social services are destroying my family

[justalilmummy]

Social services have ruined my family and I just dont know what to do anymore, I want to run away from it all
My partner had a mental breakdown 15 months ago, leading up to this there were a few issues (arguments got out of hand abd police were called, 3 times last time 2.5 years ago)
After hes breakdown social services became involved and we were under a child in need plan
The plan said I was to protect my children by not allowing the children to be alone with their father - which I did
Partner after being released from the psychiatric hospital after 8 days was allocated a mental health nurse who he saw regularly
Everything was going great social workers visited as they still had a slight concern about dp state of mind
4 months ago he was discharged completly as they felt he was fine now and he did not have a mental disorder
Things took a bad turn after this as social worker did not agree with the decision
They first tried to convince dp to go to the doctors and get medication to help hes ' depression' even though he does not have it.
Dp did not do this so one day they turned up in the evening and said they are very concerned and he is not to come inside the family home, we were shocked by this but he went and stayed at hes mums, which we again did
6 weeks ago a child protection conference was held and they have put the children on child protection for the 'risk of emotional abuse' as father refuses to accept hes problem and I am downplaying hes mental health issues even though hes mental health worker says he doesnt have any mental disorder!
The conference was held as if he was still in the family home which he is not
Its now got even worse as they have told us that I need therapy to come to terms with the 'domestic abuse' I have suffered and my child needs therapy as well, also dp has to attend a parenting course.
They have made it very difficult for dp to attend any of these meetings as they hold them all in the afternoon even though we have repeatedly told them he can only do mornings coz of hes work
They threatened me this afternoon that as I am reluctant to go to therapy I'm giving het ammunition to take it to court for a care order
I must add there has been absolutely no issue since hes breakdown 15 months ago
This is having an awful effect on my 4 year old ds, he is waking nightly crying for hes daddy, hes begun wetting himself at school and s not eating properly
I just dont know what to do, they say this is coz he is at risk of emotional damage when it's them causing all the upset in this household :-(

There is also the fact that the police were called due to a violent incident, DP had a mental health crisis and you got pregnant all in less than a year.
I appreciate you feel that things have changed, and they probably have. But the social worker needs hard evidence of that. I'm not entirely clear what has precipitated the scaling up to CP proceedings but the report should lay out all the concerns very clearly.

I think you need real life advice and preferably someone to advocate for you.

But I also think you need to start being organised and practical.

1. Write a list of everything SS have asked you and your DP to do. Then in the next column write very honestly whether you have done that. Then in a third column write why you have fallen short. Use that to either look at your own and DP's behaviour, whether there any barriers, what you need to ask for help for etc.

1. Ask SS to be very clear in setting out what needs to change and how you can demonstrate that. The second bit is key. It is not good enough for you to say "we're fine, we're fine." Your friends will likely not believe you, why would SS?

I also think you need, with the help of RL support, to make sure you're clear on why SS are involved. People on this thread are giving you likely explanations that you're just skipping past. Until you understand their concerns you're not going to address them.

The mental health nurse has said to them, written in writing and he has also been treated for hes depression
They refuse to believe he is not still depressed and will not listen to her
I get why they are involved I really really do I'm just scared and very upset about the whole situation
We are willing to do everything, we have been doing everything they say
I may be in the wrong here but I have never questioned anything they have said and gone along with every plan put in place although they are making it difficult
What upset me the most was when he suggested therapy I dared to question it she basically threatened me to go to court and apply for a care order, this is when I started to feel I am being unfairly treated as before this they had always said they had no issues with how I care for the children and have said on numerous occasions that I am a good mum
We do everything thet say and it keeps getting worse

Have you asked them why they discount the mental health nurse's evidence? What else do they need to see?

Re the therapy, why did you refuse? What's the worst that's going to happen if you and your DS see a therapist? Therapy isn't about how you care for your children, it's to help you work out your own feelings and how you respond to them.

You say you do everything they say but I do think you need to be methodical and break that down. You know your DP isn't doing everything they say. I don't think I've ever 100% complied with anything in my life so I'm both in awe of and suspicious of anyone who says they're doing everything!

I can tell you're upset, but being frustrated isn't going to help you.

