DP tried to have sex with me as I slept... (may be TMI)

[ChryslerBuilding]

Name changed for this ... :(

Last night DP and I went out for a few drinks, post-Christmas.

We got home, got into bed, and thought about having sex. I declined, saying I was too tired, and DP was absolutely fine with it. We had both drunk a bit, but he was drunker than I was.

I started waking up to the feeling of fingers inside me, and then he penetrated me, from behind. I was lying in my usual 'sleep' position so he had to have moved to get bodily contact iyswim ... I hadn't made any overtures of any sort. At that point I woke up, and immediately turned over and started shouting at him and, I'm afraid, hitting out at him.

He hadn't used a condom which I also have a huge problem with as it is our method of contraception so our understanding is that we use condoms.

DP seemed disorientated, and sat up and tried to put on a condom (!!!) which I made him remove, and told him to get out.

We had a guest staying in the house, so I didn't make a big fuss, and this morning tried to act normally ... but now I've got back from taking my friend to the station, and shouted at DP, thrown some cutlery and burst out crying. I feel completely violated ... I hate him ... he seems remorseful and his defense is that he was drunk/half-asleep, and he thought I was involved somehow. He is also hungover, whereas I am fine.

I don't know what to do. I know that this is rape. I was not just unconsenting, I had actually declined sex before we went to bed. Also, he didn't use a condom ... that says to me he was drunk/half-asleep but if I heard this story from a friend, I would tell her to phone the effing police... what do I do ... is this forgivable, and is the relationship salvageable?

Sorry, long... trying not to dripfeed.

When Chrysler has specifically said that she considers it rape, that she explicitly said no, that she was asleep when he started penetration (that she had previously said no to), WHY ON EARTH do people think it is helpful to her to post their experiences of consensual sleep sex?

It is not the same! It is in no way the same thing!! What you do in your relationship is up to you, but she has said how she feels, so WHY do you think that posting 'oh, but we do abc and my OH has xyz syndrome' is going to be in any way helpful?

Never mind a face:palm emoticon, we need a head:desk one.

Birdy did you miss the bit where the OP says she already refused consent to sex? In fact did everybody? She said no to sex, went to sleep then he went ahead and did it anyway, in the knowledge that she wasn't up for it, when she wasn't in a position to let him know she had changed her mind (which she hadn't)
He also risked her body, health and lifestyle by not using a condom.
There is really nothing acceptable in that.

Fivegolddeblooms she has said this is normal for their relationship though, therefore implying consent. If she woke up and said no, or as the OP did, said no before falling asleep this is rape. Surely this isn't too difficult to understand?

Lovecat: I think sharing my situation is helpful, only because of the disoriented behaviour OP described afterwards. If (and it's a big if, but as I explained; possible) he is asleep, and therefore not in control of his actions, it's not rape in the eyes of the law.

However this won't change her feelings on the matter. It's a horrible feeling the first time and I struggled with it for a while. As I said in my posts, it's something I've had to learn to live with, it is entirely op's choice if she does this or not. Flukewoman made a good point about being things you can do to help this.

Shaken, they've been together a good while now, it seems strange that this has only reared its head now if it is the same condition as your DH. I know you said it's a big "if", but it seems implausible in these circumstances.

I'm actually really sad for you that this is something you've 'had to learn to live with'

The fact he penetrated OP with fingers first (checking 'angle of dangle' for rear penetration) makes me suspicious that this was not sleep sex - a degree of pre-meditation by the sound of things. So sorry this has happened to you OP & I hope the rape crisis people are helpful. Don't forget emergency contraception (72 hr limit) if you aren't using other contraception, even if he didn't ejaculate inside you.

Lovecat. Because from what the OP describes it sounds to me like she has some doubts about the intent of her partner being a deliberate abuse of her lack of consent. So from my point of view it is relevant to share stories in which an otherwise loving, respectful partner can act so out of character.

No one here has doubted the OPs version of events or denied the validity of her feelings. Several others have posted useful options for the next step. To me, the intention of her partner has everything to do with what the OP chooses to do next. So to balance out some of the crowd of MNers who automatically assume nefarious intent from anyone who happens to be male, some of us have shared stories of a different perspective.

Flukewoman just to take issue with some of your post which seems to be suffering from some rape myths:
Guess what! 'an otherwise loving, respectful partner' can actually rape! Really!
'The intention of her partner' appears to have been to penetrate someone who had said 'no.'

Oh 'has some doubts' - yup, victims of rape and assault often have 'some doubts'

Oh ffs. If you are going to quote me then please have the fucking courtesy not to twist my words. Where did I say that a loving partner cannot commit rape? Nowhere. I don't doubt the OP for a second. I know that an apparently loving partner can rape. I am, however, offering details of a condition under which this sort of behaviour could have occurred without the knowledge of the OP's partner. I wasn't there. I can't know whether the OP's partner was awake and intended to have sex with her after her explicit refusal. But the OP can find that out and she deserves to hear that not every man is a rapist.

I wasn't twisting your words, flukewoman, I was quoting them because I think they- perhaps unknowingly to you- exposed some rape myths- which are:
otherwise loving
not his intention
she has some doubts
And there's no need to swear!

