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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

DD, counselling and unhappy ExH

134 replies

FushandChups · 17/03/2014 16:45

Since my separation early last year, DD has been coping less and less and following the recent implementation of 50/50 care, seems to have got worse. I decided that i can't bear to see her so unhappy and after speaking with her teacher who has also seen a change, arranged to see the school nurse. This is to get some advice and ultimately, i would like to use this as a way to access some counselling for her. She is in reception.

H is absolutely adamant that this must not happen. He doesn't want me speaking to the nurse and if i do, she's not allowed to speak to anyone else. DD can talk to him (as its obviously me making her sad because she's fine when she's with him) but no way is she to talk to anyone else.

In brief, he doesn't want her labelled and no matter what i say about there being no possibility of her being labelled, it can only help her, she needs to talk to someone that is completely separate from the situation, he is stating it is not happening.

I don't know what to do other than just plough on as she is really hurting and i don't think me or him is enough for her at the moment. She needs some extra help in coping with what has happened but he is obsessed with this label issue.

He is her father so obviously has every right to say no but on this occasion, i think he is not looking at the big picture. I want DD to be happy with herself and her situation and think this could be a hugely helpful step.

Has anyone been through this with their DC post separation? Did it help them? Or should i just carry on, watching my DD just get sadder and sadder?

OP posts:

Breadkneadslove · 18/03/2014 11:36

If I've got this right, he was the sahm parent before you spilt and now the arrangement is 50:50 contact with shared parenting. You have all gone through a huge change in the past year and it takes time for everyone involved to settle into the next stage, for children however it is likely that this will be a lot more up and down.

I think in the first instance you need to try to get to a place with your exh that you can have open discussions about your DC's, so that the DC's feel as though mum and dad are coming from the same place and not battling against each other.

In this instance, approach him again, ask for his thoughts, ask him to describe her behavior to see if you can recognise what you feel is happening. Go to the teacher / nurse together and discuss jointly.

If it's done as a joint thing then it makes it harder to deny if the issues are being brought up by the school. If it's just you highlighting what you feel is going on he may be hearing it as blame or that you are being controlling.

Things may just settle in time as she adjusts into the new rhythm of her life and it may just help her to know that mum and dad are working together for her and that people are there for her if she needs or wants to talk whether that be, mum, dad, wider family or school.

horsetowater · 18/03/2014 12:19

Fush I think you need to make sure you don't panic and get anxious because this will come across wrong. Try and play it cool, but make sure you drop serious hints about the responsibility he is undertaking by choosing not to allow dd this support. Put it in emails, so there is clear evidence of who is saying what and that this is his choice. Perhaps tell him you will leave it for x weeks to see 'how she goes' and see if things have got any better.

Copy the school into everything.

Monetbyhimself · 18/03/2014 12:24

I'm sorry Hush but this raises huge red flags to me. He is completely dismissing your concerns. What is he trying to hide ?

Breadkneadslove · 18/03/2014 12:35

Sorry fush, our posts crossed, it doesn't seem as though he is being as helpful as he could. It also seems that there are differing views on how your daughter is doing. Unless her teacher is off long term sick, I would hang back and make an appointment to see her as ultimately, at school, she knows your daughter best.

Did your exh use to come to school meetings before, so you think that you would be able to get him onside to go together so you can all try to build a full picture of how things are for your dd at the moment, is in put is really valuable in all of this?

You mentioned you had an appointment with your gp, this is a good place for you to go and get and support for you and it may lead on to more ongoing support for yourself. Discuss also with them about how you feel your DD is coping and see what they suggest.

Breadkneadslove · 18/03/2014 12:37

Original poster

FushandChups · 18/03/2014 18:02

H has now threatened social services and will go for sole custody as i am psychologically damaging our children

His gf sat down with her tonight and asked her questions about me (inappropriate much!) and DD said some worrying things.

on the plus side, he has agreed to counselling on the proviso that when if i am the problem, he will have to go over my head and get social services involved.

I'm much calmer now, believe it or not, because the call highlighted to me how deluded about the situation he is. Everything is my fault, everything! He takes no responsibility for anything!

