Update on my stingy MIL post if anyone remembers

[tabbycat15]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/a1803878-Stingey-MIL-makes-me-feel-like-an-outsider

I might be repeating some things in this msg but my previous post is a long thread.

Well we broached the subject but were told that they hadn't factored in paying us anything & made it such a big deal that it costs so much for them to come & see us that they can't afford to give us anything. They are coming business class & they are not that hard up for money. They said that they had to have their roof fixed & BIL is living there rent free/unemployed & what with his baby coming along they have to buy things for him.

We have worked out that we will be about $1000 out of pocket when they stay. The fleeced us with rent, never helped us out when we had no money & had to buy food/nappies on our credit card. They never bought DS anything like a cot or pram when he was born.

When we lived there she wouldn't let us do our washing in her machine even though we bought it. She said I don't think my machine will cope with all your washing so we had to take it to the launderette. This was 21 years ago & we were charged 170 pounds each rent for staying there.

I am so angry that I have the inlaws from hell. I've only ever been nice to them. Mil never helped out with DS or helped me at home. I was really ill with PND & have no parents. They lived 5 mins away but just didn't want to know. They only ever had DS twice when he was sick & couldn't go to the childminder. I had to pay the childminder & MIL charged me by the hour as well to have him for a few hours. I had to go into work as I had no other choice.

The only time MIL ever rang was when she wanted her beauty treatment done for free. When ever they came to our house we would be in waiting for them. They never rang the door bell, just walked straight in with our key. We had a key for their house but always rang the bell as wouldn't have just walked in.

If we went up for dinner I was told what I had to provide. I usually had to cook the dinner & bring it up with me. I can understand bringing so wine or something but not the main course. Xmas we had to buy everything except the turkey & take it up with us. She would make a point of telling us how big the turkey was & how much it costs.
She wouldn't feed DS at all when he was there. We had to bring all his food & drink with us.

I really have the stingist inlaws. I'm glad we are in Australia now as now I realise how bad they treated us.

Read the whole thread and there's no mention of your dh being involved at all. What's going on with him, then?

Tabby what kind of advice did you want?

There is no advice that will turn them into nice people or make them behave more appropriately towards you. No advice from here,to you, will make them kind, or make them give you money.

The only thing to do, and you know this, is to make it stop, now. Only you can make it stop.

You can't do this though, you say. So really, I think you need advice on how to make yourself feel stronger and more confident.

But however weedy you think you are, in any confrontation you would be the winner. Because you are right. If you say no, timidly, or don't provide food, or say "what are you doing" when they try to eat dinner you've cooked for yourself, or if you leave them at the airport, at some point, a row will ensue.

In this case, you don't need to be great at standing up for yourself, it doesn't really matter if you melt into tears at this point, or any point, because they'll be out in the open as nasty horrible bullies who are abusing you.

Even if you cry on the phone when they call from the airport, or you're shaking when you stand behind the front door not letting them in, what are they going to do. Assault you?

They aren't going to do that. They'll be mad as hell, but they won't be able to physically force you to do anything. And if they even try, you call the police. It doesn't matter if you're scared. You can still do it, even when you're terrified and weepy. It's still possible.

I agree they sound horribly selfish mean people and you are seething which most people would be. You must tell them they can't stay and will have to find their own accommodation. I don't think under the circumstances I'd even bother asking them for money for their board. It seems to have gone way beyond that. Sometimes people do feel obligations and that's fair enough. But I fail to see why you have any obligations to this pair.

Don't go OP. If you read through again you will see that most people have been supportive.

I get the impression that this trip is happening and you're not going to be able to stop it. Instead, you need to take control and ensure it doesn't cost you anything:

1 -email mil: "I've booked you a taxi from the airport. You'll be able to get aus dollars to pay for it from the cashpoint in terminal xx at the airport. It might also be worth you bringing your driving licenses as hiring a car will be cheaper than using taxis while you're here"

2 - when they arrive, make them tea, give them a biscuit (this is simple good manners!) then say "as you're family and staying so long, I've cleared out this cupboard for you. There's a few tea bags in there and I'll give you directions to the supermarket so you can get more when you get the rest of your food."

3 - show them to their room. Show them the pile of clean sheets they can change when they need to. Give them a folder of maps, instructions for washing machine etc.