I didnt refuse I asked why I needed it, they made it sound as though it was optional
They asked for ds to have therapy and I straight away said ok
It was only for me that I said I felt I didnt really need it, I realise now it was a stupid mistake
Must add I did agree to it after she said about going to court

HE needs to ask IN WRITING why they are discounting the written statement of a MH care professional, what their concerns are for the future, and how HE can alleviate those concerns.

They absolutely CANNOT force him to take anti depressants against the advice of a MH care professional, and also his GP who has refused to prescribe them.

BUT the question as to WHY the SS are discounting these medical opinions, AND what they feel he needs to do to alleviate those concerns MUST come FROM HIM, IN WRITING.

At first it was agreed that if appears to become unwell again then he would seek help, he hasn't felt unwell again
Also if he was ever to become angry I was to call police,again this hasn't happened yet
Then they said he was not to be left unsupervised, we were already doing that he hadnt been alone with the children for a long time
Then he was discharged by hes mental health nurse as after an evaluation with her and a psychiatrist they felt he was no longer depressed or suffering from any other mental disorder
That was when she suddenly turned up and said she is very concerned and her manager has told her that he must be removed immediately from the family home and only have contact with the children in a public place, we were obviously very upset about it but agreed none the less
My dp was told after he came out of hospital that he would have ongoing work with mental health team and take medication, which he did
So yes we have followed everything she told us to do
The child protection was held as though he was still living in the family home

Is the HV not more involved? Child protection is their remit and I would have expected them to be visiting regularly, a good HV will work with you and be supportive while keeping CP paramount. They should help you manage ds's behaviour during this difficult period, why not ring and ask if they'll come see you and chat about the bed wetting etc.

I would write a letter to social services and copy it to all the professionals involved (Sw, sw's boss, HV, GP etc, and cc to your MP) detailing the steps you and your dh have taken to comply with what's asked and stating you cannot access certain services without SW referral, can this be done ASAP. Keep it calm, polite and factual and see if that helps you get on courses etc.

Also your SW must take annual leave sometimes...see if you get on better with whoever covers her holidays, you might feel better if you see a different SW and more able to hold your heads up and carry on working towards resolution.

Good luck.

Justalilmummy

I am a domestic violence/rape survivor and I know what you're going through .

It doesn't matter if you are saying everything is fine now. After you called the police, in three separate occasions, you actually signalled everybody you were under abuse.

They won't trust your word because social workers are trained not to believe the victims are 'over' it. It is their job and after a while you can understand where they are coming from.

One of the psychological stages of domestic violence and abuse is denial.
We even get to the point that it is our fault everything happened. Think that I even denied rape until a certain moment!

My advice would be to look for help and support at domestic abuse associations, such as women's aid or victim support. From there, work with them to find a capable lawyer who can take up your case.

Bug them until you get the support you need, don't get discouraged!
Then, if necessary go to therapy. It doesn't matter if you need it or not, it won't do any harm, right? :)

Big hug and I hope you can sort it out. If you need any address, feel free to PM me :)

Are any of your bills still in his name at YOUR address? Or is any of his post still being sent to your address?

If so, change the names on the bills to YOUR name TODAY. And get him to change the addresses of any of his post that is still sent to your address TODAY.

I fear they do not believe that he is living elsewhere, or that they believe that as you are not fully accepting the previous incidents as DV (which they WERE, regardless of your partner's MH at the time, regardless of the fact that your DC wasn't in the house at the time), that you are allowing him to be in your house.

Sometimes, if post for him goes to your address, or any of your utility bills are in his name, or paid from his bank account, it can be seen as that you are still FINANCIALLY linked, and then they won't believe you that he is not coming to your house.

Yea I'm gonna do the therapy
Its just so very hard to prove that things are going ok when they look at u so suspiciously

You DO NEED to understand and accept that you have been a victim of DV.

It doesn't matter to SS the reason WHY he committed DV, it matters that he DID, IYSWIM.

You and I know that he was obviously suffering from serious MH issues at the time, and may not have been in full control of himself, but that is an explanation of WHY, NOT a get-off clause for your partner.

As you have been a victim of previous DV, and you don't seem to be accepting that fact, that WILL give SS cause for concern that if you still can't see that you were a victim of DV, that you may be unable to prevent future incidents of DV, and may be unable to keep both you and your DC's safe.

Do you see the problem with trying to explain away the DV with the fact that he was suffering from MH issues at the time, and is 'fine now' so it won't happen again?

