Work Stress? Err don't think so mate!

[thenamehaschanged]

I can't copy and paste a link rather annoyingly - but this is my follow on thread from my original How far can he take the stressed from work excuse?

It burst at the seams with all the fantastic MN support I received and so I have started a new one as I carry on my journey of divorcing my very abusive husband.

Tbh, I would not even allow him to collect them from the house - I would drop them off at the brothers at the agreed time and pick them up again later.

And if he starts the whole "Its my house!" bullshit, you can just respond that you are facilitating his relationship with the girls, and if he chooses to decline to see them then that is his choice. End of text.

Right I think I will - I'm going to have a look for another solicitor - thanks everyone

I also disagree with your solicitor.

Do you know the name of his solicitor yet?

Actually, keep it on email. Easier to print out than texts.

That way if he does decline to see the kids even after you've facilitated a meeting elsewhere, you have it on record.

Long time lurker. You are doing great but I have to agree, ditch the solicitor!!!

It will not end well for you if he moves back in.
I have no real advice other than perhaps post in legal on here for advice on good solicitors.
I am dumbstruck that your solicitor recommends you let your abuser move in with you and your DC.
You clearly will not be safe!!!!!
Keep going name, you are fantastic!!!!

Can't believe your solicitor. How can she say you have to let an abuser back into your home? You are obviously terrified of him - call the Police and tell them this. Get it on record. And yes, see what another solicitor says - surely her advice can't be correct?

I am also flabbergasted with your solicitor suggesting he come on his own to see your DC whenever. It sends you back 100 paces!
He already barged in at whenever time with no chaperone to collect his stuff after you laid down clear ground rules.
Apart from the fact that he does not care about the DC, he cares very much about using your children as a tool to manipulate the situation.
He is a user of the highest order and your DC are his target.

Hi Name, just caught up with your thread, and read about Captain Cockhead and his crying jag, which of course was just another manipulation to put you in the position where you wanted you - feeling bad for him and forgetting what your objectives where in all of this. I agree with others who say that while the friend who cam over for you that nice is probably a lovely woman, what you really need is a strong minded pit-bull to help you out. Pity, if I was near you, I would be happy to sort these 'men' out for you .

OK, a sales tactic that I once learned and found very, very useful years ago. It will help you with your perceptions of how things are going. Remember where you were when you first started your other thread? Firmly in the grip of an abusive relationship, right? Well ok, think of this on a sliding scale:

[-10]-[-5]-[0]-[+5]-[+10]

Now, months ago, would it be fair to say that you were at -10, in terms of your how far you were out of this relationship? (Adjust this if you don't agree ) And before Captain Cockhead's most recent visit, where were you? you were on your way towards zero at least. And now that he has visited, where are you now? OK, probably somewhere around -5 or -6, but still loads better than before. So guess what your aim is next? To get closer and closer to that zero mark again. Then you can start planning and implementing (remember they are your strengths ) to head towards +5. Eventually, you will be at +10 (yay!), where you will have gotten rid of him completely. This tactic helps you remain realistic about your goals, and to not slip into despair when one negative thing happens, because after it all, it was only one bad thing in a raft of really positive things that have happened so far.

You can also use this sliding scale to judge your confidence/happiness/etc, because this is going to help you get a long way in doing to right things to keep the divorce ball rolling. If you are feeling low, just think - "OK, I am at -4 today. What can I do to make this a -3? A hot bath? A chat on the phone to a good friend about nothing in particular? Doing something with my wonderful children?" This is one way in which you can keep yourself motivated and keep some perspective on the whole situation.

HTH

Oh, just remembered another thing - if he starts with "Name, I want to.....", your reply is "No, I don't want to, you need to go off and [see/reply to me through your lawyer]". You are under no obligations to pander to any of his wishes any longer. Just because he wants something, you are under no obligation whatsoever to provide him with it.

Brilliant advice Zazzles just brilliant!

Why, thank you FantasticButtocks!

Glad you're looking into changing lawyers Name - I can't believe she's speaking about him 'calling round' or this 'if he moves back' rubbish.
She should be trying to legally help you make this NOT happen, not fucking encourage it.
I could go on a long rant about DV, how many women are injured and killed each week because of fuckwitted people - including but not limited to - your solicitor, not taking people seriously. But now is not the time.

