Being single

[blackbirdatglanmore]

This is a spin off from another thread on here which made me realise several of us were in the same boat.

When you split up with a partner, or express anxiety about the years ahead, either because you want a baby or just worry about being alone, one of two responses tends to be made.

The first response is that you WILL meet somebody, it is easy, the person you're talking to has and they know an aunts friends neighbour who did. If you've been alone some time the response becomes accusatory and tells you that you haven't made the effort and you need to 'put yourself out there.' For most people this means online dating or 'clubs'.

The second response is that you should be happy for beng single - grateful in fact, because they had an abusive partner some years ago and are happier without him and if you're lonely maybe you should join a club.

This thread is for single women in the real world. To take the first response, you may meet somebody, that is true. However, for some of us we know its unlikely. In my case it is my age. I am mid-thirties, most men my age are settled with a marriage, a mortgage and children. Younger men want younger women. I joined mysinglefriend last year (online dating site) and the numbers of hugely attractive, professional women in their thirties was significant. I got nowhere with that, one date and we had little in common. I have since spoken to many women who have admitted online dating wasn't for them, and nor was it for me. I am a slow burner and can't feign affection for somebody on the basis of one meeting. That leaves meeting someone in 'real life' which is not easy. Certainly all (I'm really not exaggerating) the men I meet are attached.

While you can be happy alone, and I am, it doesn't mean it isn't hard sometimes. My social life is restricted and I spend a lot of time alone because my friends are married with babies/small children. Holidays are difficult. I don't get to enjoy any intimacy (I wouldn't like one night stands) and while I've taken the step of deciding to have a child alone, for other women accepting single hood means accepting being childless which would break my heart.

The advice to 'put yourself out there' and join clubs is well meaning but doesn't account for the lack of 'clubs' - certainly around here the clubs are for young mothers and for retired people! Not quite what I am looking for!

'Get a pet' is also advice that can be very upsetting. I have two cats, they are much loved animals but they are not a people substitute and should not be viewed as such.

Sme people assume you are single because on some subconscious level you are damaged and shy fom intimate relations. There was perhaps some truth in that for me once, but in the last seven years I have worked with men who I found attractive and who I was drawn to. If they'd asked, I'd have said yes - but they didn't - why, because of their girlfriends.

So I am starting this thread in an attempt to:

dispel the myths about why women are single
to give us a safe place to moan without being ordered to join clubs!
discuss matters pertaining to single women.

I hope someone else posts now!

Marmite - I totally agree with your last two paragraphs. Society definitely IS structured around the pair bond and anyone who fails to conform is immediately held slightly outside it.

The plight of the working poor, particularly the single working poor, is a much overlooked problem in this country, I couldn't agree more. I've been there in the past and will admit to sometimes feeling angry and bitter about it myself back then. Now the boot is on the other foot I've reassessed things, that's all.

It's about time we accepted that families come in all shapes and forms, and that they don't necessarily involve bonds of blood. My friends really are my family and I would walk over hot coals for them, just as they have really supported me when I've needed it. Those relationships matter more to me than any of the romantic ones I've had.

I've never been loved truly by a man either (my DCs father was abusive so not really capable of it), but I don't feel like I've never been loved. I get that it's a human need to want to be loved, but I really don't understand why that has to be by a romantic partner.

ANother long term single here, but I'm a happy one. I never much enjoyed being in couple-relationships, because I really like to have a lot of time to myself. Mind you, there have been times, since having DS (got PG unexpectedly by an old drinking mate who is a great dad and a good friend, but we are not and never will be a couple)when I have felt lonely. THough that's mainly been down to no babysitter/no cash, because I've always had a mix of friends ie some single, some not. Perhaps because I'm sort of 'non-mainstream' and most of my friends are similar (as someone else once said, it's all pagans, perverts and morris dancers) there's less of an emphasis on a romantic couple-relationship being the most important thing. Though that was what made things harder for me when DS was little - I had so little in common with the other mums at toddler group that I really couldn't make friends with them, and the majority of my longterm friends remain childfree even now, which lessened the chances of that 'Oh come over for lunch, bring DC, we'll all go to the park together'.

And at every election, I have to listen to the rubbish about "hard working families" -- I could go on. If I think about it, I get angry & bitter, but that is such an attractive state of mind, so it's obvious why I'm single & childless ....

This makes me howl with rage too. They could simply say "hard working people" and it would mean the same thing. It's the subtle endorsement of the (nuclear) family as the optimum state that I despise, as though the rest of us don't pay tax, or our hard work is omehow of less intrinsic value.

