Why does my 26 year old daughter hate me so much.

[cazakstan]

I have 2 daughters of 22 and 26. My eldest left home at 16 after an argument and for the past almost 11 years has visited and stayed occasionally. She's just finishing a masters degree and has nowhere else to live and so has been staying at home with myself, my partner and my younger daughter. I must admit my relationship is not fantastic...it's always hard with her...it's like she has always had a bee in her bonnet with me. It's easier with my youngest daughter...what you see is what you get and we have a great relationship...but...my eldest...god...for the past 11 years it's been like walking on egg shells...she criticises almost everything I do or buy for her. She,s well travelled, educated, has a steady boyfriend. It has been getting harder each visit. Yesterday she would not stop criticising my younger daughter...my mother was here visiting...my youngest ended up in tears and left...even after that my eldest did not let up.. even after I asked her several times and then told her to shut the fuck up. My mother said she thought WW3 was about to erupt...she offered to take my eldest home with her...I said that was a good idea...give the situation a couple of days to cool off. It ended up with my eldest saying that she would be homeless, not be able to finish her masters and that she would never see me again. My mother left with my eldest. I had little sleep last night. I messaged her this morning saying that I did not throw her out, that she needed to get on with her life and not be making comments on my daughters life or mine, also that she needed to lighten up. That I was her mother and that she would always be welcome home, that she needed us as a family. 10 minutes later she replied...we were not a family, we do not behave like a proper family, that she has got on with her life without a family and continue to do so. OMG. My mother phoned me early evening to say that my daughter needed her books and clothes...I said that since my daughter was being so nasty to me that it was maybe best that my partner drop her stuff off thus avoiding a confrontation between her and I. My mother passed the phone to my daughter who immediately called me two faced then said why can't I talk to her like an adult. I hung up. I hung up to avoid any arguments. So that's where I am...I love her but don't like her. I don't like her animosity towards me and I cannot bear to argue with her. I want her to be happy and to get over whatever it is that makes her hate me.

I still think that what went on when she was 16 needs looking at.

Op feels she did enough, daughter maybe feels she didn't or was too little to late.

And of course if the people she was staying with all though she was right & kept telling her so...

I'm not sure how I'd react if my daughter left home at 16.

I would feel hurt, confused but initially angry & probably wouldn't react in the best way to solve things.

And the more I asked her to come back, the longer she'd probably stay away...

My sister moved away-no argument, but would always come back for three months of the year.

She seemed pissed off that things in the house might have changed, that something had happened that she hadn't been a part of, that mum & I had done things together & might still do so whilst she was with us.

As if she couldn't cope with the fact that we could all carry on when she wasn't there.

Didn't mean that we didn't love her, miss her & were always pleased to see her.

diddl. I agree that what happened at 16 is quite crucial
The op and the daughter had sperate counselling which is very good. Shame perhaps that they didnt have some together.

And have others have said on here, ultimately, probably what is needed again, by both of them, is some more counselling.

I would say op, to maybe print out what is on this thread. As I dont think there is any way that you are going to remember all of it.

dunno mrsdv. trauma is what is says on the tin isn't it? we all try and survive as best we can and do what we can for others whilst doing so and everyone reacts differently i guess. imo the worst of trauma is when it is swept under the carpet by those capable of pretending it never happened and those who can't have to suffer in silence or act out. it doesn't sound like that has happened in your family so that's a good thing. maybe time and his own journey will change things?

My DCs once they'd left home and were working, only seemed to phone me to have a whinge about something or other, they'd start off asking how I was etc then the real reason for the call would come out, difficulties at work, boss being a prat, fallen out with bf/gf, your eldest DD sounds a bit the same, DM is someone safe to rant to about things which is good imo as life isn't easy. But they don't do it much at all now they are older.
Also 22 is quite old to still be at home, presumably this is for financial reasons, my DCs couldn't wait to get away. Or is the relationship with DD2 very close, so that DD1 feels left out?

I'd suggest family therapy for you all together.