I'm glad you're feeling a little better than yesterday.
Hmm, Kids and contact - I think I also would drop them off at his brothers, You can beep, wait for an adult to come to the door/into view -then let the girls out of the car. Same for picking up - beep at your arrival and wait for them to brought out before opening your doors.
Or even better would be a public place.

Try your hardest not to let him into the house name, or be alone with him. He will use it as an opportunity to give you hell. He may be polite or friendly but remember he's got all of this anger and frustration inside of him, because of the living situation, what you've done issuing the papers but mostly because he knows he has no control over you. Be Careful.

He's following the well walked track of predictability name - While you know already what an arsehole he is/can be. (I'm not saying this to worry you, really I'm not)
He hasn't started yet - he's still being relatively tolerable.
If you do agree to let him visit then never be alone, always have a friend present, even invite a neighbour in for a coffee. Try everything within your power to force him to keep it to Email or text..... He will eventually shoot himself in the foot with something aggressive or threatening, it will be on record and can be of benefit to you ;)

TheName, if you're thinking about letting him back into the house, please re-read what IthoughtATMwasacashpoint posted at Thu 25-Sep-14 18:58:27.

Given his past history, things he has done and things he has said, you would not be safe and I can't believe your solicitor is advising you to allow it. You definitely need a solicitor with more experience of abusive relationships.

Yes brilliant zazzles thank you! A great way of looking at it actually I think I'm a -4 today. I was a -10 and some yesterday!

Thank you Carbe and everyone.

Well, I have phoned 2 domestic abuse specialist solicitors - both have initial fees obviously BUT because I already have a file with another solicitor they would both charge around £1000 to look at it and both advised that in cases like mine it is better to speak to my solicitors manager and say I am not happy with the service I am paying for and don't believe my fears are being taken seriously

I have the police coming over at 1pm on Monday for a two hour meeting on domestic abuse. They are going to want to take a statement and will outline what they can do for me - so that's one step in the right direction I guess.

your solicitor is fucking useless. Cant believe she is advising you let this arsehole back in your home.

And those other solicitors charging £1000 just to look at a file. So what the fuck are women who have little or no money because they have been financially abused supposed to do then.

No worries Name, it has helped me with many a difficult customer/sale that I had to work on over a period of months and months, and it helps you keep everything real, and quite logical.

Remember, Captain Cockhead will keep trying to push you back to -10, and your goal at the moment is to head towards 0. Recognise when he is trying to push you backwards, and you can put in strategies and tactics which either keep you where you are, or push you forward to your goal.

The same can be said for other influences in your life - if they are not pushing you towards your objective, then try to eliminate them from your game plan (not necessarily your life, though). Anything which pushes you towards -10 is bad, anything which pushes you towards +10 is good. Very simple, yet effective.

Thata's a huge step forward. Do you think you could keep the STBX away until after you've seen them?

I think it would be helpful to talk to Womens' Aid too, they might also have some valuable input on legal representation.

Not anything to kick yourself about at all.

Speaking to your solicitor's manager is a good starting point, they might have someone else within the practice that would be a better fit for what you need.

Hey you. Hope you're okay.

Sadly, your situation is 'normal' at the moment, and until he does anything horrific, you're experiencing your initial induction into the parallel universe of getting divorced.

Good to see you're talking to the police. I did too and was taken seriously even though my husband has never been physically violent.

Your solicitor is right I'm afraid. There's no such crime as 'Emotional Abuse' currently, and what I'm learning first hand, and through the stories of others, is that any action we take to defend our rights (going to the courthouse), just sends the other party apoplectic with rage and they get more and more extreme.

And we're all just stood around asking each other "Am I going mad?".

So your solicitor is right that you need to do everything you can at the moment to prove you're doing your best to stay away from the courthouse. These kinds of men just believe that the system, which is largely devised by men, for men is 'women-centric'.

I've said it before: Divorce is about splitting the assets and making arrangements for the kids, and not about who did what to whom.

It's an awful truth to cope with. KOKO.