OP posts:

Handywoman · 18/03/2014 18:23

OMG fush that's terrible. Let him refer to SS. It will be a big waste of time and he is simply digging himself into a hole. Poor you. He sounds controlling and self-interested.

longtallsally2 · 18/03/2014 18:37

Oh fush, what a pain! I am glad that your h has now agreed to counselling for your dd. Do hang onto a copy of this thread, so that if you are doubting yourself, and the fact that you suggested this for your dd because she is unhappy, then you will have some reassurance of the timeline.

FWIW, your dd may be sadder when she is with you because she feels safe to be herself when she is with you. At school she has distractions, and at your h's she has the attention of the two of them, and of a new bedroom/new things to get used to. When she is with you she is presumably also in the home that you and your h used to share, so is forced to face up to the fact that he has gone.

A good counsellor will help her to confront these feelings out of her home, and help her to feel more empowered to deal with them. It can't be wrong to seek help for her to deal with those feelings, and if your h is right and you are projecting any sadness onto her, she will therefore get the help she needs to be herself. You have done the right thing asking for some support for her.

HTH. Thinking of you

Peacesword · 18/03/2014 21:32

The gf needs to butt out. It's totally inappropriate for her to be asking her questions about you.

FrogbyAnotherName · 18/03/2014 21:41

peace that may well be true, but there is nothing the OP can do about that.

OP. - I'm a great believer in giving people enough rope to hang themselves, and that includes ex's.
If, as you believe, your ex is a decent Dad but is having a wobble for whatever reason, then he will come to his senses eventually - as long as you low him to experience the natural consequences of his decisions.

While not ideal for her , your DD is resilient, and in a few years, this upset is likely to be a forgotten memory.

Peacesword · 18/03/2014 22:03

I didn't say there was anything she could do. But it throws another light in this supposed great Dad, if he has allowed it.

Original poster

FushandChups · 18/03/2014 22:40

He did mention on the phone that DD could always talk to someone he knows who's been through it - ddint realise this would be gf! Just lower than low and of all the things said over the last couple of days, this has probably made me the most but rise above etc.

I'm just going to lett him get on with it, thinking he's right and father of the year. He agreed to counselling which was the whole start of this sorry mess, so its something.

Thank you for your support - you can't help but doubt yourself when someone is so convinced they are right but he is so aggressive and unreasonable it does make it easier to write off what he's saying.

He was never like this in the marriage though - that's what i find so weird but then he had to tell me to my face then - he's much more comfortable screaming over a phone or sending horrible texts.

Makes me soooo glad I'm no longer with him though!

OP posts:

FrogbyAnotherName · 18/03/2014 23:12

fush I remember sobbing to our mediator after I'd fled the room crying that my ex isn't right.......he's not well.......this isn't him.

For some reason, my DDs dad became someone I didn't recognise after we spilt - and it was incredibly hard to stick to my convictions that it was best for DD to have equal care by both of us.

But, after a while (ages) and gradually, he became the Dad to DD that I remembered, the Dad who I was certain DD would benefit from having as an equal parent in her life.

Don't give up hope yet - this may be an aberration on your exs part. I'm not making excuses for him, but you can't change his behaviour no matter how much you may want to.

I am, frankly, amazed at how much I have forgiven my ex for; he put me through hell, and it wasn't good for DD in the short term - but long term, it is what is right for her.

Original poster

FushandChups · 18/03/2014 23:42

Thanks Frog - I'm sure it will all work out but he has such hatred for me, he utterly despises me and i don't know what I've done I am far off being perfect but he makes me out to be some crazy, unbalanced liar.. which i know i'm not

Can i ask a co-sleeping question? At night, DD can get quite distressed and asks to come into my bed. i let her - it makes her feel better and sleep better but apparently this is weird and making her worse She is 5 in a few months so not tiny but she gets so sad and is begging me and i want to help her - think its a security thing? Would you make her stay in her bed, even if it made her hysterical? H thinks i should leave her to cry it out but i can't

OP posts:

Qix · 18/03/2014 23:56

The key to this is that you shouldn't be meddling in each other's parenting. He can mind his own business about where your DD sleeps when she's with you, just have you've resolved not to complain about his GF.

I remember once trying to say something to my ex about how he parents our DD and he pointed out (quite rightly) that we need to trust each other, and if I have a right to tell him what to do then he would have a right to tell me what to do as well, which I would obviously object to.

