Is he a cocklodger..or are my expectations wrong?

[Doratheexplorersboots]

Just that really.

DP (well, I say 'D'..) is not DC's dad. But we all live together. He is good with DC, great playing and interacting with them etc, but is rubbish (and I mean rubbish) round the house. Giving him the benefit of the doubt, he hasn't lived with anyone in a while and it's a huge adjustment living with, not a ready made family as that sounds awful, but the shock to the system of dealing with one child and a toddler must be immense. I realise that.

However, we both work full-time (admittedly I've only just gone from PT to FT), but I do everything domestically. Ok so specifically that is: changing beds, all the washing, all the cleaning, all the washing up/dishwasher bits. He does the cooking, which is great must admit.

I know this may be a case of communication, but to be honest, I know it'll cause an argument. I did ask him to hang the washing out the other day and he did it, but in general I get the impression if I ask too much of him he feels put upon.
He sees the weekends for relaxing lying on the sofa with his feet up which, in an ideal world with a cleaner/housekeeper/cook, would be fabulous. He does get tired and gets headaches now & again, but we work the same office hours. Plus I, for obvious reasons, am more involved with looking after DC..I don't expect him to do as much as maybe he would if he was their dad, that would be grossly unfair.

I don't know..I'm just feeling a little fed up as today again I've ended up running round like a headless chicken doing everything while he lols about. And I'm not even that much of a tidy/clean person! I just realise clothes have to be washed and like a medium standard of cleanliness!

Sorry..bit of a rant. Help me with stories of what it should be like please

No, my "common sense" says she does not excuse his laziness on the grounds of "he doesn't understand"

he understands perfectly well

you are putting phrases in people's mouths as well as directly misquoting them

I am not sure why you are so keen to excuse this bloke, at your own cost

What would you call the simple regard that humans have for one another then ?

mellow I just done get why you are defending someone's right to be lazy and call someone bossy if they are picked up on it??

I am off to bed now, I hope Op has got some support from this thread

I would say that he has probably been brought up in a society where women do the majority of domestic chores in most households, especially ones where there are children and that he may just not get that its not right and that does not make him abusive as it does not make a female who fails to stand up for her self or challenge the status quo stupid. I think he is a victim of our society as much as women are . He needs his awareness raising. Your Sn son and your Husband AF are not the norm in men - read the boards and it very obvious that your 'humanity' is not quite the widespread universally understood constant you seam to think it is ;)

I work in a certain field and can assure you 'modern man ' is not a universally accepted concept.

I don't judge men by the kind of asswipes who end up being discussed on here.

It is not my norm that men don't pull their weight, my dad did it, my husband does, it all my mates do it. I don't know any man of any age who think women do the majority of chores.

It's not 1953.

So what about the poster who had a similar situation and resolved it ? Some men are area wipes some just need their eyes opening - unless she has the conversation the opportunity will not be able to tell the difference . as I said before do you think she should just Ltb without trying to resolve it ? Cause at the end of the day that's what it boils down to doesn't it ?

It IS my norm that men dont pull their weight as I live in a Latin American country where is is very much like 1953, but that doesnt mean i make excuses for all the men who behave badly and take advantage of women domestically, on the contrary its all the more reason to point out that this behaviour is wrong.

I agree with Mellow.

I'm a woman.

I don't think I'm awful or abusive or lacking in humanity.

Can I be a bit lazy sometimes, a bit lacking in awareness of what someone else has going on? Yes.

Could someone saying 'look, we need to sort this out. I'm doing x,y,z and you're not doing a fair share', make me realise I've been a bit of a twat? Yes.

I've never met a perfect man or woman. Sometimes people need it pointing out that they're being a bit of a knob.

Are you lot perfect?

outraged would you start an argument or label someone bossy if they called you up on your laziness and told you you were taking advantage?

It would depend on the approach I guess.

If someone said 'FUCKS SAKE GET OFF YOUR ARSE AND HELP', it might cause an argument. While their sentiment is valid, the delivery would get my back up.

If they approached me reasonably, then no, I wouldn't start an argument/believe them to be bossy.

That's why, as Mellow says, the OP needs to have the conversation.

If he can't accept it, starts a row, is aggressive or threatening. LTB.

If he listens, makes an improvement, apologises. He's a keeper.

She won't know until she tries, which I believe is Mellow's point?

as has been pointed out before, she has tried, and been called bossy and now is reluctant to try again as she knows it will cause an argument.

