Support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships...coming of age:21

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Hi MrsM been thinking of you. Care to share a little more? Sending strength (or at least strong )

Nice not to be alone then better. My dreams are the only place he'll be now I guess.

silvery yes yes to love and pain. I'm afraid I have a bit of a tortured poet type soul so I can see why I bought into it all. He would make me name more places and veto all of them. He'd then pick somewhere else. I always paid. He would say the fact that I paid meant I had to decide because it was only fair. Of course other times he had no qualms about demanding to go to particular places on other occasions and me paying.

Stay strong mrsM you will get there eventually.

He's swaying between saying he needs to speak to a solicitor etc and saying that he wants to go back to how we were. I would love to go back to that. I was so happy before the EA started but I just don't see how we can start again as he put it.

It's really hard to break habits and start again. I always found that the slightest thing could set us back to square one and my ex had a knack of me being the one to start afresh, burying his despicable behaviour while he could drag up anything I'd ever done at will. Be careful.

I'm lying in bed drinking tea, something I could never do with FW cos he would never make me one. His mugs in his house were always vile too. I'm repeating to myself it was only ever going to get worse

My estranged mum is really messed up because I think her dad was/is like this. Her behaviour is why we dont speak anymore. This is a good thing I haven't repeated everything again.

Well done for keepiing going MrsM despite the pangs. Its a shame isn't it that EA isn't just a badly chosen gift that we could bin and never have to see again! That its a non-transplantable part of him residing darkly brooding deep inside of him

Hello everyone,

Long time no speak again....Hope everyone is OK?

I am still working all hours godsend saving the money up to leave. FW EX got a job, and lasted all of 6 weeks before he got the sack which means I have had to work twice as hard. For me, realising the abuse has been more painful than I had expected. I realise that for years, I have put up with his emotional abuse thinking there was something inherently wrong with me and ended up pretty much hating myself. No wonder I used to feel so anxious and depressed, although when I finally made the decision to leave (Valentines day) miraculously my depression lifted!

I realise that I cant really have any kind of meaningful communication with him, and Lord help me if I bring up something about his character that has hurt me. He couldn't possibly do anything to hurt me of course, I am just too sensitive. He will put me down, but when I try and stick up for myself, he doesn't like it. He is passive aggressive and manipulative, he has no friends (apart from 1 who makes the odd contact every now and again and is his weed smoking partner) and makes zero contact with his family. Living with him has been so isolating. I now realise that the occasions where he has put me down, and I have tried to justify myself has ended up with me turning into a screaming hysterical mess while he stands there cool as a cucumber. The wonders of perspective.

Detachment has done wonders for my perspective. I realise he ignores me pretty much 85% of the time, and I wondered why I felt so lonely all the time.

Unfortunately, I feel like my anger has turned inward in that I am really cross that I allowed someone to treat me this way, and for so long. I don't love him at all now, but then I see pics of him on his phone with my daughter and you can tell she loves him, so I feel guilty that I will be taking her away from him, but I couldn't stay with this man if they paid me a million pounds! He went into the City recently to get yet more dope and I was secretly hoping he was shagging someone else...

It's no wonder that I have not wanted to sleep with this man for years. And I often showed signs of someone who was being abused, not wanting to be touched etc but I couldn't understand it. I stupidly thought that I may even of had some repressed trauma. Sorry to ramble on, just needed to get my thoughts out today as feeling a bit sad today.

I am going to start house hunting end of this month early June and I am so, so, excited. I am going to start my course in September, I am going to be the mum that I want to be to my daughter, and life is going to come good I just know it.

Oooops that was a bit long..

No it wan't Eternal. And all of it very heartening :)

Hello all.

MrsM glad to read your update, and glad you are still out. At the very minimum you need space away from him for a couple of weeks, for you to think about what you want and for him to listen to your concerns and think about what he wants too.

Eternal nice to hear from you again too. Glad you perspective is still in tact, and great news about the househunting.

Mink something you said yesterday I think, about your FW suspecting others of his own bad traits. YYY. FW assumed all other men I came across in any context had designs on me. One weekend, DS1's friend's dad dropped him back at the house after a playdate - FW went over and made a point of introducing himself with a very firm handshake and a slight hint of menace (I thought). He said afterwards that he was just letting the other dad know who he was, just in case. I said there were nothing to worry about - he was happily with his wife, who is my friend. FW said you could never be sure, that I didn't 'know what men were really thinking'. I can only assume from this that he constantly was looking at women and eyeing them up. He has no reason to suspect this kind of behaviour in other men unless he is doing it himself.