Significant I think that the latest blow up happened after a good, cosy, family morning together. For your daughter, the good times may seem so fragile that she needs to destroy them before someone else destroys them for her. Your mother too may have sensed the bonds, felt left out and sought to profit from the situation by inflaming it?

It also sounds like DD tries to dominate family life when she is there to keep it under control and know she is loved and you react to this yet this is actually making it worse when you do things like, agree to no hoovering, or jump to bake a cake at the last minute because it still isn't in any way "normal" and giving safe boundaries.

Blaming others for things takes the focus away from ourselves and it sounds like both you and your daughter do this a lot.

You need to go back a lot earlier than the blow out at 16 to find the roots for all of this but overall it sounds like your older DD is suffering tremendously from a deep inner belief that she is not good enough to be loved and, given what you went through with your own mother, she probably triggers the same fears in you, which makes for a painful and volatile relationship - with you both trying to prove to each other that you are good enough to be loved interspersed with being angry and punishing the other for triggering those needs.

OP am I your daughter?

I'm not so don't worry (as I'm 35 and have 2 DC!). However one of your subsequent posts describing your daughter sounded scarily familiar. I was very angry all through my 20s, particularly with my mother and the biggest problem was I didn't know why. Hugely frustrating.

I too avoided family functions, was a bit prone to dramas and equally there were lots of tearful phonecalls to my mum from random countries I was travelling through. Problem was, I just couldn't fill the void. I just never felt unconditionally loved.

My mum even now is of the opinion that she ' gave me everything'. And she did. Except she didn't give me the things I wanted and needed the most; unconditional love, acceptance and validation. Consequently my 'dramatic' and sometimes selfish angry behaviour masked a very sad, lonely girl who just wanted to be loved, not made to feel like someone who needed to perform or act in a certain way.

Well, after years of working through it all, (and I mean years) I had the realisation that my mum is pretty much a proper narc (lots of enmeshing/triangulation/smothering etc). I'm not suggesting for one second you are OP as I don't know you and it's a positive thing that you want to sort it out. But I have to say, speaking from my own painful experience, that the greatest gift you can give a child is for them to know, really know that they are unconditionally loved AND accepted. I do feel for your daughter. Good luck.

"Talking to both my youngest daughter and my partner they have mentioned that it is my eldest who has the problems and that I have done nothing wrong."

I'm sure someone has mentioned it already, but it will not make a difference talking to them. They have not felt what your eldest have, or experienced it the way she has. It would be the same case if I asked my dad or younger sister - they would say mum has done nothing wrong, when she is very abusive towards me and my older sister. So really, it's no point asking them for their opinion, they are too close to you.

Agree with Littleleen. If I asked my brother about my mum, he wouldn't see it. They're too close to you and have a different relationship with you.

Is the youngest the golden girl, more favoured and liked? Does she feel second best and less loved? She sounds angry and hurt. Maybe start by telling her how much you love her and telling her all the things about her you adore. Do you do nice things with her alone? Do you make her feel special?

My mum didn't give me what I needed. I had unmet needs.

I think it's really easy to have a scape goat in the family and assume others have no responsibility.

OP

Are you angry/hurt because your daughter has succeeded in spite of you, and is not someone you can control - is your younger daughter more compliant, maybe?

I do feel sad to read this. OP don't feel judged, don't feel you need to judge your elder daughter - stuff happens you know.

She sounds so hurt, you sound so hurt and I truly believe that the hurt you feel is proof that you both care about what the other thinks.

She's still your little baby girl and you are still her mummy. Leave your younger daughter out of this and speak to each other - just the two of you, it might be painful to hear what she says but remember that she's still your little girl. Listen and let her know you understand even if you don't agree, it is obvious that your opinion is very important to her or she wouldn't be so angry and hurt.

It is normal to want to be independent as you grow up and it is normal to make mistakes. Actually I am in my fifties and still make mistakes, I accept that in myself and don't think it makes me less of a person or less worthy of love. It is also normal to be upset when you are hurt by someone you love.

Be brave and be strong - this is about you and your child, no-one else needs to be involved.