Nope no bills in hes name
They also do spot checks and have never once found him here, cant really do alot more to prove hes not here

I'm sorry to hear that you are going through this

Please try to get the therapy that the SW suggests, as soon as possible.

As suggested send a respectful letter to the SW reminding her that you need a referral and that it is very important to you
Speak to your GP requesting the same. Often GP surgeries will have some access to therapy and it will show that you are willing to try whatever is required.

Parenting classes are often over subscribed and they may take a while for your partner to access.
As suggested, get him to send a letter to the SW requesting a place asap. Get him to speak to his GP to get a speedy referral to therapy as well
Ask for a copy of your medical records

If there is an ongoing question of an issue with your partner's mh, please get him to ask the GP for further assessment.
Write a letter to the GP explaining the importance of the assessment. Make the letter calm and factual. Request the assessment and state the reasons so that you can get an overview of other professional's opinions.
Ask for a copy of his medical records.

Stop looking at this as something that is unfair. Fairness isn't the issue now.
I mean that with complete respect and regard.

Continually trying to make SS see that there isn't a problem and that you should not be in the process will make them dig their heels in more.
Accept where you are with them now and work at moving away from this place.

Recognise that they feel that there is an issue that need to be addressed. Comply with every thing they request. Follow up meetings with calm letters. Go to the GP. Always speak calmly and quietly in meetings. DO EXACTLY AS THEY REQUEST. Get your partner to attend meetings.

I hope that everything works better from this point.
Parenting classes, therapy and even anger management are all things that will help you parent better in the future.

Try to look at the positives from this. Once you can try to change your attitude to these interventions SS often becomes a more helpful friendly place to deal with.

Couthy speaks sense. I can see why the SW feels you are minimising to be honest.

mummy Sorry this is long, I hope you read it because I hope to explain some of it :)

I work with, and have worked in the past with, a number of vulnerable families some of whom have/have had CP involvement.

Without exception, in cases like yours, parents feel that:

The SW is "shit" or has got it in for them
The SW wants to take their children
The SW is seeing things that aren't there
They don't need any support
The other professionals have also got it in for them...

If you agree to something after court is threatened, that is seen as not being obstructive, but is not positive because you're agreeing to avoid a 'sanction' and not working with the people who are working to make sure your children are safe because you understand why it is necessary.

As far as the MH assessment goes, they are only commenting on your partner and his current mental health status. The SW are acting on behalf of your children and they are assessing the risk of harm to your children should he have another episode in the future. As someone else said, it is conjecture, but looking at history, patterns of behaviour and other contributing factors is the best tool the SWs have for assessing the risk of future harm. And your reaction to it all demonstrates your ability to recognise the potential for that risk to arise and your ability to respond appropriately to it if it should.

For example:

An Initial Assessment was completed on my family a couple of years ago. My exh and I discovered that a PPRC had had contact with my children over an extended period of time. There was no risk from my exH or I directly, but they had to assess mine and exH's ability to safeguard the children from any risk. We already had suspicions and so had been safeguarding them (never alone with the person) and the case was closed.

It is horrible having someone come into your home, and comment on your decor and furnishing in a report along with questioning how you discipline your children, and what activities they do before corroborating it with your children in their bedrooms in private (so that they can see the state of their rooms, whether they have a bed or not, the presence of age appropriate toys etc). But you do it.

The Police were also involved briefly. They had no concerns whatsoever, but that's because they were interested in whether a new crime had been committed. But the LA still completed their assessment because they were interested in mine and exH's ability to protect our children from this person. Even though the Police were not interested (no reason to be) the SW told us that if we continued to have contact with the person/people involved then they would progress to a S47 Enquiry. Even though a crime had not been committed. It was a done deal because ExH and I had already decided we wouldn't have any contact with them again, but can you see the parallels between this situation and yours?

In your case, the MH team are my police - there is no reason for them to be involved, but the SWs have a different agenda. The LA need to believe that the parent/s have the ability to recognise risk and protect the children from it should it arise in the future.

Yea I see where u re coming from about the dv
I dont know how to prove it wont happen again
We all agreed to the therapy and he has agreed to do the parenting course, and I also asked if I could do it too
They want proof he wont get depressed again,
We cant guarantee that just like we cant guarantee anyone wont suffer from it it's unpredictable, but I will see the warnings signs and will know how to get help next time

Sorry, I left out an important bit!