I haven't been on for a few days - partly I have just been exhausted again, unable to do anything in the evenings other than lie horizontally. Partly it has been a deliberate thing - I feel a bit conflicted at the moment, I want to try and get myself back and stop thinking about FW all the time. Sometimes coming on here stirs up thoughts and memories and makes me think about things too much. but at the same time, I think about you all so much, I want to support you all, and I also worry that I need to be processing all the stuff that FW did (because otherwise I'll just ignore/minimise/forget). I am trying to reach some kind of balance between the two. In the last few days, I have hopefully gained some kind of handle on my awful over-eating, and I've been reading up on the 5-2 fasting diety thingy. I did a 'fast' day on Friday, and actually it was ok. I almost enjoyed it. I have been eating better generally and trying to stop the emotional eating. There is a definite link between me thinking about FW, getting upset (even if I don't realise it) and eating till I burst. So if I go AWOL again for a bit, please know that I am still thinking about you all, I am just trying to sort my head out in a different way. I'll always be back. I can't stay away!

pony, good to hear from you, totaly get what you mean about getting yourself back. I realise my life was so highly organised around FW that I need to find my own routines, de-withdraw myself and start seeing friends again etc. I think, I hope, that healing is a process and the balance will tip from thinking about FW to actually concentrating on yourself.

mrsm, it feels hard because it is hard. You can't just go back to how you were. The hard thing is disassociating what he wants (he can't decide, therefore emotional seesaw for you) from what you want. We are so conditioned to focus on their needs.

ER, good to hear from you. Glad you are feeling less depressed. Post as much as you like, it is heartening to read.

mink, what you wrote about conflict was helpful, esp re book-buying, looking for solutions without being entirely sure what the problem was. I remember buying a book on step-fathering, because of the conflict and tensions around his relationship with dd. It must have been 3 + years ago, possibly 4. That is a really horrible realisation, because it means on some level I knew and I tried to make it okay. Though I also knew it was not okay.

Which brings me to the why does one stay part of your post. Because they need you to stay. For me, I grew up in a household where disobeying had catastrphic consequences. The behaviour patterns were the same. And leaving is hard, because you are not allowed to leave. I am still fighting to leave, psychologically, he is trying to control me and the situation, and I am struggling to assert that the situation has changed and he can't control it. And it makes me feel sick to the stomach.

So to come back to what you say pony, I think it is important to change the routines, changes (hopefully) the thought patterns, but this is really hard and that is where you need support from others, at least I do. I probably need more RL friend support instead of hiding away, though.

Sorry last bit didn't make sense, really just if you go AWOL, pony, the support is still here when you need it. I don't think there is such a concept as AWOL on here, you can suit yourself whether you come or go.

Struggling not to text. Having to keep checking my shit list. Don't want to give him the satisfaction of how hurt I am not to be hearing from him anymore.

Beginning to wonder if he's even a FW - if he was a FW he would have contacted me I'm sure.

I'm missing getting trussed up for sex but am sure I'll get an opportunity for that someday.

Hope you're ok pony

OK Colin step away from the phone. From your last post, it would seem your body is making its views felt. Remember the smell of shit as you witnessed for the umpteenth time that actually the sun did not shine out of his backside.

Thanks butterfly. I am ok, thanks. I just feel that I haven't spent a lot of time coming to terms with what happened and talking about it, and not much thinking about me and what I'd like. I like to lose weight. I'd like to feel physically better about myself. I'd like to get back to my writing, which I haven't done a scrap of since FW came into my life. I want to do positive things for myself, but I can't at the moment because I'm still so tied up in feeling crappy about him and how he behaved, about selling our house, about getting divorced. I need to move on, I'm just not sure how.

That sounds really hard when you mention about your childhood being all about not disobeying either.

Colin - I know what you mean, but believe me when I say - he was a FW. He was very, very abusive.
I think there is one of two reasons he hasn't contacted you - either he still plans to contact you but is leaving you to stew for as long as possible (see? FW.). Or else he really is completely shallow and able to cut you out of his mind (again, FW). Remember, he'd been telling people you'd already broken up. I think he realised you were disengaging from him so was coming to see that you couldn't be manipulated any more. It was taking too much effort and too much of his time. He needed to move on to someone who was easier to manipulate.

So, in summary - FW. Case closed.

Have you spoken to anyone at WA yet? Speaking to someone like that might help you gain clarity on your situation.

Sorry, I mean I have spent a lot of time coming to terms with what happened and talking about it.

pony i totally know what you mean. you can spend so much time dealing with it it takes you over.

i too like a bit of a fast. should maybe do the same with mn.