Good luck

Ok...My own mother had me when she was 16...the boy she was with forced himself upon her. My mother met and married my step father when I was around 4. Until then we lived with my grandparents who when my mother married wanted to raise me...my mother refused...My first childhood memory is of him sitting me in the kitchen feeding me sweeties...I was in hospital fighting for my life...they weren't sweets. I know this because my grandparents would often talk about what happened...also I have a few scars to show for it. The relationship with my mother and stepfather was and always has been volatile.
I was 15 when I left to live with my grandparents.
I have a half sister and brother. My sister got pregnant at 16 and they forced her to have a termination.
My brother was thrown out when they found out he was gay.
My sister had a baby 21 years ago but it died...cot death. My mother tells everyone that she killed her own baby. My mother started to go to a spiritualist church and has a relationship with her dead grandchildren through the church...the one that died but also the one they forced into aborting...crazy right.
My sister went on to have 3 more children...the eldest of which my mother and stepfather took away from her to raise as their own..a replacement for the one that died and also some kind of replacement for the aborted child. The child is now 19 and evil...oh and bloody well gets everything...they've just bought her a flat 'cos they can't cope with her..she amongst other numerous things tried to poison my mother.
I had little contact because I did not want my own children brought into all of this.
My mother and stepfather interfered when my eldest left home at 16...it was really nasty.
My mother I think hates to see me happy...I have two great children...well when one of them isn't acting like an arse. I know that my mother didn't help the situation the other day...and now who knows what nonsense she is filling my eldest's head with...I do know that my eldest will however see through this one day and hopefully soon...she has never had a great relationship with them...so I can't believe that nearly 5 days later she's still there...apparently she's off back down south on Tuesday to stay with a friend...
Neither off my daughters know the whole story of my childhood...

I have just come back.
Gulp op
My word, so many family tragedies.
Dont know where to begin really.
Can I just get a few things straight?
It was your stepdad that gave you "sweets"? And he is still alive and with your mum? And the things that happened to your brother and sister were also done by your mum and stepdad? HOw did your mum and stepdad manage to take away your sister's eldest child?
And your mother also says you sister killed your sister's baby?
Just wanted to get a few things right. Would you say or does your mum say that your mum is some sort of witch?

What did your mother and stepdad try to do with your daughter at 16?

I can sort of see why you havent told your daughters the full story. Ironically, especially the elder one as she may think you are trying to turn her away from her grandparents.

In answer to your original question OP, I think your mother and step father (he sounds evil) are the reason.

They have probably been dripping poison for years...and now she is staying with them.

Yes...Cater8...Yes it was my stepfather who gave me an overdose...he sat me on top of the kitchen work surface and gave me what he said were sweeties.
My mother and my stepfather took my sisters eldest child away by taking her for the odd day, then overnight, the odd day turned into them turning against my sister and keeping her eldest. Over the years they poisoned her against my sister...who simply after years of fighting gave up...she has no contact with her daughter or my stepfather...just my mother very occasionally. My mother tells everyone that my sister suffocated her own baby and that they took the next one away to save her from the same fate.
All the time my girls were growing up they had almost no contact with my mother...nor me. I never once sat them down and told them all of this...although now they both know a little...my youngest probably knowing more and she can see my mother and the situation for what it is.
My eldest however I think sees me as the problem...probably because...yes at 16 she turned to my mother after not having any contact for years... I can only imagine what was said about me then.
I did phone my mother yesterday...I'm off to a get together this afternoon ...( my brothers husband is back from oz for a couple of weeks and his sister lives near to me...she invited me over but not my mother...I think they know what she's like.) Anyway...my mother was jealous of my invite and got herself invited through her son in law. Well...My mother said she was now far too busy today with both her granddaughters to now go...mentioned that my sisters child had more than a few problems and that she along with my EVIL stepfather and MY daughter were going to spend the day running around sorting things out. She also said that My daughter was off back down south this Tuesday and that she did not want to talk to me. Thanks mum...
So I'm now baking chocolate tarts and banoffi pies to take with me...I'm a pastry chef...and I've just burnt a tray of pastry cases because I'm fuming and can't stop all of the hurt and pain I feel from probably the day I was born up until now from filling my head.
I'm tearful, sad and just feeling complete despair...I'm not angry though.
My youngest daughter is coming with me this afternoon...I'm happy for that...just wish my eldest was here too. But, I don't think she will be here for a while...I think she will in time see through my mother and stepfather as she has before...Or maybe I'm just hoping that she does.