I left the UK a couple of years ago (and the men are no more eligible here! ) but I now live in a country where taxi drivers and other random strangers will openly ask you if you are married. I used to say "no, not yet, no-ones asked " Then I tried "none of your damn business!" but the reactions I got were the same. Basically, they asked what was wrong with me. Now I ashamed to say that I lie and tell them my husband is working on an oil rig/in the army/a commercial pilot etc and that seems to satisfy them. Another way in which I have disappointed the 18 year old feminist that I used to be!!

Single and 47 here. It is different when you have kids, thats inevitable. I think marmite has it spot on. You aren't number one to any other human. One of my best friendd moved city a few years ago and another is going soon. Friends are invaluable but they cannot prioritize your needs ahead of their own or oh's. It can feel seriously lonely. Try being a single lesbian- my online dating experiences beggar belief. For a start many women still behave passively and don't initiate contact. It's hard work and thin pickings. Whining? Yeah too right. Why not? We all do it, we all have our issues. But not unlike real life struggling with some aspect of singledom is frowned on. How sad

but I don't feel like I've never been loved. I get that it's a human need to want to be loved, but I really don't understand why that has to be by a romantic partner

Dahlen, it still drives me crazy that I feel this way, that friends & be;loved family (siblings & nephews/nieces) are not enough. From a feminist perspective, it annoys me that I am emotionally invested in romantic love.

But I try to be kind to myself and say that I'm just as shaped by socialisation as any other woman (or man) that feminist theory (I've read alot of it) explains. That's the economic but also emotional sort of infrastructure we live in IYSWIM.

And yes, the evidence on mn (where I lurk far more than I should) is that marriage isn't always happy, but it's the way the world is organised.

Maybe I need to learn how most men seem to be able to be so emotionally detached? But my feelings are a big part of me, and its annoying that sometimes I feel I have to apologise for them

And also, its not just being loved its having that other person to put first, as you put them first that person for whom you can save stuff up to tell them, and so on. So it's loving someone else, as much as being loved. More maybe

Let me try to explain about the loneliness, Dahlen . I live a life & face a future of no-one loving me. Yes, friends and family love me, but there is no-one in this world who has said publicly that they will put me first. And no-one for whom I have permission/agreement to say that about. And no child who, for a short few years (I'm a doting aunt, I know how quickly they grow independent!) will be all in all.

This is my life. And it is hard, because if you try to express it and get the well meaning advice about aerobics or book groups, then it makes me want to cry and feel like saying, "I just told you I could die and no one would care and you suggest fucking ZUMBA?"

They don't, and I don't, but it's knowing that even if I wanted to confide in somebody I couldn't that makes it all the more lonely.

I think another problem Dahlen if I may touch on it is that you mentioned something about having stuff to do. I have things to do; there is always something. But I am not bored. I am lonely (sometimes.)

V good point about hard-working families.

SGB, I love your posts just thought I'd chuck that in!

This is a very interesting thread! I'm not single, but was actually discussing with a friend the challenges of meeting/making new friends at different stages of life, which ultimately finding a bf is, but harder due to the fact they have to be single, open to a relationship and you have to find each other attractive!
In terms of just friendship, the opportunities change as you get older. at school you're surrounded by same age peers so chances of finding people with common interests is good, same goes for college/university.
When I was late twenties I moved abroad (just married) and it was difficult to make good friends. I went to the gym/yoga/met dh's collegues and their partners but the people I met had families, plenty friends, etc. When I started work I made some superficial friendships, but they were with people a decade younger than me with totally different interests. It wasn't until I had children I made connections with women similar to me that turned to real lasting friendship. Now if we move again in the future when the children are grown I think how on earth would I meet other women to form a bond with, never mind a man should dh and I not be together for any reason!

Sorry for the ramble, and imposing given I'm not even single! But despite that I can totally get where you are coming from, and quite frankly I think finding anyone "special" in your life (platonic or otherwise) is totally down to luck/fate call it what you will!

I don't mean to imply that I think you are 'wrong' or 'weak' to want romantic love Marmite. I think it's a very normal, human need and I agree that it is culturally reinforced at every opportunity.

Also, I'm writing this from the viewpoint of someone who is in a relationship, so it would be completely hypocritical of me to say romantic love doesn't or 'shouldn't' matter.

Feelings are feelings, and entitled to their expression even if they can't be resolved.

I just take issue with the idea that only a romantic relationship can provide that feeling of being loved and considered important, of someone putting your needs at the top of their list of priorities. May be I am just incredibly fortunate, but I have had that feeling from friends and family; never from a romantic partner. And if I were in the position of thinking that finding romantic love was an increasingly hopeless prospect, I'd be doing everything I could to nurture those friendship and family relationships. There is nothing I can't confide about to my friends, no question of my being left alone at 3am if I needed someone. And that is much more reliable love than romantic love because the latter comes with attached strings far more than does friendship or family.

