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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Subtle EA? Or is it just me? Confused, please help

368 replies

WearingFuckMeSocks · 18/04/2013 12:04

I sincerely apologise in advance for the length of this post, feel free to skim bits if it makes it easier.

I have lurked here for sometime, have stumbled across the support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships, have never thought of DH as abusive as he?s never hit me but I?ve been unhappy for a while and couldn't understand why, he?s not overtly abusive, doesn't call me names or put me down in any obvious way, but over the 15 years we?ve been together has done some pretty shitty things. (We?ve been together 15 years, married for 10 and have ds age 7 and dd age 5)

only months after we got together I discovered I was pregnant, I hoped to sit down & discuss it like adults with him; he burst into tears, wailed, sobbed, put his head in his hands and begged me to have an abortion. I would have done anyway but didn't feel like I had a choice. The very fact that I was considering keeping it seemed to offend him.

He once burned the book i was reading on our BBQ (when drunk) because it was called ?The Satanist? and as a Catholic it offended him, esp as his mum had cancer.

once during a heated argument he got so angry he punched the wall right next to my head so hard it left the imprint of his four knuckles in the plaster; he said that was ok, he was so angry he really wanted to punch me but punched the wall instead.

2-3 years ago he decided to get fit so was having sessions with a PT, he badgered me into going too, even though I wasn't keen; after 6 months when i?d lost 1 1/2 stone, and gone from a size 16 to a 12 (im 6ft) he told me one night as i was getting into bed that ?he didn?t fancy me anymore, my tits were all saggy and I?d ruined my body and he wanted me to have a boob job"

last year bought me some eye-wateringly expensive underwear, and despite me saying repeatedly that it didn't fit has proceeded to buy me another 4 sets of same size stuff. Gets upset when I tell him it doesn't fit (again) and says he is only doing it to spice things up and put the spark back.

once remotley wiped my iphone after an argument, and during same argument threatened to sell the car

demanded/coerced me into sex when I had recurring thrush (every month, over a period of four years), despite me telling him repeatedly how much it burned.

no help with kids - has never bathed kids, could count on fingers of one hand how many times he?s put them to bed, says he cant read bedtime stories because he?s dyslexic but manages to spend 2-3 hours on his ipad every night. I thought that was normal until an exchange student we had staying with us for the summer last year commented on how he did nothing with the kids and I did everything.

went on holiday last year, DS took the class ?holiday bear? & was soooo excited, DH said we couldn?t take bear on days out in case it got lost. I was too scared to say the bear could go in the back pack, DS was visibly crushed & in tears, i felt I had failed DS because i didn't stand up to DH.

a couple of years back he tried to persuade me to have my navel pierced, i said no, then during an argument said he just wanted a sign that I loved him, like - guess what - having my navel pierced. to my eternal shame i did it, hated it but thank god it rejected so i took it out.

says he wants me to wear sexy clothes so that when we go out he can show me off and other blokes will be jealous. i don?t really want to anyones trophy.

he wants me to be completely hairless between my legs, i?ve tried it a couple of times but frankly don't like it, thinks its degrading, don?t think im setting a good example to my dd (or ds for that matter, what will he think when sees a real bush?), (and god does it itch when it grows back in) he says I should do it for him to please him.

Says i should do things to please him even if i don't like doing it, as he would do the same for me. i have tried to explain to him that i don't understand how he can get pleasure from me doing something I clearly don't want to do, and that i wouldn't even ask him to do something that he was unhappy with, but he doesn't get it.

A few weeks ago DS was unhappy at school & with homework, after a discussion with the head teacher I was browsing the web looking at home schooling (something I considered before DS started school, not something I?d rush into but it?s always an option) he caught me looking at HE websites, didn't think to ask my opnion about it, just went straight into a tirade about how he disagreed and he was really upset that I was even thinking about it.

basically every argument turns into how he feels about it and how upset I have made him feel and how i need to change my behavior so that he doesn?t get upset and that he?s only happy when I?m happy.

I?ve stuck it this long because of what we?ve been through with his parents, his mum had cancer for years, with all the entailing chemo, radiotherapy etc, then 3 weeks after she died we found out his Dad had cancer, he died 6 months later (Feb 2009). For a long time I?ve made excuses for DH?s behavior because his parents were ill and then obv he was grieving.

Last year things seemed finally to be good, we had about 6 months where I thought we were finally coming out of the woods, but the last 6 months have been hell. We argue every week, he says its because I don't talk to him. I?ve tried to explain I feel afraid to talk to him because he raises his voice, interrupts me, and doesn't listen. He says its all down to me, only I can change it and I?m not normal.

I could go on but think even i'd lose the will to live reading it all.

In short (and thanks if you?ve stuck with me this far) is any of the above normal? would you have put up with this thus far? Am I over-reacting? And what are the chances of things ever being better? should I just cut my losses now and run?

I?ve just turned 40, have taken a long hard look at the last 15 years and don't want the next 15 to be the same.

