Rape -Judy Finnegan

[HiawathaDidntBotherTooMuch]

DH and I were talking about this earlier. I hadn't heard anything about it, but he said 'Judy Finnegan got into trouble earlier for what she said about that footballer, going on to recount what she had said. Then he said 'you can understand what she meant though, there are different types of rape ...'. I flew off the handle, and said that I was offended and disgusted by what he had said.

He then went on and in about how sentences can vary to reflect the degrees of violence in rapes. I again flew off the handle and said that all rapes are violent.

He tried to explain what he meant. Which was that all rapes are disgusting, and every rapist should go to prison for their actions. But that some rapes involved more violence than others, just like some murders are more violent than others. He wanted to discuss it with me, but I couldn't speak to him, I was so disgusted. He has stormed off saying that I am pathetic and weird for not discussing what he had tried to explain.

I cannot get my head around what he is saying.

Twinklestein thanks for clarifying earlier.

As for "mansplain" being a very offensive term, for me, I find being subjected to "mansplain" to be extremely offensive.

I think the problem is to do with minimising the so called date rape. Saying it wasn't violent or she wasn't harmed is terribly damaging. JF might as well called her a silly girl who needed to stay sober. Very insulting and deflecting from the person who is responsible ie the criminal.

hi all. not to detract from the main topic of the thread but linking a patronising comment or lack of knowledge to the bits between our legs is silly and I do find it offensive. just call it a patronising comment and correct any lack of information or insight?

I have to be honest listeningandlearning I don't really give a stuff if you find it offensive or not. The comment was not directed at you. Please don't tell me how to post.

If you find that offensive, I wonder how you would deal with being called 'cunt, 'whore' & threatened with rape and death etc online, which has happened to me many a time...

"just call it a patronising comment"

Can do.

"and correct any lack of information or insight?"

Not my job.

We have plenty of visitors who would not respond to that "correction" with "thanks, I'll check my tone and my info in future" - believe me.

listening - the comment was made by someone who said "If I can reply as a man". He's the one that brought up gender. Or sorry, the bits between his legs.

I cant speak for the guy but think he was probably trying to avoid getting mauled by asking permission to input on this topic.

as you can see I make no such apologies!

Continiuing to sidetrack the thread for a moment, just to offer my 2p worth.

Using phrasing like mansplaining just cheapens the argument. Any point is lost straightaway and emphasis is diverted to the patronising tone. Same as someone going "there, there dear, don't worry your head about it"

(the lack of focus can be seen from the last few posts which have derailed this nicely)

Sigh.

So, poor Chloe Madeley, being threatened with rape just because her mother is in the news, hmmm?

It works fine for me bobby.

Are there any more blokes who want to whine about the term or can we get back to the topic?

I do hope those who threatened her are jailed as with Stella Creasy's perpetrators.

Assuming they can be found...

The thing is, mansplaining isnt alone in this. If a man gives his version as a man of what women think (which he did, as i doubt hes been raped in a marriage and in an alley, and by a friend, to be able to compare the three) that is what he is doing.

I am disabled. "Mansplaining" to a woman about rape is no different to an able bodied person telling me how i feel about using a wheelchair. And yes, google tells me this is known in the internet world as "ablesplaining". I'd always just called it patronising, but it boils down to the same thing. Someone with a privilege (sorry mn, i hate using "privilege") telling someone without that privilege what they are thinking

Anywho, perhaps time to draw the line and get back to the actual thread....?

And it took me so long to write that (and reading it, it isnt even well written ) that the thread did move on!

Anyway, it is a clever bit of publicity for JF's brand new role on a crappy sexist show and it has worked a treat- used something upsetting and emotive to draw our attention.

Am a bit about it all.

I also hope those who made the threats are caught and prosecuted. However, after reading the story of this piece of shit footballer and the story of Chloe Madeley one after another in today's newspaper, I was astonished that a mother of a daughter of a similar age could voice such opinions. If it was her daughter that happened to, would she feel it was a 'lesser' crime?

I do NOT condone Judy, or anyone who marginalises rape

However when I was at Uni 2 things happended

I was date raped one night by a friend of a friend, I was really upset about it and learnt it happended to another girl too (which made me realise I wasnot "making a fuss")- also had another dogy experience along these lines

a friend of a friend went to a nightclub. she was taken into the car park and gang raped by a few footballers (I shit you not, they are such pearls..)

Hand on heart- I do know that she was way way more traumatised than I was- it literally fucked her up. I was upset, really upset. and ashamed, and angry. But I made my peace with it pretty quickly, put it this way other male behaviour upset me alot more over the years.

This is why I struggle with this whole issue, and I am ONLY sharing this on this thread as I am confused -

Perhaps Chloe's experience might teach Judy something: that even being threatened with rape is quite unpleasant enough.

Richard is quoted as saying they will prosecute, which is presumably exactly how they would have felt if Chloe had been Evans' victim.

Paris, so sorry for you and your friend.

Your friend suffered multiple counts of rape and likely abduction as well. In the event that both cases had got to court, the relative sentences would have reflected that. But that is because more crimes were committed in your friend's case than in yours, not because yours was not serious,

No worries BeyondPrepared, I've done that. I agree with you and wouldn't personally go on to a men's forum and mansplain prostate cancer... if I did I would at least try and get my facts straight first...

And also different victims respond in different ways. Sadly some women have been both raped by a stranger and raped by a partner, some found the latter more traumatic because of the additional betrayal of trust, others the former. The law tends to sentence on the basis of the crime(s) rather than the impact on the victim

I am only sharing on this thread TBH as I am very concerned that we minimise violence and sexual agression this society. AND its an issue I struggle with.

I guess my challenge is poor girl could not have avoided her situation, and a horrible crime was perpretated, it was violent and humiliating. w

whereas I cant remember mine as I was drink- yes JUDGES of the world I was a drinken hussy that cant even remember but woke up feeling odd the next day

sigh!

FromParis - I was going to say the same as Yonic, that your friend experienced multiple rapes, and that would be reflected in the sentencing.

Just because you can't remember doesn't mean it hasn't registered in your consciousness. I know someone who developed PTSD long after she was raped when she was drunk. She couldn't remember much about the evening, in fact she reported sexual assault to police because that was the bit she remembered. She was sent for a forensic exam, and they had to tell her that she had actually been raped. She thought she was fine until she had a breakdown a few years later, started having panic attacks and flashbacks.

Experiences affect people differently, some people suffer more from the effects of trauma than others, it's very difficult to quantify...

Another 'drunken hussy' here - two years ago, I drank too much and woke up in a hotel room with a strange man raping me. I know it sounds strange, but I would honestly have rather had the 'stranger jumping out of the bushes' situation. At least then (PLEASE don't think I'm minimising anything anyone here has been though), people might have believed that it was a 'real rape', and my mother might not have blamed me for it.

I fear this is getting worse for me now - I'm having nightmares and flashbacks. If anyone can recommend a counsellor in the south west London area, I'd be very grateful.

It would kind of make all this debating about degrees of severity of rape all rather redundant if men would only learn and remember not to stick their dicks where they were not wanted, and hadn't been given permission to be.