social services are destroying my family

[justalilmummy]

Social services have ruined my family and I just dont know what to do anymore, I want to run away from it all
My partner had a mental breakdown 15 months ago, leading up to this there were a few issues (arguments got out of hand abd police were called, 3 times last time 2.5 years ago)
After hes breakdown social services became involved and we were under a child in need plan
The plan said I was to protect my children by not allowing the children to be alone with their father - which I did
Partner after being released from the psychiatric hospital after 8 days was allocated a mental health nurse who he saw regularly
Everything was going great social workers visited as they still had a slight concern about dp state of mind
4 months ago he was discharged completly as they felt he was fine now and he did not have a mental disorder
Things took a bad turn after this as social worker did not agree with the decision
They first tried to convince dp to go to the doctors and get medication to help hes ' depression' even though he does not have it.
Dp did not do this so one day they turned up in the evening and said they are very concerned and he is not to come inside the family home, we were shocked by this but he went and stayed at hes mums, which we again did
6 weeks ago a child protection conference was held and they have put the children on child protection for the 'risk of emotional abuse' as father refuses to accept hes problem and I am downplaying hes mental health issues even though hes mental health worker says he doesnt have any mental disorder!
The conference was held as if he was still in the family home which he is not
Its now got even worse as they have told us that I need therapy to come to terms with the 'domestic abuse' I have suffered and my child needs therapy as well, also dp has to attend a parenting course.
They have made it very difficult for dp to attend any of these meetings as they hold them all in the afternoon even though we have repeatedly told them he can only do mornings coz of hes work
They threatened me this afternoon that as I am reluctant to go to therapy I'm giving het ammunition to take it to court for a care order
I must add there has been absolutely no issue since hes breakdown 15 months ago
This is having an awful effect on my 4 year old ds, he is waking nightly crying for hes daddy, hes begun wetting himself at school and s not eating properly
I just dont know what to do, they say this is coz he is at risk of emotional damage when it's them causing all the upset in this household :-(

Spero thanks for that link, what sensible advice. I wish I could print it out and give it to parents! A little unprofessional though unfortunately.

Please please bear in mind that they will not have put your children onto a child protection plan without agreement from other professionals.

A SW (however crap) cannot just go into a case conference and just insist a child is given one of these plans on his or her own. The Chair would laugh them out of the door.

Who else was there?

Was your DP's mental health worker there? What did he/she say?

Despite your DH's work he needs to take time off to attend these case conferences, they are once every six months usually (although the first one after the initial meeting might be three months). Why can't your DP book some time off for these very important meetings? It will look as though he is refusing to engage....the worst possible thing he can do.

You may have a twunt of a SW....or just maybe there are real concerns that you are refusing to see. Only you know this of course.

If I was in your position I would be jumping through hoops to show them they were wrong and I would do everything they asked and more.

However long ago the DV was, the fact remains that your children witnessed it all, your DP has a history of MH issues and there is now a new baby. Trust me, Social Services are totally overwhelmed with cases and they are not going to waste their time on any family they don't truly believe needs their input.

Don't just believe all the conspiracy theorists on this thread....despite the rumours, SW are not out just to steal children and babies.....there is a massive shortage of foster carers to start with and placing children in care is a logistical nightmare usually. It will be the last thing they want to do....they WILL do it though if a family does not comply with the child protection plan. You need to show them that you are complying

A group of us who are involved in all aspects of child protection, including birth parents who have gone through proceedings - would like to set up some kind of blog/web site which could offer clear and balanced advice about what to do in these circumstances.

If anyone has anything to contribute, please join us.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/1974086-getting-together-information-and-support-for-EVERYONE-in-the-child-protection-system?msgid=44526959#44526959

I'm hoping I'm not included in the accusations of being a conspiracy theorist?

I can see that there are concerns there that the OP may not be fully understanding, but equally when you are a teenager, even a teenage parent, even 15 months is a king time in your eyes, so you often fail to comprehend that in the eyes of a usually older SW, that that isn't seen as very long at all.

I can see this from a parents side, both having been a teenage parent having SW investigations, and being a far better informed and worldly wise 30+ going through them on the basis of a malicious call, but we can't all help the strange partners our EX's will shack up with...

At the OP's age, you ARE far more vulnerable, and less well informed of the processes in a SS investigation, and are often unaware of the best course of action to take.

I was merely trying to get the OP to start to a) Create a paper trail, and b) to try to chase up these referrals.