OP posts:
ScarletWomanoftheVillage · 26/04/2013 17:04

Try not to pay heed to those things he is saying - just reserve decisions about those subjects for later.

He will not stop saying them. Just nod etc and say whatever's needed without fully engaging with him. He's not going to listen to you anyway. A few stock phrases like 'we'll talk about that when I've had a chance to think what's best' 'I'll think about that one' yeah yeah whatever

You don't need to be pressured, try and keep calm and best of luck!

JennyMackers · 26/04/2013 17:44

Oh wow, brilliant news. It's done. You handled it really well. Grin Wine Flowers

JennyMackers · 26/04/2013 17:54

I'm half-laughing half eye-rolling here, another one (me) who got told she was no spring chicken after I left him! how if I didn't come back in {glance at his watch} 72 hours, I'd have burnt my bridges with him and that would be THAT! my "last chance" to get back with him.

And just in case I thought I was young, my xfil rang me and I took the call but with a heavy sense of dread. He cut straight to the chase. What age are you now? 38 I said. "really he said, thought you were 43 or thereabouts". like hell, He never thought that at all. I don't look old for my age, he was just trying to tell me i was old and worthless. My xfil is worse than my x.

My son is no angel but he will have a lot more respect for women. It stops here. My son's wife will not be on mumsnet 2037 telling people what a selfish entitled bully he is.

JennyMackers · 26/04/2013 17:55

cjel agree with regard to quiet dignity. I wasted too much energy trying to get people to understand how bad it had been. I should have saved that for my friends.

wordyBird · 26/04/2013 19:32

Oh well done Wearing, that was brave! He may become an even bigger pain in the short term though - if he goes for any more wall punching, get yourself out of there.

so far, he has been wearily predictable hasn't he:

  • I'm not leaving the house
  • I want custody of the children (the ones he does nothing for)
  • it's your decision, you tell them
  • think of how upset they'll be not to have [fill in the blank]

Not too original, Mr Socks.

Has he tried 'you're an unfit mother' or 'I'm talking to social services' yet? Extra points for, 'you have MH problems and I'm calling a doctor'.

I'm using humour against him, but I know it's not really funny to have to deal with.

Stay strong and don't hesitate to ask for help if you need it, Wearing.

WearingFuckMeSocks · 26/04/2013 21:33

Yup, cjel, I too am aiming for quiet dignity - what a wonderfully calming phrase that is Smile

And humour is the one thing that will get me through - the day I can't laugh in the face of adversity (and drop ice-cubes down the vest of fear) will be the day that I truly do give up.

have spent the evening assembling a box of goodies - passports, driving licence, mortgage statements etc, to drop at my mum's tomorrow. she's away at a wedding til sunday but has left me her spare key "just in case". she also said pack a bag for the kids with a change of clothes and a school uniform - have clean uniform drying and empty bag waiting to be packed in the morning.

Despite it being a crappy day i'm feeling the best I have all week.

Thanks to everyone for the support, I really couldn't have done it without you Smile and thanks to IncogKNEEto, the Lundy Bancroft book arrived, i have skimmed through bits and by God, does everything just fall into place! I can see me reading this book many, many times.

OP posts:
cjel · 26/04/2013 22:26

You sound so organised, well done. Whats the Lundy Bancroft book about?

wordyBird · 26/04/2013 22:28

ice-cubes down the vest of fear ! Grin

WearingFuckMeSocks · 26/04/2013 22:44

ice-cubes down the vest of fear - sadly I can't take credit for that one, wordyBird, it's a quote from Blackadder (cant remember which one, now, though I suspect Blackadder the Third) but still very funny Grin

And my middle name is organised! I have to be careful not to let it it creep towards OCD though

OP posts:
cjel · 26/04/2013 23:06

thanks garlic I'll look them up Can't get past your name without remembering Brian!

garlicyoni · 26/04/2013 23:09

Grin Ah, Brian. Hull seems so much more interesting now!

WearingFuckMeSocks · 27/04/2013 07:53

Oh dear, the charm offensive has begun. woke up this morning to a long and "heartfelt" email from H.

Anyone fancy playing fuckwit bingo? it's very easy, just shout "fuckwit" when you spot a hackneyed cliche

we misunderstand each other, like at the Eiffel Tower and Sacre Coeur

losing you has made me think

i thought i had apologised for burning your book and punching the wall and was forgiven, honestly. im sorry

lets go away as a family and have some family time together

I'm sorry I forced you into running the business, I just wanted to say "look Mum & Dad, we did it"

lets do Relate, this whole problem is down to a lack of communication

I still love you, and all I have done is to try and make it work

Changed his tune since yesterday hasn't he? And how come, suddenly, (overnight in fact) it has gone from being "all my fault" to "he is wrong and he can change" Hmm

OP posts:
MarianaTrench · 27/04/2013 08:12

I would suggest it's useful to have some admissions of unreasonable behaviour from him in writing.

Fuckwit.

I wouldn't respond either.