I suspect I am lucky with my friends. I went through a terrible time and asked for help and was astounded at the level of support I got. I would never have asked for that had I not been desperate, so I would never have realised the potential of my friendships. I always say that the worst time in my life has led to the best because it showed me what I did have at the exact same time what I thought I needed was taken away. But maybe it's not luck. Maybe we underestimate our worth to others and sometimes all you have to do is ask.

blackbird - I didn't mean to undermine your feelings about loneliness as distinct from boredom. I was commenting on LonelyThirties posts above, where she said she went to bed at 7.30 some nights because she had far too much time to fill.

oh such a relief to read these posts!

"nobody will love you til you love yourself". I do love my self. That doesn't put more decent single men in my path though.

And

"I've just told you that no other human being puts me first and I might die alone and you suggest ZUMBA"

i love this thread :)

As a long term, ( almost 5 years single), ive head all those things.... clubs, getting out there, stopping looking, makeovers, makeunders, doing 1001 different things... must say i have got to the point where i get cross when someone comes out with such banal things.

I pretty much like being single, actually i now cant think of living my life any other way. DD and i are happy, i Do love myself, and we have a full life. Ever so occasionally something happens that makes me incredibly aware that no one puts me first and i am, in fact, on my own.

Im 35 in sept, im also fully aware its getting harder and harder to meet people, online dating has killed my soul so im just taking a chance on meeting people in real life, which in the last 5 or so years, hasnt worked :)

Single and happy here. I don't want a partner, I don't look for one. It never crosses my mind to have one. I do not want another person in my home, I would resent it. I like my personal space and I like the dynamics of my life with my dc's. I like making my mind up about everything all by myself. Having my life to live just as I want to live it and dc's aside - never having to compromise, talk about 'issues', discuss things and make joint decisions.

I do have sex though. And its great! Its on my terms and I walk away after it. Oh, well, I don't mean I am off out every weekend sh*ing the pants off every strange man I happen across... Just, you know, if I feel the urge I will go find it - it is out there and as long as you slip a glove on it, well, why not? And mind your behaviour as far as dc's are concerned. I am the utmost of discretion!
What irritates me the most is all my friends, even my neighbours, try to palm me off with any male with a pulse that sets foot in the near vicinity 'Oh, here's Sieze, she's single you know, take her out for a nice meal...'
They seem to think I ought to be with somebody - they also seem to think I am fibbing when I say, hell no thanks, I am absolutely uninterested....

I love this thread. I also think it's very important to have a space where single childless women can express their concerns.

Dahlen's post has given me food for thought, and I don't for a moment imagine that single parenthood doesn't have it's many challenges. But the poster who referred to "waves of panic" really summed it up for me. I don't even want children now but I also feel this deep and almost primal fear at the thought it may never happen. It's not just a Daily Mail plot, I do only have a narrowish window left in which I can have children and that does change the dynamic.

I'm not lonely, I'm not unhappy, I'm not insecure, but I'm very aware that if something doesn't come together in the next five years I will be facing a very different future than the one I kind of always assumed would be there.

I can really relate to this. I am single and have been (mostly- bar a brief relationship at the end of last year) single for over 3 years.

I want children and as I am getting older am realising that I may have to do it on my own. My deadline is 35, am 30 in a couple of months. It does make me sad but not having children isn't an option. I am an auntie and I love it and when I see my sister and her little family I do get pangs of I won't have that if I do it alone, but the other option is never being a mom.

I absolutely HATE it when someone says 'oh you'll meet someone..' and other variants, they don't get it at all. My best friend is about 10 years older, she married young, had children and then left her husband as she wanted more. We grew close due to mutual singledom, BUT we are not the same. She has a family. Her husband still loves her and wants her back. She said the other day that she left as she thought the grass would be greener and it isn't.

I generally am happy with my life, I have a good job, am studying to improve my career prospects, I own my home and yes I have cats! But I feel like I've been single for so long that I don't know how to be in a relationship. It scares me.

In the nicest possible way, it is good to know that there are others out there in the same position as me and who feel the same as me.

OP, you mention that you are doing the children thing alone, I think this is a really brave thing to do. Good luck :)

Thanks. I'm feeling a bit like the odds are stacked against me at the moment; we shall see.

Like you I knew not having children wasn't an option. In many ways, I prefer the idea of having children alone. I do feel sad I won't be able to find a dad for them, though.

I didn't realise this thread was for only single childless people.

Sigh...

I apologise for posting.

It's not, but what some of us are saying is that the experience is different and it can get drowned out elsewhere.

I agree how deeply ingrained it is that we should all be married with children and it wasnt until divorcing I really realised that. I also admit to hating the word "family" now eg friends saying Oh we are going to go out for a meal as a family. I partly hate the twee factor but also that when I am low I dont feel I have my family anymore and I know my DD sees it like that.

