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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Subtle EA? Or is it just me? Confused, please help

368 replies

WearingFuckMeSocks · 18/04/2013 12:04

I sincerely apologise in advance for the length of this post, feel free to skim bits if it makes it easier.

I have lurked here for sometime, have stumbled across the support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships, have never thought of DH as abusive as he?s never hit me but I?ve been unhappy for a while and couldn't understand why, he?s not overtly abusive, doesn't call me names or put me down in any obvious way, but over the 15 years we?ve been together has done some pretty shitty things. (We?ve been together 15 years, married for 10 and have ds age 7 and dd age 5)

only months after we got together I discovered I was pregnant, I hoped to sit down & discuss it like adults with him; he burst into tears, wailed, sobbed, put his head in his hands and begged me to have an abortion. I would have done anyway but didn't feel like I had a choice. The very fact that I was considering keeping it seemed to offend him.

He once burned the book i was reading on our BBQ (when drunk) because it was called ?The Satanist? and as a Catholic it offended him, esp as his mum had cancer.

once during a heated argument he got so angry he punched the wall right next to my head so hard it left the imprint of his four knuckles in the plaster; he said that was ok, he was so angry he really wanted to punch me but punched the wall instead.

2-3 years ago he decided to get fit so was having sessions with a PT, he badgered me into going too, even though I wasn't keen; after 6 months when i?d lost 1 1/2 stone, and gone from a size 16 to a 12 (im 6ft) he told me one night as i was getting into bed that ?he didn?t fancy me anymore, my tits were all saggy and I?d ruined my body and he wanted me to have a boob job"

last year bought me some eye-wateringly expensive underwear, and despite me saying repeatedly that it didn't fit has proceeded to buy me another 4 sets of same size stuff. Gets upset when I tell him it doesn't fit (again) and says he is only doing it to spice things up and put the spark back.

once remotley wiped my iphone after an argument, and during same argument threatened to sell the car

demanded/coerced me into sex when I had recurring thrush (every month, over a period of four years), despite me telling him repeatedly how much it burned.

no help with kids - has never bathed kids, could count on fingers of one hand how many times he?s put them to bed, says he cant read bedtime stories because he?s dyslexic but manages to spend 2-3 hours on his ipad every night. I thought that was normal until an exchange student we had staying with us for the summer last year commented on how he did nothing with the kids and I did everything.

went on holiday last year, DS took the class ?holiday bear? & was soooo excited, DH said we couldn?t take bear on days out in case it got lost. I was too scared to say the bear could go in the back pack, DS was visibly crushed & in tears, i felt I had failed DS because i didn't stand up to DH.

a couple of years back he tried to persuade me to have my navel pierced, i said no, then during an argument said he just wanted a sign that I loved him, like - guess what - having my navel pierced. to my eternal shame i did it, hated it but thank god it rejected so i took it out.

says he wants me to wear sexy clothes so that when we go out he can show me off and other blokes will be jealous. i don?t really want to anyones trophy.

he wants me to be completely hairless between my legs, i?ve tried it a couple of times but frankly don't like it, thinks its degrading, don?t think im setting a good example to my dd (or ds for that matter, what will he think when sees a real bush?), (and god does it itch when it grows back in) he says I should do it for him to please him.

Says i should do things to please him even if i don't like doing it, as he would do the same for me. i have tried to explain to him that i don't understand how he can get pleasure from me doing something I clearly don't want to do, and that i wouldn't even ask him to do something that he was unhappy with, but he doesn't get it.

A few weeks ago DS was unhappy at school & with homework, after a discussion with the head teacher I was browsing the web looking at home schooling (something I considered before DS started school, not something I?d rush into but it?s always an option) he caught me looking at HE websites, didn't think to ask my opnion about it, just went straight into a tirade about how he disagreed and he was really upset that I was even thinking about it.

basically every argument turns into how he feels about it and how upset I have made him feel and how i need to change my behavior so that he doesn?t get upset and that he?s only happy when I?m happy.

I?ve stuck it this long because of what we?ve been through with his parents, his mum had cancer for years, with all the entailing chemo, radiotherapy etc, then 3 weeks after she died we found out his Dad had cancer, he died 6 months later (Feb 2009). For a long time I?ve made excuses for DH?s behavior because his parents were ill and then obv he was grieving.

Last year things seemed finally to be good, we had about 6 months where I thought we were finally coming out of the woods, but the last 6 months have been hell. We argue every week, he says its because I don't talk to him. I?ve tried to explain I feel afraid to talk to him because he raises his voice, interrupts me, and doesn't listen. He says its all down to me, only I can change it and I?m not normal.

I could go on but think even i'd lose the will to live reading it all.

In short (and thanks if you?ve stuck with me this far) is any of the above normal? would you have put up with this thus far? Am I over-reacting? And what are the chances of things ever being better? should I just cut my losses now and run?

I?ve just turned 40, have taken a long hard look at the last 15 years and don't want the next 15 to be the same.