OP - yes, your partner DOES really need to be there for these meetings. The meetings should be booked at a MUTUALLY convenient time. When I was going through an investigation last year, I and my Ex partner insisted that they booked the appointments on his days off from work. I suggest you do the same.

Do NOT move areas in the UK - that WILL be one of the single worst things you can do.

And yes, they CAN book a first meeting with under 24 hours' notice, and often do.

Spero is correct in as much as an initial CIN meeting that is quickly downgraded to a TAC meeting is usually at a 3 month interval between the first and second meeting, and 6 monthly thereafter.

However, if the case stays as a CIN meeting, often the meetings are every 6 weeks, or even more frequently than that.

That still shouldn't mean that her partner shouldn't be there.

It DOES look like her partner is refusing to engage if he has not attended any of the meetings.

However - when you are in your teens, it often doesn't occur to you to challenge the SW's on times and dates of booking the appointments so that they are MUTUALLY convenient. I certainly didn't when 18, and lost a job through it. In my 30's, however, I wouldn't put up with that, a parent being excluded from the meetings because they are booked during his work hours, or when he could book time off...

couthy - you are offering very sensible advice based on your own experiences, which is valuable.

would you be prepared to contribute that to the blog/website we are trying to start?

Add message | Report | Message poster ThingsThatGoBumpInTheNight Wed 22-Jan-14 03:08:28
Listen to couthymow
I had a sw like that who seemed to have a vendetta against me - she was also crap, lied about when she was off work, to the point I stood outside the office, in clear view of her car, was told she wasn't in, walked into the office and there she was

They love to move the goalposts too.

Get support - takenuk, ticauk are both on twitter, fassit UK website and forums, there are heaps. Esp on Facebook.
If you had a bad childhood whatever you do don't tell them. They will use it all.

^this was the conspiracy theory post I was referring too. Not that I'm disbelieving Things' account of having a crap SW, they certainly exist. But advice to look at fassit etc is not good advice.

And, for transparency - the SW in my latest case also (loosely) chaired the meeting, whilst actually letting the HT of my DC's primary school (who had an axe to grind as I'd got him a formal warning from the LA because he failed to safeguard one of my DC's appropriately, and another 2 complaints about him had been upheld, one to do with my DD's SN's, and another to do with fudging pupil figures in both SATS and Reception class numbers) run the meeting and basically harass me.

I was even castigated for my then 9 and 10yo DS's sharing a room in Social Housing when I was on the waiting list for a larger house?!(was in a 2.5 bed with 4 DC's) As if there was anything I could have done about it!

And with only 18 months between them, sharing a room was not unusual. In fact, technically, they still would be, had I not taken the dining room to be my bedroom in my new house...)

It's amazing the things that can be used against you in these meetings, even when you ARE doing everything in your power to rectify them, even when they are not actually within your control.

IThe first child protection meeting was the one dp couldn't attend, we didnt realise how serious it was going to get.
Theres only been 2 meetings the last one she changed the time at the last minute
Ive never tried ti fight against her in fact ive been nothing but fully commuted to doing what they ask of me, included removing dp,
I dont minimise anything I was completly honest about the problems we have had in the past
I'm just venting on here how I feel and all the things I cant say to her

Yes, that is not a problem. Will look later. School run beckons, I'm afraid!

I have had SS involvement in my life this year after my Brother and Mother accused me essentially of financial abuse against my Mother in my position of Attorney. I know it is a very different situation but I was very aware at the time that I have 2 children and I had been accused of something very serious. SS have now said they consider I acted in Mum's Best Interests at all times and my Brother was at one point threatened with SS solicitors and the Court of Protection.

The accusations came out if the blue so I was in a state of shock however I realised immediately I had to be very very careful how I acted and what I said. I listened to what the SW said and did everything she advised. If I was unsure of anything I would ask what she advised. I made it very very clear that I only wanted to act in Mum's Best Interests and used this phrase repeatedly. Also I made it very clear that as my Mother was deemed not to have capacity and as her Attorney that I was very well aware I had a duty of care to her and also to my children and emphasised this repeatedly .

I followed up as many conversations as possible by email, effectively creating my own minutes. I made sure the other people involved in my Mothers care were fully informed at all times and made sure I had a really good working relationship with them. I agreed to attend a meeting where I would be opposite my Brother's solicitor even though I was terrified at the idea which the SW knew, but felt it would be beneficial for me to attend so I agreed. I did everything asked of me and went out of my way to find more I could do.

Obviously my case was very different but as Jakebullet and others have said, you need to do everything and more. Try to anticipate things and do them before asked, get an advocate and create a paper trail.