Koko, name.
It is clear that your xh will disrespect any plan/time/purpose on any arrangement you make concerning dds, clothes, anything.
Quite bluntly, he needs to be trained. A thirty minute time window is reasonable. 31 min: nope, not happening. Is this you being a bitch? So? You need to do it or he will pull this crap every single time...forever. Brother not there as agreed? Deal is off, in the moment in his face. His disrespect must have consequences. The divorce is the ultimate consequence . No Geneva Convention here. So don't back down on the nitty gritty day to day administrative tasks concerning him. Train him.

You are detached as you said earlier. You really do not need to know what he is thinking. Keep him out of your head as fontella says.
If you have not already, and I think you said you have, but review your previous exit list about having your and your DDs passports and birth certificates and every other piece of important paper (baby photos) and jewelry put where he can not access it. Preferably your own safe deposit box. Also, anything you have that is worth anything, I would consider boxing up and storing at your friend's house. Best shoes, clothes, accessories, musical instrument, cds/DVD that are your favorites. Anything that you would be upset if he destroyed. That is the potential future if he moves back in.

Agree about your solicitor. Is she in a firm...anyone else there you could turn to?

Remind yourself of all this, taken from your earlier posts:

• He didn’t like you working, but he complained when you gave up and were a SAHM.
• When you moved to live 40 mins away from his work, he kept his rented room and stayed in it during the week.

• When you saw him at weekends he was “a moody, sullen, withdrawn shell of a man who when asked if ok either doesn't respond or looks at you with mild scorn.” “…you can cut the atmosphere with a knife. Needless to say I can't wait for him to just fuck off back out the door again Monday morning!”
• Once you said he wanted a divorce, he gave up the rented room and moved back home so he could keep a close eye on you
• He can’t deal with paperwork – you have to sort out all HIS work-related stuff, and yet he thinks the main problem in your marriage is that you don’t make lists! “When his business failed we ended up in huge debt and I dealt with all of it, opened all the scary letters, made all the scary phonecalls - even when in latent labour with dd2, we were being threatened with a ccj and I had to deal with it whilst in labour , give birth (a traumatic birth as well) and then get home and continue the phone calls and pleading while he took no paternity leave, no interest in the finances and left me to it.” “Even now, 6 years on from the repossession nightmare, I still feel anxious… those times have never left me - and he didn't give a shit at the time. He left me to deal with it all while he just kept 'working'” “He was laying it on thick that it's my responsibility to make sure he gets paid, not his… He tried to get a few derogatory names in there… It's my worst nightmare come round again. I'm so upset”
• “he is lovely… to everyone else but me” = he can turn on the charm when he wants to, and right now, he’s turning it on to you, but you know it won’t last. “he berates and brow beats me” – remember that!
• “He is violent - gets into fights a lot with strangers, loads and loads of verbal abuse, maniac driving and once spat in my face. I’m scared. I really hope the solicitor can help me. He sits with black eyes at Christmas dinner with the family because he couldn't help squaring up to some wrong'un the night before” “His temper can be psychotic and I'm scared of what he could do.”
• “In the last 6 months he has totally withheld affection, ignored me, been guarded, called me names when shouting at me, often given me the impression that I'm not good enough, I'm not as 'clever, organised, efficient' as him, freaked the kids out, intimidated me in public”
• “I've always faltered, answered his calls, sympathised with him when he's cried about the kids, believed the threats - it's intimidating when he phones over and over - but as everyone has said, if he really did love his kids as much as he says he would come back every night.”
• “The spit in the face has been apologised for and then dismissed as not that bad because… we've kissed before so we have exchanged saliva and that's all it was, saliva.”