I'd try again. That's my advice to the OP. She likes him enough to have moved in with him, to have allowed him into her children's lives. I'd take the risk on the conversation. If he shuts it down or causes a big argument then she can LTB. I wouldn't end it based on 'I couldn't have a conversation with him, it might have caused an argument'. Arguments happen sometimes.

If she is scared of him, he needs to go immediately and this is a completely different thread.

I dont think anyone is saying she shouldnt try again, just that this blokes actions shouldnt be defended. He is not doing his fair share, and he gets arsey when asked to. What the OP has asked is if this is right or not (cocklodging or wrong expections) In my view this is NOT right. He is taking advantage and there are no excuses for it.

I think people are saying she shouldn't try again. The ones talking about abuse, lack of humanity, being mugged off, getting her right where he wants her etc.

I don't think anyone is defending his actions, more his motivation i.e. that he doesn't realise what he's doing. He is being a knob, no question. Does he realise he is being a knob? IMO (and I think Mellow's), maybe not. That's the difference.

If he is made aware and doesn't change, LTB.

If he is made aware and makes the change, don't LTB.

I'm sure the OP is capable of deciding for herself whether she wants to stay in the relationship or not. Nothing wrong with pointing out bad behaviour, and treating your OH like a skivvy is bad behaviour. Making (up) excuses for bad behaviour is unhelpful.

If he has already called her bossy for binging up the topic before, hasnt he already been made aware?

Maybe, I don't know how the previous conversation went.

From the information we have here, I agree with Mellow's interpretation i.e. he might need it pointed out to him.

Examining the cause of 'bad behaviour' is always helpful. It's how we prevent it continuing/happening again.

how is making up excuses" the same as "examining the cause"??

They're often the same aren't they?

'She did X because she was drunk'.

Will be met with 'don't make excuses for her'. Identifying that she did it because she was drunk is also 'examining the cause'.

What are the 'excuses' you think people are making here? Is it the 'he doesn't know he is being a knob'? That to me is the cause of his behaviour, not an excuse for it.

err no they are really not the same. Excusing bad behaviour is letting someone off the hook. Saying it is OK. Putting up with it. Allowing them to continue behaving in the same way. Enabling.

The alternative is to challenge it. Say no more. Dont put up with it. Protest. Complain. Make a change. That is what you should do if someone is taking advantage of you (whether that be related to the housework or anything else)

What excuses are being made here then? I haven't seen any posts saying his behaviour is ok.

"he doesn't realise what he's doing." = excusing behaviour.

Sorry - but sitting around for 6 months watching someone slave away for you while you put your feet up is bad behaviour - another poster even pointed out that her son with special needs doesn't even do this!

'Excusing bad behaviour is letting someone off the hook. Saying it is OK. Putting up with it. Allowing them to continue behaving in the same way'

That's your definition.

'he doesn't realise what he's doing' is not letting him off the hook or saying his behaviour is OK or putting up with it or allowing him to continue behaving in the same way.

It's looking for the cause. He is being a knob. Why is he being a knob? Because he doesn't realise that what he's doing is being a knob. How I can change that behaviour? By highlighting to him that he is being a knob and telling him to sort himself out.

Right there you've confused excuse and cause. They're often perceived to be the same, as I said.

So you think that the OP's expectations are wrong? That women cant expect men to do their fair share on their own without having to be told to do it, because they couldnt possibly figure it out for themselves, even though a kid with special needs can?

Personally, I think he knows and is taking the piss because he thinks he can get away with it.

'So you think that the OP's expectations are wrong?'

ABSOLUTELY NOT. You have either misread or deliberately misinterpreted my posts. He is being knob, I have said that several times. Have you seen my posts where I've said that? Where I've said that no-one is excusing his actions?

The 'kid with special needs' is neither here nor there. It makes sod all difference what he can or cannot do. We're talking about the OP's 'D'P.

'Personally, I think he knows and is taking the piss because he thinks he can get away with it.'

There is a very good chance you're right. Personally, I would make sure by having the conversation, before I considered myself a victim of an inhumane abuser and ended the relationship.

Sometimes good people are selfish, lazy or thoughtless. They need a (metaphorical) shove in the right direction. If everyone you know is either 'bad' or 'good', I think we live in different worlds!

I don't think we're ever going to agree, so I'll leave it there. Just to clarify; I think the OP's expectations are fine. I think his behaviour is NOT fine. It doesn't sound to me like his behaviour is malicious or manipulative or abusive. From what the OP has posted, I think it's worth a conversation.