Co sleeping is fine. It is an acknowledged fact that small children going through a separation often regress, and this is just part of that.

Qix · 18/03/2014 23:58

Anyway, co sleeping is lovely and well within the bounds of normal parenting.

Original poster

FushandChups · 19/03/2014 00:01

Thanks Qix - she is benefiting from it and just seems to sleep better - she cries out a lot otherwise. Poor little thing

OP posts:

Qix · 19/03/2014 00:13

It's horrible that he should make you feel bad about something that is so obviously right.

Lweji · 19/03/2014 04:41

Your ex is an idiot.

When I separated DS, who was 6 then, slept with me almost every night for a couple of months at least. And there was no crying.

3 years on he's fine. He's balanced and quite happy with himself. He still sleeps with me if he wants to, although he chooses his own bed almost always. Only comes in when he's ill or if he wakes up in the night (cold or a nightmare).

At the moment she's realising that people decide to leave each other, people she thought were always together, and she may be scared she is going to be left behind at some point too, as well as missing the other parent.

Give her as much reassurance and love as you can. When she needs it. Even at night.

Monetbyhimself · 19/03/2014 07:05

It is completely healthy and 'normal' for a little girl to need comfort and closeness to her mummy when she is distressed. And I would hazard a guess that when she wakes up distressed in the night at his she receives no such comfort and closeness? Let SS get involved. Let his parenting come under scrutiny. 50:50 parenting ONLY works if parents are not in conflict and adapt pretty much the same approach to parenting. He is worlds apart from you in terms of giving your child emotional care. You have all thevinformation you need to stop this arrangement. It's no wonder she's upset. Imagine her lying in bed at daddys, upset and lonely,in desperate need if a cuddle but knowing that she'll be told off if she goes to him.

Original poster

FushandChups · 19/03/2014 08:19

Thank You so much. The sleeping thing has been really bothering me.

I think it is helping her and making her feel secure but he implied it is just wrong and weird and damaging He says that when she comes to him for a cuddle in the night, he sends her back to bed (presume she gets the cuddle though) but this isn't just a quick cuddle she's asking for from me. Its feeling secure enough to sleep deeply for the rest of the night and i can't, well i won't leave her sad and alone in her room.

OP posts:

Lweji · 19/03/2014 08:23

Did I mention he is an idiot?

Covalone78 · 19/03/2014 08:43

I made exactly the same mistake as your Ex. It was about "tarnishing the family" I suspect. I couldn't accept my DD was anything less than perfect (we separated when DD was 2). My Ex wanted to do all sorts of things, tests, counselling etc. I wouldn't have it. DD lived with Ex and got worse (Ex was a little highly strung). When DD was 14 Ex had had enough. Took of with her bf and DD came to live with me (that caused even more issues as DD felt she had been dumped). I worked full time, often from 6am to 8pm. DD was latchkey and got in with the wrong types. Got into drugs, sex for drugs all sorts of other things (I was not familar with drug impacts so did not recognise, this came out later - She is now 20 with her own kid which I haven't seen and nas been NC for almost 2 years).

This story is much longer but the message is OP that I behaved like your Ex and may have been responsible for ruining my DDs life

anonacfr · 19/03/2014 08:46

I was told that co sleeping should not be made into a long term thing. The theory was that by letting the child come into your bed you're effectively confirming their anxiety- but obviously in your case there has been a massive transition to adjust to.
Also it seems that sadly your DD probably gets very negative vibes/comments about you when she stays with her father.

There is no way I would let a five year old cry herself to sleep alone in her bed. She's not a baby or a toddler- I would say sleep with her as long as you two want/need to and just don't tell your ex. It's none of his business and it sounds like whatever you do he would probably turn it against you.
I bet if you let her cry he would probably say that it's awful and damaging.

You poor thing. He's awful. Trust your judgement you sound like a lovely mum.

maggiemight · 19/03/2014 08:51

Just wondering if your understandable concerns for DD are making you seem unhappy and that that might add to her 'worries', that 'Poor mummy is sad'.

And if you can appear positive and optimistic for the future (possibly you already are) and cheerful then it might rub off on her.

Ex will diminish any problems as then he might have to feel some guilt.

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