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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: thread 26

999 replies

CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 13/09/2013 20:55

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you’re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie If you’re a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart - a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don’t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

OP posts:
tweedlezee · 01/11/2013 15:30

i'm pretty new too, been looking for support here and received so much of it already. lovely people.. hope you are ok killpeppa

killpeppa · 01/11/2013 15:49

I have went to the housing executive today and the benefits office and started that ball rolling.

going to see a house on Monday, it's perfect for me and the boys, fingers crossed!!

tweedlezee · 01/11/2013 16:37

good luck. I will keep my fingers crossed for you. everyone tells me it is better on the other side. I am having to keep reminding myself that the 'nice' he is being now at the fear of losing us is not how he is 90% of the time. it can be hard because they play on your knowledge of how it 'could' be which bends your understanding of how it really is.

MrsMinkBernardLundy · 01/11/2013 16:38

tweedle it is good you have somewhere to go. if you cannot wait then i would suggest temp accommodation if you can get it and yes take the kids, you Will be taking them in January anyway and if he won't budge, he is forcing your hand. or a refuge?

He can see them on the same basis as he will after January.

Going back everyday- no, definitely not. it changes your position as far as being main carer.
Do you own the house?

MrsMinkBernardLundy · 01/11/2013 16:40

killpeppa welcome. glad you are making progress..anything we can help/advise with? And fingers crossed for the house.

My Efw is being a useless selfish non parent. the scrap of contact he is having with dcs this week is imminent. Feh.

tweedlezee · 01/11/2013 16:47

I don't own the house no.
he has not got his head around the idea that I will be the children's primary carer. I think that is because he does not give it any weight and never has because he puts himself in the top spot. The notion of 'Mother' does not apply to me in his eyes.
I am hoping to spend the week here and then weekends with friends. This will allow him to have the time with the children that he craves and will hopefully give me the space that I need.
It is really hard because I think it is so important that the kids get to see him. He is not a bad dad. Genuinely he is brilliant with them which is the thing that has kept me here for so long. For me it is the fact that when I try to talk to him, he will always say 'later' or 'i'll think about it' as if it is HIS decision. Because his is the only decision that matters.

MrsMinkBernardLundy · 01/11/2013 16:51

I take it it is rented and not that he owns it? Probably easier that way. The weekends solution sounds viable. Will you take the kids with you at weekends? Main carer is not about what he thinks, it is about what a court would think and in that decision at least he does not get the last word.
Hang in there it Will all be worth it once you are in your new home.

tweedlezee · 01/11/2013 17:00

yeh its rented. so glad we didn't get all traditional, think he did me a favour refusing to marry me because of my 'attitude'.
I go to college on a Saturday so he has the kids then anyway. so all I would do is stay at friends Friday & Saturday.
not long, countdown begins NOW. 10 weeks. going to the house Monday to see my friend who is the lady moving out. so I will confirm the move in date then.
I think the reality of having to look after the kids and work full time will hit him and he will resign himself to the fact that they need to be with me as I work 2 days a week only (damn I had to really fight for those 2 days). those are the things he will have to work out himself though because the more I want to 'talk' the more he closes up.
I think I can, I think I can, I think I can....

TheSilveryPussycat · 01/11/2013 17:23

You know you can Wink

tweedlezee · 01/11/2013 17:24

YES I CAN!!!

MrsMinkBernardLundy · 01/11/2013 19:01

You can and you shall Smile

killpeppa · 01/11/2013 19:17

I'm pretty good (this evening)
he moves out on Sunday, thank god!

a week separated in the same house has been tough.
I'm planning on moving 15 mins away- he thinks this is unreasonable.
I'm doing it to 'spite' himHmm

aw well, my choice. not his.
start of MY new life.

tweedlezee · 01/11/2013 19:43

of course it is all about him killpeppa it is always ALL about them. 15 is not far but it is a stick to beat you with.

my FW is the nicest human being that ever walked the earth today. can't do enough for us all, happy go lucky, positive and very chatty.

LIES ALL LIES!!!
Yesterday when he was playing with the kids (which he does a lot I will not tak ethat away form him) he was looking at me, his eyes were saying "how can you leave this" and my head said "BECAUSE THIS IS NOT WHAT IT IS LIKE!!!!!!!!"
Had a good friend round the house today and by the time they left I felt like I had returned. I need to remember that feeling. The relaxed, jokey, happy, un-paranoid me. She is not the person who is here when he is in the depths of his FW'ness.

tweedlezee · 01/11/2013 19:47

*15 minutes

Noregrets78 · 01/11/2013 23:38

Haven't posted at all for absolutely ages. My brain is all of a befuddle. I'm totally sick of having no boundaries in place at all. We've been separated for 6 months, and are now divorced. But he comes in and out of the house at will, for lots of different reasons. He refuses to even ring the door bell, sometimes pops in, sometimes stays for hours (i go out). Legally there is nothing I can do as he won't we can't agree finances, and he's never hit me.

I can't wait to start on the journey of feeling better, but feel like I haven't even reached day 1 yet, as I don't have my own space. I feel totally powerless. DD can't understand why I don't like having Daddy in the house and is being told I'm being mean.

....but then I realised. I could rent my own place, and leave this one standing empty. I could disconnect all the services and stop paying all those bills, change the mortgage to interest only. I could have my own front door and feel safe at last.

Down sides? Upheaval. Expense. His wrath. Can I cope with it all? I'm currently off sick from work with stress. But maybe it would be like a weight lifted.

