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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: thread 26

999 replies

CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 13/09/2013 20:55

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you’re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie If you’re a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart - a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don’t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

OP posts:
CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 25/09/2013 21:08

better, sounds like you're really going through the mill at the moment. Hoping for a swift and good resolution.

OP posts:
MrsMinkBernardLundy · 25/09/2013 21:40

better ((hug)) the end of the tunnel will be along shortly I hope.
then you can ds can start looking forwards and making plans.

bountyicecream · 25/09/2013 23:27

Hi everyone. The holiday was good. Surprisingly good. In fact I grudgingly have to admit that it was better with fw than it would have been without. That has messed with my head a bit.

But now we seem to be regressing! On holiday I was more relaxed about dd's bedtime, as I think is normal on holiday. Now we're home I want it to return to her proper time. This is causing all sort of resentment from him now. Apparently I should just 'chill out'. otherwise known as do it his way

mink and pony really useful thoughts about dealing with grumpy children. Fw and I are both guilty of telling dd not to be cross. I must do some more reading about this. Although I doubt fw will change his views. What is the book that you have?

rose I was thinking of you and the course earlier today. How's it going?

better I really hope that things go your way and that the authorities see through the fwery. Can you try and see the coming to a head as the last little climb to the top of a huge mountain rather than a whole new hill to climb. So that although its a steep and scary bit if you look back you can see that you've come so far already. And that once you do this last bit you'll be on top of the world.

random I'm sorry I've missed your story but just wanted to add that women's aid are amazing. You'll get great advice from there.

charlotte hope things are all ok?

ponygirlcurtis · 25/09/2013 23:47

better fingers crossed for the authorities to do their stuff. You focus on you and DS for now, save your energies for that. Flowers

Sorry (but not surprised) there has been a regression bounty. Holiday is not a reality, as I know you know. Have you had a chance to think about your next steps? He really, really isn't changing and isn't going to. Sad

The book we both mentioned is How to Talk So Kids will Listen and Listen So Kids Will Talk - by Adele Faber and Elaine Mazlish I read it first when DS1 was about 3, it helped me a lot, I'm going to revisit it this weekend.

AnotherRandom · 26/09/2013 08:38

Thank you everyone.

He is not talking to me at the moment because yesterday morning I didn't pack his lunch. He was running late (his own fault) and I have told him he has to sort his own lunch out now. I did help get all the bits together, left it in a pile on the counter with his ipad and left the Tupperware box open for him to put in as much of last nights dinner as he pleased.

He was so pissed off I hadnt done it and was slamming doors and swearing at me. He got home from work in a mood and started arguing with me about it sprouting one liners such as:

What is the point in marriage if your wife won't do things for you.

So and so's wife at work makes their lunch.

I cannot believe you are actually going through with not making my lunch.

What is the point in being married if we do our own things

If you aren't going to make my lunch then don't bother making any of my food.

Stupid man. I told him he was being extremely childish but he wasn't having any of it, refused to help get our toddler ready for bed and didn't talk to me and hasn't talked to me since. He is now making his own breakfast and giving me the silent treatment. It not only pisses me off but makes me incredibly sad that things are this petty.

AnotherRandom · 26/09/2013 09:00

Oh wait! He actually made me breakfast Shock but we didn't speak once. He has just left to go work and he did say 'i'm off'. I am so lucky Hmm

CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 26/09/2013 09:44

I cannot believe you are actually going through with...

FW does that, too. Thinks that a verbal nod towards equality should be enough. He said that my concerns about overnight stays were a "fair point" and is now incredulous that I still don't want the dcs to stay overnight. Hmm

What is the point in marriage if your wife won't do things for you.

Very enlightening, that! And I suspect 'my' FW feels the same: the point of marriage is to make life easier, by having someone else do the stuff you don't feel like doing.

And he makes your breakfast to make the point that he is a better person than you and would happily be a slave to your needs at least until you start behaving like you're supposed to and his point's been proved.

OP posts:
CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 26/09/2013 09:45

Highly romantic, that view of marriage, isn't it?! :o

OP posts:
AnotherRandom · 26/09/2013 10:37

Lol I am indeed a lucky lady who has an extremely romantic husband Grin one who actually told me that he doesn't need to tell me I look nice because I always do, therefore he doesn't need to tell me Hmm this was after me telling him that when I dress up he never pays me any compliments. I'd like to say I've given up caring but it does hurt when your own husband doesn't really give a shit.

TheSilverySoothsayer · 26/09/2013 10:45

random of course it hurts Sad - detachment comes further down the road. You have made a good start in contacting WA.

What is the point of marriage if we don't share the work and the fun? A question that simmered in the back of my mind for far too long.

MrsMinkBernardLundy · 26/09/2013 13:29

Ah compliments. mine used to say things like: you like nice today. not like normal when you look like a lesbian mugger.
Or hmm this food is nice. not like the usual shit you make.

Apparently i did not know how to take a compliment so there was no point.

I also got 'what do i get out if this rs' which was pretty much the same as what is the point of marriage...

And charlotte he has been generous enough to allow you to have an opinion you surely cannot expect him to listen to it as well. Hmm

such charming men.