• “He will use the kids to get at me. He does love them… but my god hand overs, just me and him and them on the doorstep? I wouldn't feel safe. He's unhinged and is not averse to the odd kick off in ear shot of the DC. DD1 talked about his temper to a teacher at school not that long ago”
• “That 'don't be silly' attitude, the jokey comments about me flinching when he goes in for a kiss… asking me how I am (not 100% interested and only does it now because I pointed out he never did)… but then ignoring me a couple of times and mildly picking on me about something too actually” – and that’s him in nice mode!
• “If I ignore him he'll start picking on me and then I give him the "I don't care" shrug then that's very likely going to make him turn really nasty”
• “H has never in all these years made me a decent cup of tea. Never. I like builders tea, strong with only drop of milk and yet whenever he makes me one it's literally poo tea! Gnat's piss tea with loads of milk. I have to make myself a new one or put another tea bag in it - every time?! Even that's bloody deliberate isn't it? He does it so that he can call me a fussy, spoilt bastard or whatever comes to mind when I can't drink it and need to fix it!!”
• “It's because he is so controlling that he is forcing me to 'care' about him and his every need and forget me and who I am and what I want because I don't matter, only he does.” “I'm so used to focussing on him and his myriad problems and never being focused on myself”
• “when his business failed… he wasn't rallying around to help us. He wasn't welling up at our situation and determined to sort it out even though fully capable. He could easily have just stopped what he was doing and gone back to his old job, but no, he needed to properly run me into the ground first.”
• “Night from hell… So, met him at the restaurant, it soon became apparent that he had it in for me, really went to town about the mortgage payment. it was horrible, he got that nasty dilated pupil glare going at me - he was not having it all that he was at fault… I did point out to him in the restaurant, when he was going on about the same thing over and over, that he was behaving unreasonably and that his point had been made - it silenced him for all of a minute before he started again.”
• “I could just forget it all - just try and be his friend and keep him happy, keep trying to snuggle up to him even when he's being both physically and mentally dismissive, try and sleep in the same bed as him and pretend it isn't excruciating, turn a blind eye to the moods and the scary atmosphere he's trying to create and the maniac driving, reckon to myself that the kids could do with better discipline than I can give - funny they behave so much better for him. But no, the thought of that is just unbearable”

And that’s just from the first few pages of your previous thread. And it’s not funny that the kids behave better for him – they’re probably scared of what will happen if they misbehave.

Now, is that really what you want to let back into your home? Don't let him in to see the girls (let him see them outside the home if necessary) and don't, don't, don't ever let him move back in. Please!

Name that is what McDonalds is for! So men like SPC (shitty plastic chair - ar ar!) can take the kids somewhere that is not on the abused wifes patch FFS. He does NOT have to come in. That is why he got his bag of clothes. Get a SHL not the dweeb you have been lumbered with. 'If he moves back in' FFS. I am as near speechless as I have ever been!

Mitzie thank you so so much for taking the time to do that for me - reading it all like that is mind blowing!!

I just wanted to paste a bit from my solicitor letter which is what she is saying explains my position

'On this basis, I advised that while H returning to the property may be frustrating and rather uncomfortable for you all, on the basis of your current instructions, you are not at risk of suffering imminent harm. However, if H's behaviour should deteriorate at all, we will need to reconsider whether an application is required at that stage. Please therefore keep me up to date on any developments.
Furthermore, as we discussed, if there is no imminent risk of significant harm, the court is unlikely to ask H to leave the former matrimonial home, which is the result you are seeking. There are several options available to the court when considering an application for an occupation order. One such consideration could be to regulate the way in which you and H use the property, for example, by stating the times when you may use the kitchen and bathroom and identify which rooms of the house you may go into.
I advised that this situation is rarely a satisfactory outcome for individuals who are seeking a full occupation order and for the respondent to be ordered to leave the property.
Finally, if you were to make an application on notice, which would mean a copy of your application form, including your statement setting out your evidence, and notice of the hearing will be sent to H before you go before a Judge. By the time of the hearing, H will have had sufficient time to prepare his defence to the allegations.
In these circumstances, when the court is faced with contradictory evidence, it is unlikely that an order will be made until such time as full evidence has been heard by both parties. This is only likely to take place at a further hearing at which both yourself and H will give oral evidence to the court. It must be borne in mind however that this further hearing may be several months away. Therefore, unless it can be agreed with H that an order is made, in the period leading up to the next hearing you are unlikely to have any protection in place.
I do therefore propose that we keep H's behaviour under review and if it becomes necessary for an application to be made in the future, we reconsider matters at that time.'

See what the police have to say on Monday. Be sure to tell them about the spitting. As far as I am aware the act of spitting in someone's face is assault. If any of it lands then it's assault and battery, it's also something physical to tell them.

Whatever else, it demonstrates his absolute contempt towards you.

Perhaps, over the weekend, you could write things down so that all the events are coherently in place for Monday and you're not relying on memory. Especially the barrage of e mails and phone calls, his totally ignoring your request for no contact and any arrangements you have made to safeguard yourself againt him since the papers were served