And since I've actually read the original post where the OP asks what should she do and if this is forgivable, I'm posting about the only way in which I would find this behaviour forgivable; if the OP's partner was asleep and didn't know what he was doing. if the OP knows he was awake or drunk then I'm sure she will skip my posts as irrelevant. It's not for anyone else to select random phrases from my posts and twist my comments entirely.

Yep I'm fully cognisant of rape myths and rape apologists thank you. You can choose to ignore what I'm actually posting about all you like. But please don't pick random phrases to quote my posts when you clearly don't understand what I'm talking about.

opj

I think it's really inappropriate that the thread has been derailed by some. The OP needs support, not a debate on rape.

Chrysler I'm sorry that this has happened to you. I hope you have been able to speak to rape crisis as they will be best placed to help you talk this through. I think for your own sake, and the sake of the future of the relationship should you wish to continue it, that it would be best if your other half left for a few days. It must be so difficult to be around someone while you are feeling so violated by them. You need time to organise your thoughts and I think you'll probably have a clearer head without him at home.

Please don't be put off from seeking support here because of a couple of idiots. There are many, many more people who will offer great advice.

I agree and apologise for my part in the derailing. I've apologised to the OP privately and I will bow out.

There are some seriously fucked up posts on this thread.

I am so sorry OP for what happened. I do not think I could forgive in this situation. I think every time my partner wanted to make love to me my skin would be crawling and I would not be confident that he was going to respect my wishes sexually. For me sex is fundamental to my relationship, it is a big part of how we relate to one another, I only have sex with my husband so it is important that we have as mutually beneficial a sexual relationship as possible. If what happened to you happened between my husband and me I know there would be no way back. I would frankly be scared it was going to happen again. I have heard of sexsommnia and I think knowing it was beyond a person's control would offer some comfort and definitely mitigate but even then penetration is so intrusive an act that I think I would struggle to come to terms with that.

People are posting about their experiences because they're trying to help the op lovecat it's up to her what she does or doesn't find helpful. I think most of us are concerned about her. This may be provocative, but I found your first post very high and mighty. Just my opinion though.

I know you've now left, but hope you're ok if you're still reading Chrysler and managed to get some RL support.

op

When I was with exp waaaaay back when we were in our late teens, i woke in the night to him fondling me and I responded, we were kissing and he was aroused. We were spooning having sex for a short while and when we went to change positions, I was above him and I hear him snore. He was fast asleep.

I didn't know how I felt about it as, he was asleep and I responded, how could I not even tell?

He had been drinking.

he had no clue or memory what so ever.

My exp wasnt a rapist, dick head father to dd1 , but not a rapist.

I referred to the sleep sex thread in my first post because my views to sleep sex in my relationship are that it's ok, desirable too. I like to wake my hubby up with a blow job too as I know he likes it. To others, that would be unacceptable in their relationship and that's fine, they aren't us and we aren't them.

Difference is in this thread that the OP made her feelings VERY CLEAR earlier on in the evening and her husband was told NO. He then later went ahead anyway and without contraception. A clear case of rape, not sleep/drunk sex and clear violation of the OP's right to ensure sex is safe.

No Eirikur, i didn't miss that. See the last paragraph in my post.

Tinkertaylor - that has happened to me too. Tmi alert... One partner frequently did this - either fully asleep or half asleep and I would often respond in my sleep (sex dream and then wake up to find we were sexually active). He was so ashamed and embarrassed by it, although he couldn't remember doing it- he even tried to wear mittens to try and stop himself rom doing it (we couldn't do separate beds as In a house share). Even having sex just before sleep didn't help! Fortunately I enjoyed it. I told him to get rid of the mittens after a few nights too. Didn't work anyway.

My current partner has done it once whilst fast asleep, but I woke up feeling grumpy and bucked him off. He too has no recollection of it, and was ashamed to find out in the morning.

I think the lesson from this thread and All ther replies is that you hope to know your partner and instinct should tell you whether they mean it and are awake and aware of their actions. A lot of men do react sexually in their sleep and can be quite dexterous. However, I also have a friend who was made pregnant on her wedding night because her h had sex with her whilst she was passed out. He was very drunk but fully awake and has a clear memory of doing it. Amazingly, they don't perceive it as rape. I do.

Op, I think alcohol may have been the source of your p's behaviour, but only you will be able to know if there was consciousness and intent- and whether alcohol revealed his true self or masked his typically good qualities and behaviour. His behaviour afterwards is key as well. Hope you're feeling a bit better now and that this thread has given you some support (despite some derailing).

Regardless of his intentions (i.e. whether he was drunk/half asleep/confused), the fact that you are accusing him on here of attempted rape before even sitting him down and talking through what actually happened last night I think means that you have no future in your relationship.

Nice supportive post to someone who feels upset and violated and has reached out for help, shallweshop.

The OP did talk to him. Or rather, mostly screamed. Perfectly reasonable, considering.

And she was here to gather her thoughts, I expect. What happened really shook her and she couldn't talk to anyone else.

Your point was, shallwestop?

OP, I hope you got the rl support you needed.