I lent my copy of how to talk so your kids Will listen to FW. he was furious when he found out I had been using it on him. just as well he never read toddler taming GrinGrinGrin

betterthanever · 26/09/2013 14:05

Thanks for you kind messages and support - I am not feeling much better today at all, I thought I would feel a bit better. bounty you are so right about the mountain, I think I fear that what if when/if I get there it isn't the top, I worry that actually the next peak is even higher and my resolve has gone. I need some rest - work is really busy and having to get extra hours in still to pay sol. bills which rise by the hour.
bounty I am glad that the holiday went well, any time happy is a good thing.
Random I would take him up on this one: If you aren't going to make my lunch then don't bother making any of my food
YY to what Silver says about sharing.

MatildaWhispers · 26/09/2013 14:15

Lurking today and reading about the lovely compliments from these charming men reminded me of what my FW once said to me.

He told me I was a 'low maintenance' woman in terms of the compliments that he needed to pay me, but what really hurt was that he claimed he had kidded me into believing that I was a 'high maintenance' woman with regards to needing compliments. He told me he had done this so that I felt unable to exert any kind of pressure on him for compliments, and so that I did not raise my expectations that he would compliment me (as I would only be disappointed). Angry

foolonthehill · 26/09/2013 14:32

Hi all.

Just waving from the hill as I am immersed in a very not nice (understatement of year) dealings with FW, FW lawyer and FW friends and supporters (see Lundy). Trying to defend (with help of lawyer etc) against many accusations Shock of me being abusive and manipulative and child abuser etc etc. (sorry...I think FW might have found Lundy and be reading the script). It's nasty, it's messy and it has thrown me back into the world of FWittery aided by some child contact which is as usual not about the children.

For those of you at the beginning hold yourselves tightly and know that you are worth so much more.

For those of you getting out more power and strength to you.

For those of you in the new life and moving onwards and upwards bunting and flags.

love Fool

betterthanever · 26/09/2013 16:36

fool I don't like the FW's but I don't like the system that enables them to do this as well - the system allows it because it makes money out of it. The FW friends and supporters become as dangerous at the FW.
A friend of mine was so confused by my FW trying to get them on side - I gave her the bit you mention from Lundy to read. Get as much rest as you can to keep your wonderful resolve. No matter how many times however many people tell those lies, it will not make them true.

ponygirlcurtis · 26/09/2013 21:37

fool Sad at your FW and his entourage. Flowers for you and your strength and courage. Waving the (c)bunting in your honour.

FairyFi · 26/09/2013 21:52

how about turning from 'straight and direct' to complete spinaround 'mendacious' Matilda

thinking of you all, and not of FW's. I haven't been following sorry, but noticed a flying Tis hurrah for that. love to all xxx

ponygirlcurtis · 26/09/2013 22:09

Flowers to you Fi xxxxx

CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 26/09/2013 22:13

And love to you, too, Fi.

Random, my FW is the same. Doesn't need to compliment me because I should assume that he is thinking all good things about me. After all, he married me. Compliments are implied.

He, otoh, needed a steady supply of compliments, just to stop from feeling insulted. Hmm Once when he was twisting round something I said to him to claim that, in fact, it was I who regularly criticised him, I asked him to provide an example of a recent time when I'd been critical. "You didn't say anything about the dinner I made yesterday," said he, with all the confidence of someone with flawless logic. Confused Confused

OP posts:
MatchsticksForMyEyes · 26/09/2013 22:16

waves to all Just signed the Consent Order and Statement of Information forms today and that has gone off to court now. Solicitor expects the court to call us down to explain it as the settlement is so low.
FW spends all his time bleating to me about how skint he is. I honestly think it's just my wages he misses and the fact I used to do all the crappy stuff in the house that he doesn't like. Dishes at his house are currently washed when he has run out of everything. Ditto laundry. Yet when I lived there I would have been yelled at if I'd not done those things or the house was untidy.

betterthanever · 26/09/2013 22:18

match may your FW enjoy his messy home. Hope it gets signed off as soon as possible and you can move on up another step.
Flowers for fi

CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 26/09/2013 22:19

Ah, but Match, it was your Lot In Life, whereas he, of course, is Above Such Things.

:o

OP posts:
ponygirlcurtis · 26/09/2013 22:45

Hope it goes through quick Match. Block out his bleating, it's pathetic.

KouignAmann · 26/09/2013 22:47

Having a fattening Breton NC here since I have put on a stone what with being happy and all, and reading the PTA LemonDrizzleCake thread!

Charlotte I know that trick: You have to keep up a steady supply of approval and praise for just being a normal person or the FW gets resentful he is not being appreciated for (gasp) clearing the table or (drum roll) putting out the bins! Mind you even that was so rare I probably would have commented.

My FW is about to get a shock because the last slave DC moves out to uni next week and he will be alone. I caught myself worrying about him managing until I remembered he has a housekeeper and a gardener and a girlfriend to look after him. Hmm Whereas I don't worry at all about me and I have been on my own for three glorious years!
Old habits die hard I suppose.

KouignAmann · 26/09/2013 22:59

Match you were obviously a very good Minion. Pity he didn't look after you better or you would still be there supporting him...

I'm at the same stage as you. Waiting for the pensions split to be confirmed then it is OVER!! I am going to feel awful and be really upset when it is final I think.
I never wanted to be divorced. It isn't who I am! But then I didn't expect my H to turn out to be a FW either. Or me to have an affair with a totally unsuitable married man. Or leave my home and children.

I am going to be very kind to myself and behave like I am a little bit ill. Comfort food and trashy novels maybe.