Colin did you read link.on abandonment. that explains why sometimes they just go and this is it. my fw had a couple of attempts at getting me to take the blame realised it wasn't working and gave up. he will probably stay away fir a while. hit a bump with ow and be back saying she us awful you were so much better. lend me fifty quid and take me fir dinner and i will tell you all about it. don't be there waiting when he does.

I think that's it, mink. If I were to list my hobbies at the mo, it would be 'thinking about FW, talking about FW, going back over everything FW has done, getting angry over FW...'. Hardly great first date material!!!! (If I ever, ever get to that point again...)

I agree Colin, that as soon as it goes bums up with new W, he'll suddenly be all nice to you. And if you wont have him, he'll try the next one on the list, and so on, until he finds someone else to take him on. It's not about him wanting a mutual relationship, it's about him wanting to be pandered to in every way conceivable. Don't be the waiting, and don't be the person who is willing to pander to him. Because it will always be about him and never about you.

Okay, your posts have helped me with my thread resolution, which is to try to do half an hour of gardening every day, even if it is after dcs are in bed. Something which takes my mind off FW and his antics, which is not work or dc related and which will grow and develop.

I've been to sleep and read my shit list. And of course your posts. The urge has subsided.

silvery thank you for that reminder and if you want grossing out anymore or further insight into his admiration for himself....I present to you him farting on his own hands and smelling them after. fucking hell. That's done it for me!

pony FW also stopped me from writing so I'm going to start doing it again I think. He harbours dreams of writing himself so I might use this as impetus to write properly just to piss him off. I actually stopped all my hobbies and have recently been picking them up so I think you are right, he was sensing that I was seeing through him and that I was no longer worth the effort. I'd also ceased to listen to him telling me I'm quite attractive realising I'm more attractive than he allows me to believe. I think he preferred me when I didn't believe I was attractive.

mink yes I've read that link. It was helpful. Looking back I think He's made bids to leave before just that things haven't worked out with the women involved and I haven't caught him.

And I genuinely believe he will stay away for good because of how bad the relationship got - he thinks I am abusive, because he thinks me a nutter and I humiliated him in front of this girl. So that's the end of that.

Colin he doesn't think you are abusive. he wants you to think you are abusive. it is not the same thing. nasty little fart hands!

Ah I see, silly Colin!

Either way, crazy fog lifted a little bit more.

I think if I can get through this month, I will be home free. Is that optimistic?

No, that's good Colin! He's controlling you by making you feel bad about yourself, because of what he's said. Try to step away and hold your head up high and let it go.

I hadn't thought of that as a form of control also. But yes. I also need to unhook his claws, one of his female friends has fallen out with wants to be friends with me which will drive him potty. But he cant control that. He shouldnt have been able to when we were together, certainly shouldn't now we aren't.

I think women tend to be controlled by people's perceptions of 'feminine' behaviour, e.g. you reacted in a way which you didn't like, he knows that and knows that you would be bothered by people's reactions to hearing details.

I had that with my ex but in the end thought I can't change it, I just need to step away.

It's difficult to break repetitive modes of thought but I hope you can step outside of it soon :)

pony yy to needing a break and time to focus on you not defined by relationship with FW. Sometimes I take a break from mn because I find myself nodding in recognition of so many threads that it makes me sad.

Also, I find I've spent so long trying to bend myself into whatever shape nsdh wants that I worry I'm very susceptible to suggestion. I remember reading once that if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything and sometimes I think that's what has happened in this relationship. (although prior to this relationship I would have thought I did know what was important to me and what I 'stood' for).

I need to be sure that when I leave it's because I've thought everything through and found my own path out. I had my first ecounselling session. The part I keep coming back to is around why we got together and when we were happy. It's not about recapturing that but I think it is important to acknowledge it because otherwise it seems mad to be in the relationship.

mink yy to thinking the best of people and hence not sometimes seeing the reality. My nsdh still makes comments that I think he can't mean, because no rational person could, could they? But, yes, he does because he can't empathise. Also, yy to the part about confrontation and conflict. I can see now that all nsdh's family can only communicate in confrontation.

colin you are being so strong and it must get easier. Yes you can be friends with his ex-friend if you want but rememember too that you don't need to be friends with her as a protest. Be her friend if you think you'd like to be, not in terms of defining your friendships in relation to FW (even if it's in relation to what he wouldn't want iyswim).

Sorry, this is a saga of a post. I'm off to read a novel and eat chocolate. Hurrah for the non-fast days on 5:2