Don't know what to do! Any thoughts?!

NotSuchASmugMarriedNow · 02/11/2013 06:55

Can you just change the locks? You can say that your bag was stolen with the keys in it so now you have to change the locks. Obviously don't give him a new key. He may or may not take you to court to get access tot he keys but this will cost him a fair whack and take him six months anyway.

And then even if he does manage to get a judge to force you to give him a key, you just repeat the whole process a couple of weeks later!

Inthequietcoach · 02/11/2013 06:56

Noregrets, what does your sol suggest? Are there any restrictions on your insurance if it is empty, though I suppose you will be regularly checking on it.

If the house is to be sold as part of the settlement, then it would make sense anyway to start planning your own future. It also means you take some control and remove a means of him bullying you (he may find another, but once you are in your own place to deal with it, it will be easier).

His wrath? If the only reason for staying is fear of his anger, the question would be what have you gained by separating? You still can't lead your own life.

Stress, the scary thing for me is, much as it is stressful dealing with his attempts at post-split EA, it is easier than doing it in close proximity. Scary because I did not realise quite how stressful it was.

tweedle, they are good at lies, but worse, I think they believe their own truth.

MuffCakes · 02/11/2013 08:44

YYY to believing their own truth.

Last night we went to a fireworks display and I looked at him and thought you complete and utter twat why don't you just leave us alone. In my head before now I had been secretly hoping he'd stop his selfishness and twattery but instead it gets worse week by week.

Not doing it again he can jog on, fuck off, jump off a bridge I don't care I just want to move on now last night really was awful and not just awful on me awful on the dc to. Not going to let that happen again.

Finally feel determined in my head with no little what ifs.

MrsMinkBernardLundy · 02/11/2013 10:07

muff tweedle noregrets i know it is hard when you are in it but i really see so much strength and determination in all of you. you are doing brilliantly in difficult circumstances.

noregrets if he won't sort out finances then he may be avoiding precisely so he can walk in and out. so you may well have to move. but you say he has never been violent, as the law stands afaik he does not have to be. if he threatens you in any way, if he calls you names, coerces you or intimidates you, all these things are now illegal and counted as dv. it may be worth speaking to a sol.

but i would also check out the local rental market and the position if you just put the house on the market.

Is he paying maintenance? Mortgage? Bills?

tweedlezee · 02/11/2013 10:19

muff a friend said to "keep hold of that" when I said the same to her - NO MORE. But he will be nice, happy, broken, you will feel sorry for him. you will think 'I am the only one who knows him. no one else will understand him like I do. I feel sad for him" don't feel sad. hold onto that nugget of knowledge of what he can *really' be like. Don't feel sorry for him. Does he feel sorry for you when he treats you the way he does? Nope.
I am writing this you.............and for me too xxx

TheSilveryPussycat · 02/11/2013 10:33

noregrets we divorced before settlement and were both living under the same roof while it was all going on. FW would not provide financial information when asked by my sol during divorce process.

The divorce was final in Feb 2012 (could progress to absolute as no pensions worthy of the name to dispute, and kids grown - if not, better to leave it at nisi until after settlement AIUI). That March I had to start legal proceedings to get him to engage. This sets a timetable for providing info, and eventually leads to court hearings. We had First Appt in April 2012 but reached settlement before the next hearing date (July). He moved out in August last year.

tweedlezee · 02/11/2013 10:38

The realisation that you can't afford to buy food for the family, are over drawn, can't pay car insurance and he has £4000 in a bank account I never knew he had. I am just very very determined that I will get my chance to shine and earn.
Should I print off a record of this? Will it help me in the future?

MrsMinkBernardLundy · 02/11/2013 10:47

Yes tweedle it can't hurt. gets records of anything you can.

And you are so right about not feeling sorry for them.you all need to remember that it is not your job to fix him even if you do know them better than anyone else. you cannot change anyone but yourself.

betterthanever · 02/11/2013 12:08

I'm boxed off I think. He is back and I have to do what he wants he has the backing of professionals, he is very good. DS thinks I want to get rid of him if I suggest him starting to see him and if I say this publically they say that is because of how I am influencing things. They say I am not allowed to have any reservations or be affected by it at all. I must do all I do and more now. It will finish me off. no regrets I am fighting hard to not be off work with stress as they will use that against me too but I am struggling, work is failing, am not even allowed to be ill. He wants to destroy me, it is working.

Noregrets78 · 02/11/2013 15:53

notsuch apparently if I change the locks he can legally break the door down... and that's what he'd do. He comes in and does his laundry so would know immediately.

quietcoach my sol has said I wouldn't lose out by moving out, it wouldn't affect anything. and realistically I can't keep him out using the law until we have finances settled / he signs over the house.

mink yes that's exactly what he's doing. Unless I give him enough that he can buy a house for cash, he doesn't see the point in settling and has said he doesn't care how long it takes. He still uses this registered address, washing facilities etc. I think this would be a really good show of how determined I am to start a new life. He pays no maintenance, mortgage or bills. I cover it all myself. He is a total cocklodger even now divorced!!

silvery that's quicker than I was thinking, which is quite heartening. But I suspect he'd refuse to engage in any element of the process, he's already said he will never set foot in a court room. Not sure he has the choice... but he operates his own personal rule book. I keep thinking £5k - £10k and 6-9 months but no doubt that's oversimplistic.

The more I think about it, the more tempted I am to move out. The thought of having my own space at long last brings tears to my eyes.

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