I understand the concept of not being anyones priority too. A close friend had a 50th party last week and her lovely DH had done a surprise photoboard for her including pictures of them getting engaged and married. I had a moment of self pity - who would do that for me when I am 50 and who loves me enough to take that sort of trouble in the first place ?

The thing is though when I was 40 and had a party XH just nipped out to Messages and bought a load of 40 paraphenalia and didnt say you look nice when I had been brushing up for weeks ! We could have limped along until I was 50 and by then he probably wouldnt even have bothered coming to any party !

I just try and accept that it is a downside of being single that you could die and nobody would care as it were. I know that I do a lot more instigating of meet ups and having people over because I know if I didnt I wouldnt see anyone outside work whereas when married you have a default of company/something to do.

I suppose for me having been shabbily treated as a wife I still see the upsides of being single as far outweighing the down. I have reflected in the past though that I am glad I got married and had DC and I think in the shoes of posters on here who are younger talking about being childless I would feel the same.

I hope the thread can accommodate all of us

It does get easier ...

A close friend had a 50th party last week and her lovely DH had done a surprise photoboard for her including pictures of them getting engaged and married. I had a moment of self pity - who would do that for me when I am 50 and who loves me enough to take that sort of trouble in the first place ?

Been there, done that, got the T-shirt ... What I do now is make darned sure that I do that for myself. I try very much to create the kind of things for myself that I wish someone else would do for me.

Yes, there is the hump of feeling that I have to get over, feeling sad that there's no-one else there for me. But then I think, well, if I don't do this, I'll be even more miserable. Although I'm not sure I'd do a photoboard for myself!

I just take issue with the idea that only a romantic relationship can provide that feeling of being loved and considered important, of someone putting your needs at the top of their list of priorities

Dahlen, you say yourself that you're in a relationship ... so with respect I think that that's why you maybe you don't understand what others are saying. You're in a relationship which offers the primacy that others say they don't have. So of course you can look beyond that to see all the other forms of support. It's easy to do that from the kind of position you occupy.

I am extraordinarily happy single and can't see it changing for a few years yet.

I left me exh 6 years ago and I've been through various stages to get to this point though, including not wanting anything serious, then desperately, desperately wanting a proper relationship and to be loved, various failed dates and short relationships, a 14 month relationship, a horrible break up and then a year long casual relationship. My happiness at being single clicked into place just before the year long casual relationship. Then when he moved abroad things clicked even more for me and my single life.

Now my life is absolutely packed with work and DD and the social life I am beginning to carve out

I'm in quite an unusual situation. 33, with just one child, a 17 yr old DD... I am now experiencing freedom that I've never had as an adult.

I find the issue of potentially settling down and having more kids etc just too confusing. I don't know if I want to do it all over again. I find that thought rather scary because it's a real crossroads to deal with if I ever do meet someone worth a proper relationship with.

That probably contributes to how happy I am, just as I am. No complications, no fuss, sorting my life out and planning for it to just be me, relying on myself alone, long term. Enjoying the freedom I have never had!

I find lack of sex difficult to deal with but I have a few FWB I can call on if it all gets too much.

I wouldn't change a thing right now :o

UptheChimney - did you miss the bit where I said I was single for years beforehand, and that this relationship is very recent? TBH, lovely as he is, he's still not the first person I would call if I needed someone at 3am.

Oh sorry, Dahlen Reading here when I shd be working!

Also, I've had the photoboard thing done for me, a surprise party organised for me - again, all by friends.

Very interesting thread - thanks OP!
I'm a single mother of a baby (and I'm 45)
I spent my 20s and half of my 30s in 2 relationships and wish that I had done things so differently!
Agree with posters above re finding a decent bloke in your 20s (when they are plentiful!) as although when I split with my ex at 36, and knew I could be single for a while, I had no idea what it was like for single women of a certain age...

Luckily I never had a burning desire for children, and find it ironic that I'm now a mother! However I would not have missed this for the world, despite the loneliness and other challenges of single parenthood.

Although I'm not looking for a relationship at the moment, I would like one in the future, although sadly this will probably not happen if I'm honest.

I do find it frustrating that most men seem to want to date younger women - my ex (baby's father) always took the mickey out of my age (he's 2 years younger than me) and I found out the OW he was seeing since before I was pregnant is his prerequisite 10 years younger...

Any look at on line dating sites seem to evidence this. I'm not really interested in much older men due to my interests and will not be looking for shag buddies either.

I have my son and very good friends thankfully. I'm moving to be nearer to them.
I have actually advised a couple of younger single friends (mid thirties) who want kids to think about getting their eggs frozen. And one of them is doing it - she said it will take the pressure off and she can then go the doner route if she doesn't meet someone.

Sorry for the ramble, some really good points on this thread, and like others have said, it's nice to know you're not alone. Despite our different circumstances with/without kids, happy single or not, it's really interesting reading others' perspectives on singledom.