TeaMakesItAllPossible · 27/04/2013 08:39

Useful for evidence of unreasonable behaviour?

God, they really do follow a pattern.

Watch out for I'm so unhappy, my life is ruined, I have nothing to live for next.

Hope you have a lovely day out with the DC Smile

JennyMackers · 27/04/2013 09:43

oh god. The weariness of this phase. you'll get through it with your wit and grit but his poor me script may not change that much....

I second not responding. NOTHING sends the message quicker than not responding. The messae being I guess that what he thinks of you is none of your business! His feelings and emotions are his own to manage now.

JennyMackers · 27/04/2013 09:45

It is like fuckwit bingo isn't it! remember about 8 pages back I said to you that my x refered back to an early pre-kids trip to France! ha ha ha! bingo fuckwit

Enjoy your day out with kids.

WearingFuckMeSocks · 27/04/2013 10:20

Jenny, I remembered your words when I read that line and it just made me laugh in a hollow, bitter kind of way

I haven't responded to it. I was going to send a very brief response, along the lines of "this changes nothing. It's over" but won't bother doing that. He'll find out tonight anyway.

Watch out for I'm so unhappy, my life is ruined, I have nothing to live for next - thanks I will, and will try not to shout Fuckwit! when he does Grin

OP posts:
JennyMackers · 27/04/2013 10:39

oh yes, after nostalgia comes anger that you won't just buy into their script.

I don't envy going through this right now as my drama is nearly six years old now, but I envy you that you have this level of self-awareness during it. And mumsnet! I only figured it all out afterwards. I think I discovered mumsnet about a year after I left him. I think you have an advantage that you are seeing things so clearly right as you are going through them. I only gained your clarity 18 months after I left him, so, your recovery and your 'rebirth' Grin will come sooner. The phoenix! I sometimes think of myself like that! a little mini phoenix, but it's like Anno Domini

Funnily enough though, I have 'trained' my x to treat me with respect. He will take the children for four hours later (no more, four exactly! and this from the man who claimed he wanted full custody. He can't manage a weekend. He calls it Saturday. I call it four hours! but still, four hours of free time is what I have now! So, it gets easier. It does become the past. The Past.

bestsonever · 27/04/2013 11:55

"all I've done is try and make it work"

that's the key sum-up of what he'd like you to think. He's still out to lay the blame at your door and he's still playing victim, so not changed has he, not surprising as you can't wave a magic wand and switch a crap personality overnight.
Stick to your guns, his behaviour will be so deeply ingrained it would take years to improve on it, and he's not even started the journey as still in denial.

Fluffymonster · 27/04/2013 12:10

Well done for staying so in control.

Ah yes the offer of a family holiday as the carrot to tempt you back in with. There's usually some holiday/bribery offer isn't there?

And of course, it's a communication problem (yes - his complete lack of ability to do so, in a reasonable and respectful way). Useful deflection too - implying it's a two-way street and if only you understood him better. So it's still all about him - and the underlying message is how you could still adapt as part of the process.

You've already been adapting for years! Idiot. I agree - don't respond - save yourself the time and energy, as he really hasn't evolved enough to grasp that concept.

I'm waiting for the "How can you do this to me/us/the kids?" line. Maybe with a few tears.

Then...maybe sulky silence?

Then anger and back to verbal abuse/threats/blackmail.

Fuckwit bingo!

Jux · 27/04/2013 12:53

Oh yes. Fuckwit! Fuckwit! Fuckwit! Fuckwit! Fuckwit! Fuckwit! and so on.

Ignore. Dignified silence is the strongest weapon, and your best tool.

Well done on not replying.

garlicyoni · 27/04/2013 14:53

Yes, well done, Wearing! Assuming you're the Sacré Coeur to his phallic tower Hmm, serene silence suits you well Wink

wordyBird · 27/04/2013 16:39

Hope you are having a lovely day out with the DC, Wearing :)

Oh yes, FW Bingo is where it's at! It's all so hackneyed, I don't know why they bother - but the same stuff keeps churning out, FW after FW...

WearingFuckMeSocks · 27/04/2013 17:32

Had s smashing day out with kids, lots of fresh air & exercise. Yay!

H back home, has turned into super dad/husband. Has cooked tea and is practically tripping over himself in his eagerness to see to the dc's every whim. It'd be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

Oh, and dear god the lines.

Please give me another chance
I can show you I've changed
I really see now how awful I've been.

No, no and no you really bloody don't!

And then

I'm really worried about your future - (you don't need to be, it's no longer your concern.)

It's been such a rush decision, please just take some time - (I've had 15 years, I think that plenty)

There isn't much money - (oh yes there sodding is)

Do you want my inheritance? Confused

And when nothing worked a crack appeared in the facade

Is this what you did to your ex?

Oh dearie me.

Today I have been mainly using the stock phrases. "I don't love you", "it's over, nothing will change that" and just for bit of variety "that's something to discuss with a solicitor."

I have a bag packed for me & kids and spare key to my mums house if it all goes a bit Tonto

OP posts:
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