4 - Bugger off. You've done the polite bits. You've provided what they need. Now leave them to it.

You know, I'm beginning to think there's a lot more to this. Stuff Tabby hasn't shared. I'm astonished that there's been no mention of how DH feels .... and ..... that kind of makes me wonder if he feels differently to Tabby and isn't prepared to stand up to them (and has warned Tabby off from doing so instead). That would explain why she's asked for help, yet appears very reluctant to consider acting upon the various suggestions made so far - because (perhaps) she feels her marriage would be at risk if she went against her husband's wishes. I could be totally wrong of course - it just seems a bit odd that's all that DH has only been mentioned in passing, as opposed to how he feels about the visit and what he feels about Tabby's misgivings and upset.

It could well be that Tabby's resigned to letting this visit happen - in exactly the same crap manner as past visits have played out - and that she just came on here for a vent. Errrmmmm - okay, up to a point. But you know, a lot of people have invested a lot of time trying to be helpful, sympathetic and constructive. I understand people need to vent but I do sometimes wish those who simply want to sound off would be clearer about that.

Hi Tabby,
I hope you are still reading. I'm in Perth, I know how expensive doing the weekly shop is here. I think people in the UK might be shocked!
So firstly, if you can't do anything about them coming then I really think you need to plan ahead and only have the basics in. Get the $1 bread from your local IGA, eat mainly vegetarian food, buy only the Coles/Woolworth own brand. Don't have wine and beer in the house.
Keep to your routine, don't take time off work, go to playgroups etc. in other words - don't be available for them.
On days when you really feel like you can't avoid doing something touristy go to things like Kings Park (beautiful views - you can do free guided walks - free parking), or the beach - there are lots of beaches along Ocean drive with free roadside parking, or at the weekend (free parking then!) park at Heirisson Island and go and find the Kangaroos. You'll also get beautiful views of the city.
If they make any comments about the basic rations, you having to work, and 'free' outings, you need to respond and say you can't afford luxury food or the entrance fees into places or meals out or to take time off work.
Put a laundry bin in the room they are staying in. Do not empty it and wash the stuff yourself. Leave instructions to the washing machine and how to turn off the steam on the iron in their room for their arrival.

You can't change them - you can only change the way you react to them. You need to plan your reaction to scenarios, you need to talk to your DH so that you are on the same page. You need to find your strength - and you have without a shadow of a doubt got some - to come out the other end of all that you have been through tells me that. Find your strength and stand up to them in these small ways if you can't cut them off.

My parents are visiting me and my family in October - I know they would bring you out some calpol etc (I normally ask for some!), you can pm me. In fact, please pm me for playdates (I have a toddler and a baby) and or coffee meet ups to get you out of the house and away from them when they are here!

Look Tabby if you can flounce on here, you can deal with your outlaws.

Present a united front with your DH and get him to tell them by phone or email them that woopsy in that case you really can't afford to have them stay and you hope they will have a lovely time visiting all the touristy places in Oz. You hope at some point to touch base before they leave.

Seriously do it, you will only silently seethe and have to make cuts and miss out due to financial restraints if you let them stay.

Were they invited to come & stay in your home?

If not, tell them to book accommodation.

I reckon you are well within your rights to do the following:

serve small amounts of very plain food at every meal
no wine with dinner (if you are drinkers)
not take them out anywhere because the car is too expensive to run
refuse to go to local attractions for financial reasons

See what sort of a holiday that is for them. But if they won't contribute and you are going to have to use the same budget to look after them for six weeks...well, that's not going to go far!

How awful. But in reality, and I'm sure you realise this, you have let them get away with this for so many years, that it's not surprising they just keep going.

What I think I would do in your position is actually keep a tab of how much them being there is costing you - in terms of bills, food, fuel etc. - and then tell them at the end that, if you were her, this is how much you would be charging them right now for their visit. But since you are NOT her and would not stoop to her level, all you will do is just not hand over any money for the few bits of stuff she's brought out, since that will constitute a teenyweeny proportion of how much they have cost you.

With a bit of luck, you'll offend them sufficiently that they won't ever return.

And yes, keep everything to the absolute basics. As for running around after them like the maid, forget it! Seriously! They already think so little of you, what difference is it going to make if you upset them now? Plus there's the added bonus that you might offend them sufficiently that they won't return...

