Inviting a Crossdresser on your Hen Night

[rachelmonday1]

I'm actually a guy that enjoys crossdressing and am very fortunate to have a number of female friends, one of whom is getting married and has invited me to join her friends on her Hen Night. I don't look too bad when I'm dressed as Rachel and often go out with the girls with no problems.

I'm happily married and my wife understands the "Rachel" side of me, but thinks it's odd that a girl would invite a crossdresser on her Hen Night.

Any views out there?

But my body language is no different to that of the people that I'm with, so I fail to see the issue.

But no one has the same body language.

I know that wearing particular styles of shoes and clothes does affect your posture and gait and so on (well, it does me,) but it just means it's different for me. I don't suddenly adopt all the same mannerisms and physical habits of everyone else. Some people really talk with their hands, others are much stiller. Some will twist their hands with anxiety, others might twiddle their hair or pull at a button on their clothes. Some people stand tall and straight, others are more slouchy. (I do sometimes get tempted to walk round the office, saying, "Sit up straight! Shoulders back!" and introduce deportment badges, but I think that's something for HR, not me...)

Your body language will be different from that of the people you're with, because we're all different.

I am confused by Offreds suggestions that dressing in women's clothes is sexist? I do it every single day. Am I sexist?

But you aren't because you are aping female behaviour. You are not at any stage trying to actually become female.

So I would say the reason perhaps you can't recognise these qualities in yourself which are seen as male and female without identifying as separate personas is perhaps because you want to be accepted by these different (sexist) groups.

Neither would like you, you perhaps fear, if you simply presented your natural mixture of 'male' and 'female' qualities because that would threaten their sexist attitudes.

LRDtheFeministDragon: I have never tried to turn this into a masculine vs feminine thing. My point was simply that I'm a guy that likes to present themselves as female and to socialise with women that accept this.

But you have turned it into a masculine versus feminine thing. How not?

prolific - ok, is a white person blacking up racist?

OK first of all; What the fuck is a TERF?

Interesting thread. I pretty much agree with Offred in terms of the general sociological phenomenon. I've always thought much the same about transgender issues and feel a lot of support for people who have written similar opinions about it. I'd never really applied the same analysis to cross dressing (TBH I've probably always thought cross-dressing WAS only "happening to like wearing some clothes that were intended for women; I'd never thought about the fetishizing aspect of it). But it makes sense.

Not sure I would attack or even concern myself with the choices and actions of another individual over it though. That might be partly because I'm a man, so I'm not so directly invested in feminist issues. Partly as well though, I really think people just differ hugely when it comes to attitudes to gender.

I'm like Offred in that I really don't get what the whole things about and would rather we could just do away with it all. Transsexuals and crossdressers then seem to me to just be exchanging one box of meaningless bullshit for another. I don't see how that furthers the vision of humanity that I see as healthy: one in which people don't have to choose a box at all.

But when I've discussed this with others, they often reply that they really DO know what it "feels like to be a woman" (or a man), and that it's a real, subjectively felt part of their identity.

Not sure I've got the right to tell them it shouldn't be, just because it isn't part of mine and I don't understand it.

I don't think that being transsexual is the same as crossdressing.

If it is that you are seeking out the sexist groups to maintain your own sexist views that's a different matter though. If you're using them to confirm your view of femininity/masculinity then that's more in keeping with what I previously articulated - this fracturing of yourself because you cannot/will not recognise gender as a social construct.

Kim147: I do sometimes wear jeans and a top with heels.

Offred: I can't accept that point. As I mentioned earlier, I have a wide circle of friends, some who know me as Richard, some as Rachel and some as both. This thread was simply about whether someone like myself being invited on a Hen Night would be deemed "odd" (probably a bad initial choice or words).

No, I don't think it is exactly the same thing. I do think it is similar. It's less about asserting male power because the whole thing is that (male to female) transsexuals are trying to obliterate their maleness.

I'm a guy that likes to present themselves as female and to socialise with women that accept this

Well I'm female and I went out last night wearing black trousers and a red and black t-shirt. Flat black shoes. Mascara and lipstick. Have you ever gone out dressed as a woman like me? I doubt it.

Because, to you, presenting as female means presenting as a society-formed version of what a woman should look like. Do you socialise with our male friends when dressed as a woman? If not why not, do you not expect men to accept it like you say women do?

Fairenuff: See earlier point ie: yes I do sometimes trousers, top and heels. Yes, some of my male friends know Richard and Rachel, with no problem. Also, men do chat when I'm out and I've never experienced anything negative or threatening

I have looked at your photos and think you look quite stunning, enjoy your evening. Ps I live in Dorset too !

Thankyou Mummylin!! :)

TERF = Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminist

It is generally used in an insulting fashion to dismiss the views of women who disagree that male to female trans people are biological women.

yes I do sometimes trousers, top and heels

I didn't ask if you wore them, I asked if you go out for a night out as a woman dressed in them, and I said flats, not heels. Just fairly plain but smart clothes that lots of women wear.

Yes, some of my male friends know Richard and Rachel, with no problem.

Do you go out with your male friends dressed as a woman. If so I don't see why you can't go out with your female friends dressed as a man. I don't see how you need to compartmentalise all these aspects of, what is, after all, just one person.

I think you're missing my point Fairenuff. I have a comprehensive wardrobe that includes trousers, heels, boots, flip-flops and flatties. I wear what I feel like wearing and the point is that this thread is about me having been INVITED out as Rachel. I generally accept invitations that are directed to either Richard or Rachel and those that give me a choice as to what to wear. I think people are reading far more into this than is necessary :)

Ok, so, what was the relationship problem that you wanted to discuss

Did you mean that to come across as quite so dismissive, rachel?

She has a right to make her point.

Some women actually don't feel comfortable with the idea of heels being 'feminine', and it is know they damage your body.

You are very lucky to have the choice you have. But many people don't. I don't see why you are so hostile to people who have fewer choices than you trying to explain why you are making them feel a bit uneasy. You did start a thread asking, after all.

Again, maybe a poor choice of Topic. I only put it in here because I couldn't see anywhere more suitable and it was a question about my wifes' viewpoint. The are no "issues", I was simply curious about what other women thought. Things seem to have gone completely off subject!

I understand that you have been INVITED out as Rachel but what makes you think you wouldn't be welcome if you turned up as yourself? I've asked this about four times now.

Are you saying that the woman who has invited you doesn't know that you're male?

Apologies if my earlier comment appeared dismissive. It certainly wasn't intended that way. I was simply trying to make a point that I do wear clothes that most women would term as "everyday" wear and that I do accept invitations from both my male and female friends, with the male ones being broad-minded enough to accept who I am. That was also not intended to be dismissive, if taken that way.

Fairenuff: I don't know that I WOULDN'T be accepted, but I simply want to enjoy the evening as Rachel, in the way that I was invited. Yes, they know I'm a guy.

She was asking basically I think if you go out as rachel but dressed in clothes that would not identify you as a woman.

It is very interesting that you want to canvass women's views particularly... Will they be different to mixed or men's? That last CD wanted exactly the same... Women's views...