Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive Relationships - number 19

[CharlotteCollinsismovingon]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you're dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans - He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change - please don't give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Fi I hear you loud and clear on the children and their safety - I do not leave him alone with them ever. And of course, in his current phase of leaving almost all the parenting to me (except of course when he just starts shouting and swearing - but I don't consider that "parenting"), he's rarely interested in interacting with them, much less being alone with them.

It's been a fairly quiet day today, and it should be the next two days as well, as he's at work. He'll have a few hours at home in the morning, but he'll spend part of it hibernating and will probably want to leave early. He's mentioned putting in some overtime and I'm certainly fine with it.

nickname hello! Lovely to see you, you were one of the main people I remember who was patient and understanding. Thank you so much, hope all is well for you :) hugs

But well said, mink, I think the thread has some useful insights, but it is a hard read because the sheer volume and tone can only add to the pressure. It does not feel like a safe space, at least, it wouldn't to me. There probably comes a point when real life people are needed to bridge the gap between knowing you need to do something and finding the courage to do it. And no-one, but no-one will judge you for leaving.

Anyway, need to go and tackle some housework, great joy. Will be back to catch up on this thread later, apologies for diversion above.

tis

Alicesorry he is being a FW.

Hi all. just a quick post and run. sorry if I missed anything.

and all round.

Having a weird day today. Clearing out and reflecting on what on earth happened these last few years. Nothing ever got done unless I did it, so it felt like I was drowning in things which needed doing. I am now tackling them one by one. I've said it before but it feels like clearing up after a massive storm. Does anyone else who is out wonder what the f*ck happened?

I wrote a post on another thread yesterday which described what happened to my dd. Without the okay or good bits in between. It sounded awful. And at the end, it was awful. And then I wonder how he can justify that, how he can possibly think that was okay.

I guess I do know how it got like this - everytime I wanted to work on it or do something, I was accused of not wanting to spend time with the family, or putting the house before the relationship, and once I had DC2, it was just easier not to fight about it, and I thought, if we all spent time together, then things would be fine. But they weren't.

But it is amazing how much there is to clear. I am picking up where I left off pre-DC2 on sorting/decorating etc, or at least I will be when I get rid of two plus years of clutter, but now there is no-one telling me I am selfish and care more about my house.

For me, it's the freedom to make decisions about what goes in the house. Every time I drop off or collect the dc from his house I see things he bought without even consulting me or giving a second thought to whether I would like them. His house is so full of clutter, despite it apparently all being my mess when I lived there. My house is an oasis of calm with no mess anywhere.

snow, I think it's sometimes worse when you focus on the kids' experiences, it makes your stomach twist. I have said almost exactly that in counselling a few times - How did I end up in this situation? What happened to me? Glad you are getting rid of his clutter, that will probably make you feel much better.

I realised the other day that I now don't even think about it if I want to do an enormous open-mouthed yawn! That's my benchmark. FW would tell me (aggressively) that I was completely ignorant for doing that - if, for example, I yawned in the middle of one of his 'earnest' conversations to me about what was wrong with me, always started last thing at night when I was exhausted. But in the first months after I left, I couldn't yawn without feeling terrible and waiting for someone to tell me off!

Match - yy! My house is (relatively) tidy and clean (ish), there's a bit of kids stuff lying about but that's inevitable. When I went to pick up DS2 from FW's/our old house (back in the days when I was actually allowed over the threshold ), the place would be so untidy. But when i lived there, he'd go on at me and my clutter all the time. Nu-uh. Funny that...

Have spent the day feeling awful, and threw up at lunchtime. Think I've had a bug - my Mum has had it too. Fingers crossed that DS2 doesn't get it (and if he does, he's at his Dad's tomorrow anyway!!!!).

Hope you are feeling better soon pony and that DS2 doesn't catch it.

pony, I hope you feel better too. I have a cold and a fever, so I sympathise. The thing is, on the subject of clutter, that his house was always spotless, when we were there, I always left it spotless. Whereas I was being left with a mess and had to nag about it, and then he made a thing about men who did more housework getting more sex. But it was not the day to day stuff, it was the getting on with bigger projects so that I could have a workspace and dcs could have more play space. It was all just magically somehow going to happen. That is where I just think what was important to me did not matter.

Oh well, I am just feeling down today. It is nice to be getting my space sorted, but it makes it all the more incomprehensible why it did not happen earlier. Plus, FWs two weeks away are nearly over and I have instigated legal proceedings, so I await shit hitting fan, really. It all just seems really pointless, I am so, so tired of trying to work it out.