OP posts:
JennyMackers · 29/04/2013 19:37

oh dear. What a tosser. Your son won't be upset though. He's only parroting in that precise moment what he knows his father wants him to say. I told my children that I was very unhappy and had to leave.

You're not being paranoid about STATUS. I remember my x and his bitch of a mother yelling at me that I'd never get custody, I was unemployed, I didn't even drive, I didn't own a home or a car blah blah blah, oh yeh, I'd been on anti-depressants. They threw that in too. (wonder why?!). I told his mother that I wasn't unemployed, I was a mother to two children and that there wasn't a judge in the world who'd hold that and not being able to DRIVE against me. And I said the fact that I've no rights to any property is evidence of financial abuse. They didn't HEAR it. Not a word of it. They were convinced that I was a nothing and a nobody and that the judge would give them custody because they were home-owners and he had a qualifications and a job and a car. Obviously a bit further down the line, various solicitors disabused him of some of his delusions but to begin with, he thought that society and the judge and jury would see me as the same pathetic unreasonable loser with no rights that he saw.

JennyMackers · 29/04/2013 19:41

Wordybird, that is a good mantra.

Because 90% of what he says now is just drama baiting, and it WON'T MATTER in the long run. All that matters is the final shakedown so 'i will discuss that with my solicitor' is a great mantra.

WearingFuckMeSocks · 29/04/2013 19:55

Silvery & wordyBird, sound advice thanks. Its pretty much what i did say i.e. that's something I'll discuss with my solicitor. will repeat to self and him when the need arises. And also I'm thinking about that is another good one.

Sadly I still want to punch him.

And now he's saying I have an attitude and he can tell that i'm angry!! No shit!

aaaaaand relax.

OP posts:
Jux · 29/04/2013 20:06

Tosser, isn't he? Just trotting out your mantras to the rubbish he comes out with will (hopefully) give him a false sense of security, so he won't rack his brains too hard for ways to do you over for the moment, and when he realises how wrong he is it'll be too late.

LineRunner · 29/04/2013 20:19

JennyMackers is right that actual lawyers will disabuse him of his delusions.

The person who gave my ExH the biggest kick up the arse (that he deserved) was his own barrister.

WearingFuckMeSocks · 29/04/2013 20:28

you may have a point there re lawyers.

since he's seen his solicitor he's conveniently forgotten about his £125k "inheritance" that he was going to keep back from me and now wants to split everything 50/50. Grin

OP posts:
TeaMakesItAllPossible · 30/04/2013 09:12

To be honest I expect you'll continue to feel angry at him for a long time yet.

There will be the knobby things he says and does. There will be the false image he portrays as he presents his best face. There will be the genuine improvements he will make with regard to parenting his children because he now has to get involved. There will be dismissing of the abuse you suffered over the years. There may be the occasional ramp up and extension of the abuse you suffered.

It is natural. And each day will provide you with new things that will send you through the cycle of denial, anger, depression, acceptance and then move on.

I found my feelings one of the most overwhelming bit. I had spent 10 years suppressing how I felt in order to live with him so I initially I couldn't even recognise many of the feelings. Then boom. I was free to feel. And boy, did they all arrive at once Grin

WearingFuckMeSocks · 30/04/2013 12:12

Thanks Tea, I'm trying NOT to feel quite so angry, or at least not let it show, because he is still the kids' Dad and whatever shite he has heaped on me over the years he will still be (sadly) a small part of my life, much as I would rather, for my sake, he wasn't.

I think what I mean is, me being angry at him will only hurt me; he won't give a monkeys how i feel per se, but will use it as an excuse for him to be upset and create more drama, and may well use it as ammunition against me somehow.

He has made an appointment at Relate this afternoon and asked me to go. I said no. I have lost count of the times I've suggested Relate to be told that it wouldn't do any good; to quote FW "If you won't talk to me now, you won't talk in front of someone else". And the one time we did try it, he put on such a good act that I could tell it wasn't going to go anywhere.

Now he's suggesting that we rent the house out (Thats something I'll speak with my solicitor about Grin) so we can both afford to rent somewhere, and in a year or so we might move back in together and i'll give him another chance Shock Not bloody likely!

OP posts:
postmanpatscat · 30/04/2013 12:24

Good grief! Leave him to his delusions and sort your life out, you're doing great Smile

Fluffymonster · 30/04/2013 12:58

The fact that he's trying to now use the kids in some sort of chess game is sadly typical of abusers. He's just trying to manipulate you, don't fall for it - and it sounds like ds was prepped with all the "he has something to say to you" - business. Yeah, right. Why did he need prompting then? He probably got ds to repeat after him until he had the phrase set in his head. FW.

He's not thinking of their welfare - otherwise he would try to keep the discussions out of their sphere.

Dignified silence - do not engage, or it will be all too easy for the kids to become unwitting messengers in a game of verbal tit for tat. I like the stock phrases wordyBird suggested.