You have so much to tell dont you? This could go on and on. I am quite happy to listen. I assume it is helping you to talk on here?
Something that I am concerned about is that you are giving out quite a lot of personal detail. I iamgine that htat is quite carthartic, but MN and posters do say to remember that the internet is not private. I am thinking for example, that if your younger daugther were to say that you use MN, then your mum might come on here for a snoop.
I am happy for you to pm me btw, but you probably need more povs than just my own on all of this.

Will have a better read of your post later on today.

it is all so passive though.

yes, as a child you had no choice but to be in passive victim mode and just 'hope' things got better.

as an adult it's different.

i'm afraid i cannot compute allowing your niece to live in a house with a man who tried to kill you when you were a child - i would move heaven and earth if someone like that tried to take my niece.

i cannot compute how a child can just be 'taken' by a grandparent let alone into a proven abusive household.

just 'hoping' your dd sees through them (which is an aside to your relationship with her anyway) is a choice to do nothing.

sounds like you've all learned a hell of a lot of passivity and victimhood that hasn't been dealt with and grown out of off ergo the next generation hasn't been protected and actively fought for because everyone shrugs and says what can i do.

i just cannot conceive how you could sit back and let a small child be taken into a house with a man in it who tried to kill you as a child.

and the 4 months no contact makes more sense in this context because your auto response would be that same passivity and lack of responsibility and action

i'm not having a go at you. the whole thing is desperately sad but someone has to break the cycle. maybe it will be your eldest dd because the scapegoats are usually the lucky ones in the sense that they get angry and hurt and in a mess and that leads them to seek out help. and when they get that help they have a chance to work it all out and decide to do very, very differently with their own children.

I'm with swallowed here, up to a point, but actually the whole thing makes lots more sense now . I am no psychologist but it seems to me that ... having had to cope with so much rejection (and issues) from your mother, which were only really resolved through a long period of no contact .... your instinctive response to rejection by your daughter would be to go into the same self-protective mode, and withdraw emotionally.
If she has instigated what appeared to be withdrawal ...then your mindset may well have gone to auto "no contact is the best option"

Unlike swallowed, I actually think you have the capacity to break the cycle.
Really.
Just in writing all this through, you have become more analytical about it (thats obvious from the difference in your posting style).
A lot of us here will stand testament to the fact that parenting cycles can be broken. Totally changed.
You obviously did not parent your little ones as you were parented, and I believe you have the capacity to recognise that many of your feelings are more related to issues with your mother than your daughter.
Dump the history, and walk through the door you have opened for yourself...... don't be 'in the right' like your mother. Don't allow what she did to you, to colour your future relationship with your daughter.

I also think the op has the chance to break the cycle.

Long way to go. Long long way to go, partly or mainly because I have been left wondering whether to help heal the daughter, the op has to first heal herself and to work, probably not with her mum but with a counsellor, about the relationship with her mum. [I think, sadly, that it would be very difficult to have much of a relationship with her own mum, which I think the op realises].

This is helping in making me realise that I must accept that my mother never was and never will be a great parent...she behaves most of the time like a shit stirring child herself.
I have had counselling on and off over my lifetime...the last time being about 5 years ago when I had no contact with my mother...pity I went on holiday and had a few drinks and decided to call her. I thought that I was kind of in control and that any contact was better than none...I mean what if she died and I hadn't had any contact...how would I have felt. You're quite right MumnGran and Caster8 in saying that this has effected the way in which I perceive this rejection at the moment with my own daughter. I do think that one day and hopefully soon that we can get back on track with our mother and daughter relationship...this time without the input of my own mother...I do think that I ought to have no more or very little contact with her...not let her into my family.
I still haven't heard from my daughter and every day it hurts. I so much don't want her go down the same path as I did. I'd do anything to make everything alright and break this cycle.