It's entirely up to you how much space you want to give up in your life and in your psyche for someone who behaves in that way.

Oh, I think I just want to know how to maker her happy. Fixing her sounds patronizing, but....maybe how to sort her out. How to enjoy the rest of her life given the hand she's been dealt wrt mum, kids etc. she's only 39..... She's for another forty years left of life, she needs to find some happiness. But really how do I make her?

i don't think you can make her happy though.

Maybe support her if she wants to make changes.

I mean if she isn't happily married, what can you do about that for example?

You can't make her happy.

You can't make anyone happy.

She's 39. By that age your happiness is your own responsibility.

And that counts for you, too.

You should not spend the remaining 40-odd years of your own life trying to do the impossible and feeling guilty becAuse you can't.

All of this pointless drama (and it is pointless) is sapping your energy.

Energy that should be spent on your children, and yourself, and your husband, and the people in your life that make you happy and have some loyalty to you.

She has none.

The most basic thing you are teaching your children about relationships is something she lacks towards you.

The relationship you have is completely toxic if both of you agree that her happiness is your problem.

Step back. That is not a usual level of involvement in a sister's life.

Draw your own boundaries and see how much you want to see each other when this unhealthy dynamic isn't central to your relationship.

Well, that's that sorted then, Bathtime. How lovely to have life regimented and simple.

Life isn't ALL self-love, bathtime: we have a primary impulse to love outwardly as well as inwardly; the one doesn't necessarily cancel out the other.

So that's another gallumphing issue to add to this thread, full as it is of gallumphing issues and broad strokes. The stories here (eg the woman who died decades early through self-sabotage and blaming others) could be down to a myriad causes.

I was going to post, before holly got there before me, that imo even fake validation does the trick up to a point. My thin slice of golden child experiences have, I believe, tipped the balance in my general psyche, even though I now know they are fake. It may be important that they come from my mother (a thin voice in amongst a throng of savages = my family).

So I have been a bag of relentless 'bad luck', depression, shittiness, very poor life experiences; but also a self-belief that must come from primary 'strokes': good words, a good reception to me as a person [mum]. That they were to validate my mum was immaterial to me at the time: I believed them. As I also believed that I was the shittiest, most revolting specimen to ever walk the earth [dad/ rest of family]. Perhaps I am lucky that I wasn't a full-on GC and seem to have escaped the over-responsibility and anxiety that comes with that.

My point is that these messages go in, forming the individual. As children we have not developed the equipment to differentiate what comes our way. It takes a mighty amount of work to address those messages in later life. Most don't have the luxury or opportunity - or, even, the will; the task can either seem insurmountable (and usually often is if we're talking general mh care) or we are so damaged, and encircled, the clarity needed to see the faulty messages for what they are simply doesn't present.

Of course we should love "outwardly".

Fergus has lots of people in her life that need and deserve her love.

Only one of those people has told her to get out of their life.

All this tortured souling about scapegoats and golden children is irrelevant.

A woman has been treated like shit by a sister who massively resents her for things that were not her fault.

She is asking for help and displaying an inability to recognise that she is not her sister's keeper.

Whatever happened years ago happened. It doesn't create a lifelong requirement for one sibling to make the other happy.

Drawing a boundary and refusing to accept responsibility for her sister's unhappiness might actually help her to pull herself out of her out of self-pity and bitterness.

Sorted!

I can pack away all my books and years of therapy.

And listen to you.

You have it sorted.

If only you were around earlier.

I could have put everything in neat boxes.

I could have measured out my love all along to the deserving and undeserving.

What do your books and years of therapy have to do with this woman who is looking for help about something that has nothing to do with you or your situation?

This is somebody else's life that you are emptying your baggage all over.

People who treat us badly and who are not remorseful do not deserve our love.

Even if they had a shit childhood.

What

about

people

you

love

because

you

just

love

them

even

though

they're

shit

Like an abusive husband?

A full-time, romantic, all-or-nothing relationship you mean?

Bathtime - you are entitled to your opinion of course, but I am not sure you realise quite how hurtful your remarks sound. It's a very cut-and-dried attitude to a very complicated problem.

Of course the OP deserves better treatment from her sister. I don't think anyone is doubting that!! But she is seeking a more compassionate and caring solution than sheer anger or no contact, and sees that the problem is not just her sister, but a whole set of circumstances that were and are beyond her control.

I honestly think there is great merit in a position based on compassion and forgiveness, if you are able to sustain it. I'm not saying everyone can or should - sometimes the hurt is too deep and it is too painful and a more cut-and-dried approach has to be followed for self-preservation's sake. But the OP seems strong and has repeatedly said that she wants to be involved and to help, and isn't interested in self-pitying approaches that would paint over the complexities of this with a straightforward victim/abuser script.

You can know that you're entitled to better treatment and still forgive someone for treating you badly if you know that they are going through a rough time. Provided you have some boundaries in place (i.e. you're not a doormat), you can stick with people who are difficult and help them through things. We all do it, all the time, for people we care about. Sure, there's a line beyond which this attitude mustn't go (for the sake of wellbeing and sanity). But I sometimes feel like people on these forums act like tolerance and forgiveness, combined with a setting of some firm boundaries, aren't real options.

the OP seems strong and has repeatedly said that she wants to be involved and to help

She has also said that she no longer wanted to be as available as she has been and that she's given as much as she can.

And yet over and over people who think the scapegoat/golden child narrative is some kind of absolute paradigm keep coming back and insisting that she give more, hug and make up, stop her sister from self harming, use up her mental resources on trying to fix a sister who has totally fucked her over out of bitterness.

All I have ever said is that she should make some space for herself and draw some firmer boundaries.

But apparently that is an outrageous simplification of the massively complicated situation.

Sometimes complications are just obstacles people deliberately put in the way of seeing things clearly and dealing with them.

Nobody has the right to treat you like shit and expect you to keep coming back for more of the same.

That's an sbusive dynamic, and it is harmful to both people engaged in it.