And believe me - underneath his calm and reasonable exterior he is probably seething.

TeaMakesItAllPossible · 30/04/2013 13:08

Good for you. That's a great approach to take and you're absolutely right about how he would use your anger, just like the offer to go to Relate - it will become part of the story of how he tried to make it work and be used to justify your unreasonableness.

I think feeling the anger, recognising it and only using it, or unleashing it, when it helps you will work for you and your children in the long run.

And Hmm at his continued persistence at not listening to you and what you want. I hope he is in denial on the change curve rather than this being the new pattern with regard to respecting your opinion.

WearingFuckMeSocks · 30/04/2013 13:34

it will become part of the story of how he tried to make it work and be used to justify your unreasonableness.

Just what I was thinking this morning, Tea. I will be the one who threw it all away, didn't give him another chance, broke up the kids home etc etc and he will be Mr Good Guy who battled bravely, against all odds, to save his marriage but twas all in vain. (cue dramatic music and rolling credits - "tune in next time for more heroic adventures of the indefatigable Mr Socks")

And now he's got Valium from his gp so he can continue the poor me story to anyone who will listen. Hmm

OP posts:
TeaMakesItAllPossible · 30/04/2013 13:48

Yes my ExH still has heroic adventures in dealing with me Grin, each email is worded in such a way that makes him a legend in his own lunch time.

I suspect he shows his wife.

Unfortunately, he hasn't really ever got over his whole PA way of communicating so this is me on receiving them ....

Hmm Shock Angry Wine Grin as I realise I only have to have these conversations over email [tea] as I get on with life happily.
TeaMakesItAllPossible · 30/04/2013 13:49

or Brew even

WearingFuckMeSocks · 30/04/2013 13:54
Grin
OP posts:
Fluffymonster · 30/04/2013 14:37

Oh, and it's killing him not knowing what i spoke to the doctors about last week , (which was his shitty, abusive behaviour, which obviously i'm not going to tell him that). he keeps saying there's something not right, there's something your not telling me, i'm really worried about you.

...

And now he's got Valium from his gp so he can continue the poor me story to anyone who will listen.

Oh!!! Fuckwit bingo!!! Grin

He's doing that "Anything you're suffering, I can suffer too - and more" routine! Oh god this actually made me laugh - that is so pathetic.

LineRunner · 30/04/2013 14:56

Tea I so recognise that!

cjel · 30/04/2013 15:52

remember 'quiet dignity'!!

JennyMackerz · 30/04/2013 16:30

yes Fluffy that is it precisely isn't it, anything you suffer I suffer more. BINGO.

The valium proves his suffering is worse!!

ScarletWomanoftheVillage · 30/04/2013 21:23

It's a worry he is prepared to use the children in this way Sad Next he'll be grooming them to say that they don't want mummy and daddy to split up, and it's never, ever going to happen etc. What a nasty piece of work he is. I should nip this game in the bud and have a firm word with him about not using the children in this way ever again.

WearingFuckMeSocks · 30/04/2013 23:16

Bud duly nipped - told H never to do that again. He said ds brought up the subject himself and said how lucky we were to live next to the river and how he'd like a house by the sea one day (which is actually the kind of thing ds would say) However, i also said it was a bastards trick to ask ds to repeat it to me.

Have just come back from seeing "The Taming of the Shrew" at the theatre with my mum. Has anyone else seen it? That is so NOT the play to go and see when you've just realised your H is a controlling, manipulative shit. I had no idea Shakespeare was such a misogynistic git Shock. Very unsettling & a bit disturbing towards the end, when Kate is broken.

But the acting was brill Grin so that's ok then!

OP posts:
wordyBird · 01/05/2013 00:48

Good for you, Wearing. I bet your STBX hardly knows what's hit him. Good! It has to be done.

'Taming of the Shrew' is a ... challenging play isn't it: certainly misogynistic, and hard to play sensitively yet with whatever intended humour can be found there. What do you think of the theory of Shakespeare as syndicate of playwrights - not just Will himself? Maybe that would help us feel better about plays like that, not sure Hmm

ScarletWomanoftheVillage · 01/05/2013 01:01

Excellent Grin

LittleFeileFooFoo · 01/05/2013 03:27

Wearing, I have been lurking, but I'd like to say that you're doing great, and you'll be so relived and happy when you're away from him! You can do this, and you're doing a great thing for the kids, and the cats!

TeaMakesItAllPossible · 01/05/2013 08:39

I hate Taming of the Shrew too for exactly the same reason. I saw it at the RSC many years ago and it felt like I was watching a car crash. I felt like a dirty rubbernecker. If it makes you feel better I tend to think of him as a mirror of society rather than inherently misogynistic and remind myself that even Elizabeth herself, who was pretty amazing all round, was at it "I may have the body of a woman but I have the heart and soul of a man". Very rousing but frankly my response is "My arse".

Morning and excellent response to his trying to wriggle out of his manipulation.