Parents often feel like that precisely because they are vulnerable and the other people can see something they can't.

Wasn't criticising parents for feeling like that!

You CAN get through this. You CAN. I'm still here, at the other end of my second SS CIN investigation in 16 years. They closed my case last June, but didn't even tell ME that the case was closed until the August. (!)

1. You need to accept and understand that you WERE a victim of domestic violence.

1. You need to write a letter about the delay in referrals.

1. You need to get a copy of your Social Services complaints procedure, and their timescales - this MUST be available in their offices.

1. Find out who your Social Worker's immediate boss is, who SHE reports to. Copy that person in to ALL written requests.

1. Take notes during EVERY meeting with your Social Worker, even in your home. When she tells you that you need to do X, repeat that back to her, and ask if that is correct, so that you have accurate notes.

1. During every meeting, request a copy of the minutes. You are entitled to receive a copy of these. They WILL delay this. When they do, WRITE first to the Social Worker, asking for them within 7 days, and then to the Social Worker's superior if you haven't received them within 7 days. YOU ARE ENTITLED TO REQUEST AN INDEPENDENT NOTE TAKER.

1. If the Social Worker says she is going to refer you to something, again, repeat that back to her, and ask if that's correct. Then ask her to WRITE to you informing you when she has auctioned that referral. And ask when you can expect to receive that letter.

1. If you do not receive that letter within the timescale she has stated, escalate that to her immediate superior IN WRITING, explaining that on X date, your social worker stated that she would refer you to Y thing, and that you would receive confirmation of this in writing by Z date. As Z date has passed, and you have not received this letter, could 'Social worker's immediate superior' please ensure that this has been actioned and that your letter of confirmation is sent out by (date of letter plus 7 days).

Chase up EVERYTHING IN WRITING.

DO NOT GET INVOLVED IN THE ACTIONS YOUR PARTNER NEEDS TO TAKE WITH THE SOCIAL WORKER.

That is for HIM to sort out. You can ask on here what he should do, you can help him write letters when you are seeing him in a public place, but HE must write the letters and HE must deal with the lack of parenting course HIMSELF.

Give him the name of the Social Worker and her phone number too. He has Parental Responsibility, so he can request IN WRITING the minutes of every meeting, even if he has been unable to attend.

justalilmummy

You actually can guarantee that.
If he gets abusive again, he loses the children... But you won't.

Therapy will do a lot of good to you lilmummy.

You need to realize that your priority is your children, not him not getting depressed again. Their health and wellbeing are the most important things to you.
You have no power over what your partner will do or feel.

I might add, SWs have studied (generally) a lot of psychology books and stuff about DV and abuse. I did that too after my therapy.

Only 10% of abusive men have mental health problems.
It was also scary to learn that only 5% of abusers fully recover and stop being abusive. So that makes you understand where social workers are coming from.

I can see how you feel, OP, having been in your position in the past, but equally I can see SS's concerns.

No, I fully understand, there are no guarantees of perfect future MH. So do SS. What THEY want guarantees on is how YOU will safeguard your DC's in the event of any future MH crisis.

They are trying to prevent DV from happening around your DC's. THAT is their priority.

CouthyMow

I agree with everything you said, especially the last bit about him.

Thanks folkgirl
Thats a good idea as I dont always understand what they are asking me to to
Also am going to request that she meets with dp as so far since the cp meeting she hadnt seen him, has relied on me telling him what's going on which is not going to give him a clear notion of what is going on
I have said this to her time and time again but I will pit it in writing
I think I need an advocate as I find it hard to say what I'm trying to and it may look like I'm not fully acknowledging the problems when in fact I am

Depression is an illness and of course it can return but the difficulty is that people who suffer from it often don't want to talk about it or acknowledge that it has returned. We often wait until it gets very bad before seeking help.
This will be worrying for SS.

AS depressive illnesses can be completely devastating for those suffering from it and for their families it is very often a good idea to have some plans in place to help deal with its symptoms asap

Get you partner to work with a therapist. They can put a plan together to show that he can begin to recognise the symptoms and acknowledge some of the things that he started to feel as his depression took hold.
They can then plan some ways to monitor how he is feeling and encourage him to talk about it openly and seek help quickly.

This will help him and your family and reassure SS.