Don't let them use the car without you either unless they contribute to the insurance, especially if your FIL is 78 - he might have/cause a serious accident - and telling them so might offend them sufficiently that they won't return...

Are you seeing the theme here?

If they can afford business class flights and travel insurance for the over 70s, then they can afford to pay for the food and fuel they would have spent in a month in the UK. They are just choosing not to.

Wombat has wonderful advice, and I would add only - assume they will " steal" eat your food so run your own cupboards down. If you go out for a meal together, go for an all in one and pay up front for yourselves.

I'm a grandparent and I love my DGC dearly. I hope I enhance their lives.

However - their lives would not be ruined if I wasn't there. And if I was as toxic as your ILs it would be to their detriment anyway. So it really doesn't matter that these people are the only GPs your children have. GPs can be a wonderful addition but they really aren't a necessity.

If they won't cancel their tickets, write and tell them that you cannot have them stay unless they pay upfront. Otherwise send them a list of budget hotels.

What on earth have you got to lose?

We've stayed with cousins in Perth and the price of some things was shocking. I do have a lot of sympathy with the OP as it's v difficult to be hostile to guests, especially when they are DH's parents.

If it were me I would do a average level of service throughout the six weeks (look martyred and put upon) but on the day they go take them to the airport and, just before they get checked in hand them a letter. This letter can say all that you want it to, in a reasoned manner. It will be read when they are on the plane and you are not around.

This is not the actions of a courageous person but might work.

Wombat has some great halfway measures that you could use.

You have obviously been conditioned by your childhood not to be currently able to tell toxic, nasty abusers to fuck off. That's not your fault. That doesn't mean it will always be like this.

Baby steps, you will be OK.

Great advice from Wombat and ATruth.

Be firm Tabby and don't let them guilt you into doing things. They were not guilted into providing for you so don't let them get to you.

Keep posting during the visit and we will top up your resolve!

I'm not sure if this helps:

Remember in thinking about being assertive that we can be part of our problem. People can't make you feel guilty about lending them the car. They may be difficult, but you can only make yourself feel guilty. Only you can resist it. So practice that. I learned this in practising in the past against some of my H's passive aggressive behaviour.

Decide what you will and won't do happily. Do that. If they complain, explain what is possible without justifying yourself. And then drop it in your head and move on, and resist the urge to feel guilty.

I unravelled that with my relate counsellor. It was very useful.

Any other way if approaching the issue gives them too much power over you, and means that you risk letting them criticise you and defending themselves. The way I am suggesting keeps the power with you.

Frisky has a point. They would be spending money on food/fuel etc if they weren't going on hol. So it's not that they can't afford to. They don't want to.
Good luck OP.

Wombats post is great.
They are coming and I don't think you can response like some of thextreme suggestions on here.
You have told them money is tight.
Don't go into debt for them.
Have you weekly budget do the basics shopping and once it's gone tell them. Keep a few jars of baked beans for emergency no cook dinners.
Don't iron. (Maybe do your ironing and once done ask gp if she wants it left out to use? Otherwise pack it away)
Don't change sheets.

Tell them (or get dh to) that the rent is £200 a week (or however much you want) while they are there, and they need to pay upfront or you will not be able to accommodate them. Whether or not they will or can afford to pay is not your problem, either they pay, or they don't and then don't let them in.

Once they've paid, you can tell them the house rules you will need them to be aware of, eg, you may not use the washing machine, you may help yourself to tea/breakfast etc, you will not be waited on, you will organise your own activities and transport.

You don't have to justify this, it's just the way it is, they can take it or leave it. If you feel it necessary to justify, or if it would make you feel better to do so, then remind them of the rules when you lived with them. You need to grow a backbone when dealing with these people or they will carry on shafting you forever.

I fear Tabby has gone

I remember your last thread OP!!

Really think that you should reply by saying that you know it will be tight to pay you, but are sure they will manage ... just as you did all those years ago when things were so diicuklt and you paid them for .....(can't remember the exact list you gave, but am sure there were several!!)

Please don't let them get away with this.

diicuklt
or difficult, even !

Actually ..... on a re-think, you should just email and tell them that they will have to defer their visit then ...... because you simply don't have the spare cash available to feed them etc

People reap what they sow, OP, and after all you have been through you should not feel even a moments guilt for finally drawing the line.