Urgh. I mean pointless in a how did it get to this kind of way. Thank you to those who responded. Hope everyone is okay. Early night here, I think.

not just the day to day stuff, I mean

Sending hugs, snow. An early night is a good idea, you have a lot on your plate to deal with, and more coming. It's awful when these waves of feeling down come over, it's hard to see the good in anything. Hope you feel a bit brighter tomorrow.

strange stuff in the news! and nervous rumours, strange changes? I spotted a 'hole' in the clouds yesterday, others have felt the need to remove some outer clothes/open windows! The DC are asking whats words like 'sunny' and 'warm' mean???? Some have reported seeing a big yellow disc in the sky!!! What IS happening... so worried, is there a big change coming?

hope all poorly ladies on the mend today

Fi - !!!! Was speaking to someone this morning who is moving to Oz in a month with his family - the average temp in winter over there is 1 degree less than the average temp in a Scottish summer! That's it, I'm off to the antipodes!

Am feeling bit better today, thanks, almost back to normal after sickness but now seem to have a burgeoning chest infection. And it didn't help that I got a bit ratty with FW this morning, just so tired and ugh-feeling that my normal restraint pulled a sicky. Had to text to apologise. Grrrrrrr with myself!

Have you had a good break Leclerc?

snow hope you're okay. The waiting for things to fall apart can be so stressful.

H worked on some DIY this morning before work (this afternoon). It was a minor job that I asked him to take care of a few weeks ago - he's been stalling and avoiding it, even though when I said "don't worry, I'll do it myself" he got all up in arms over it.

So anyway, he's ranting and swearing and talking to himself - sounded really weird. Got louder and louder. I'm in kitchen doing something, children outside playing. I asked him a few times if he'd like some help with it, but he growled no. So left him to it. He kept shouting louder and swearing, then banging, then shouted at me to get in there and help him right now.

Braced myself and said No, not while you're shouting and swearing at me. he shouted at me again, and I refused, saying I was happy to help when he'd calmed down but not when he's like this. His response? "Don't start thinking you can call the shots! If you don't get in here right now, it's not getting done, I'll walk away from it!" I stayed very calm and from the other side of the kitchen said "No. There's a big difference between calling the shots and standing up for myself when your shouting at me. I will not come in there while you're shouting and swearing at me." He kept shouting but walked away from it, and left it. Then did the silent treatment (fine by me!) until he went to work.

he'll come home tonight all cheerful and tired from work, and expect me to forget it ever happened. If I bring it up, he'll go off. If I don't bring it up and am just not "cheerful" with him, then he'll demand to know what's wrong and go off. But I'll be damned if I'm going to be all cheerful with him - it just cements his idea that it's nothing to treat someone like this.

at his 'calling the shots' jibe! Alice ... your exchange all sounds pointless his tantrum I'd ignore it praise the good behaviour! not that it'll change anything, as sadly it does only work on kids (despite the similarities!).

problem now is that I've worked on the shelf a bit - he put the screws in crooked and slightly too far apart, so it's wonky, which is why he couldn't get it right. If I tell him that, he'll go off and say I'm having a go. If I don't tell him that, he'll spend another god knows how long bashing at it tomorrow, then freak out when he finally realises what the problem is - but it won't be his fault - faulty merchandise will be the reasoning.

Alice, I think he's just shown his true colours there with that 'call the shots' comment - to me, it shows that his behaviour re his shouting etc has absolutely nothing to do with being depressed, and everything to do with feeling that he is top dog, he is entitled to treat you however he likes and you have to put up with it, that he is 'calling the shots'. His counselling will do nothing towards helping him stop shouting at you and the kids (unless it's to channel that entitlement into some other kind of manipulative behaviour).

Do whatever you have to this evening in order to make things easy for you. all round.

pony I felt that way as well. It was such an odd phrase to use otherwise.

The big thing holding me back right now is that I know he will give up his job, his counselling, and taking care of his medical condition if we split. I know, I know - not my responsibility, he's an adult. But it affects the children as well if he's ill or give up the counselling. And he's finally back in work and doing well, I don't want to mess with that if I can avoid it. I don't want to submarine him, I just want to be happy and the children to be happy and safe.

keep extricating yourself and ignoring it as much as humanly possible

will he know that you've 'dabbled' with the shelf a bit? if not.. back to plan a.

All the rest.. time for a longer term plan? but you still won't be able to 'manage' him really, as it turns into actually just him controlling you really, for fear of him withdrawing everything, which is complete blackmail, especially as the counselling won't be a success not from someone who 'calls all the shots'

I do hope you get to have a peaceful eve with a couple of x

I have a bottle of wine and H is working late, so yes, peaceful evening.

He'll know I messed with the shelf, but he had said he wasn't going to finish it that it was up to me so I can't see where he's got any reason to complain. Doesn't mean he WON'T, mind you, just means he has no reason to.