Changing the times at the last minute is a bit of a grey area. Realistically, that can sometimes be unavoidable, but should STILL be rebooked at a mutually convenient time.

Who chaired your meeting? The SW or someone separate?

And to everyone who says I got pregnant after he came out of hospital I was already pregnant, very verynearly stages when he went in, found out 2 weeks after he came out of hospital

They changed it at the last minute to a time dp could not attend knowing full well he wouldnt be ble to make it if she did that
Also she doesnt actually inform him of these meetings she relies on me to tell him which I did say in the meeting I felt was unfair and hope she took that on board

But the problem is that you got pregnant with a man who must have been showing signs of being very unwell if he was admitted to hospital just after you found out you were pregnant.

I am not trying to be unkind, I know accidents can happen, but you can see how this would worry people about your judgment as a couple about bringing a new baby into a potentially fragile situation, when there is already a history of violent incidents involving the police?

I agree meetings should be at mutually convenient time but also that he needs to show willing and miss work/leave early if meetings can't be changed to suit him.

I realise this is incredibly stressful for you, but they will not leave you alone until you show real insight into the problems in your relationship with your partner, and the damage that will do to your DCs.

It might be 2.5 years since the police were called, and 15months since DP was discharged. BUT, DP was admitted to hospital while having a mental health crisis. That is MASSIVE. People having mental health problems go to their GP all the time and get sent home with pills. To be admitted means it was serious.

Ok, he's been discharged now, and the team say he is ok, but what about the next time he gets stressed, is he going to fling plates and break windows, this time with two kids in the house?

I am afraid that until you can see that your relationship MUST end for the sake of your children, and you go about actioning that yourself, SS are going to be concerned about your ability to protect them from emotional harm.

"At risk of emotional harm" isn't so much about the risk of your DP harming them again, its more about your lack of ability to prevent it, should it happen.

Don't you think that it is emotionally harming the OP's DS to hear the SW say that his dad can't live with them? The OP has stated signs of obvious emotional distress.

Now it could be that the SW is young to argue that this is SHOWING the OP putting him at risk of emotional harm, yet not having the foresight to realise that it is being separated from his father that is causing him the emotional harm.

I've had that happen.

I will willingly argue most things in favour of SS, but the use of "at future risk of emotional harm" is one thing I refuse to accept. Mostly because it is based on the conjecture of a SW, and an outdated model of SW training based on the frankly laughable "cycle of deprivation".

Young = going, am walking and typing!

(And yes, I have done extensive personal research, NOT on conspiracy sites, about this outdated model of SW training.)

It's based on similar 'research' that stated that 'emotionally frigid' mothers cause Autism, rather than it being a neurological issue.

Couthy i agree that future risk of emotional harm is a difficult concept for parents and even some SW to understand.

But this won't be based on 'cycle of deprivation' - it will be based on a relationship with history of violence and mental health issues.

the op doesn't necessarily have to leave her partner but BOTH of them must show that they have insight into the issues and will do what is necessary to safeguard their children in the future. At the moment, it sounds I am afraid like the op is minimising and the partner just isn't getting involved.

it isn't a recipe for a happy ending I am afraid.

Just

There's an awful lot of information here to take on board.

Print it off and start an agenda of actions in order of importance.

There are also suggestions that you need to change your (and partner's) behaviour and attitude to make it clear you are taking the SWs concerns seriously. Use the aforementioned print off to make a list of how you need to act.

If this is a bit overwhelming, get real life people in to help you. There's Women's Aid, CAB, solicitor, doctor, mental health workers, even a well organised, articulate friend or relative to make sense of the demands.

If the next meeting is arranged that does not suit you, your partner, or any other professional who is able to be in attendance for you, say NO. But be amenable to alternative dates.

Get someone to witness these meeting and take notes. When you try and make later sense of these very stressful meetings you might find you've forgotten chunks, misread responses etc.

Please stop banging on about how good things have been for x amount of time. I believe you, but the SW doesn't and it's her/them you need to convince. So start getting them on YOUR side.

So yes, risk of any future harm is based on 'conjecture' but in many cases this is extremely well informed conjecture as one of the clearest indicators of likely future behaviour is past behaviour.

So if you have been violent in the past it is reasonable to assume you will be violent in the future, unless you can show how you or your circumstances have changed for the better.

Ditto mental health issues.

these things just don't 'go away' and are unlikely to resolve all by themselves without people getting help and support.

And a new baby is notorious for upping the tension and difficulty in a relationship - every one is more tired, more stressed and any fracture lines in a relationship are more likely to break wide open.