Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships....can it be 18?

999 replies

foolonthehill · 08/03/2013 22:19

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

OP posts:
arthriticfingers · 16/03/2013 19:22

Match:( CSA?
FWs all live in laa laa looney land where they believe their demented ravings carry weight

TisILeclerc · 16/03/2013 19:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

trustissues75 · 16/03/2013 19:46

h, my day just gets better...just had these e-mails from ExFWH (he recently lost in his frivolous court case he brought against me in the States because the states had no jurisdiction to decide child custody and he was petitioning for full custody based on allegations of me kidnapping DS)

I am looking to come spend some time with DS this June or early July. When will he be available for a visit? I have spoken with the British courts and CSA regarding fathers rights and with your written permission, no further paperwork is necessary.

Sent from my iPad

I replied for him to contact my solicitor - which is what I have been instructed to do if he askes me for unsupervised access in the UK - and this is the reply I got...

For someone who claims they are "not preventing me from seeing my son" you're going through a lot of trouble to make it to where DS won't see me but for an hourly court room visit. Also with regard to the CSA and a child maintenance, $0.00 is due because of my unemployment. I will however begin sending money as it becomes available in the form of a US check.

I haven't mentioned a word to him about CSA since they can't deal with overseas claims anyway.....love that even though his income is zero he still has an Ipad...and an iPhone...and a boat...and a half million dollar house that he just purchased with the OW he ran off with.....and he hasn't been to visit DS once since he left us in homeless and penniless in the UK in January 2011....I gave him opportunity after opportunity to come be he refused unless it was unsupervised access to take him away for a week within the British Isles...yeah, ok....why not?!

I replied with this....

How do you know it will just be an hourly courtroom visit. CSA do not deal with overseas child support claims so I have no idea why you are involving them. Again it seems you are misinformed regarding the complexities of international child custody and visitation matters - I have been fully versed. I'd live for DS to see you...Id love for it to have been different but your actions have consistently indicated that you are not a trustworthy individual who cares about our son's best interests. I have been advised again and again that all matters regarding visitation are to be handled by experienced law professionals. I really couldn't care less about your employment status...you chose to quit your job. I can only speculate how you are affording your lifestyle. Now please take your bullying tactics elsewhere: I am pregnant and do mot need the stress. My solicitor is willing to assist you

Oy-vey....my uterus is not liking this stress!!!!!

arthriticfingers · 16/03/2013 20:00

Trust You might want to get your post deleted as you mention your son's real name.

arthriticfingers · 16/03/2013 20:00

And then repost it

Dillie · 16/03/2013 20:06

Hi ladies, hope your OK.

Had a tough couple of days, so forgive me for a self indulgent rant!!

He refuses to pay maintenance when I move out. I told him the CSA have ways to make you pay maintenance by going through your work. He then said well that would be tough if I didn't have a job, and yes it would be to get back at you!

He has threatened this before so he couldn't/wouldn't help support dd.

He then said and I quote 'oh just to answer your question, I already have someone else in the pipeline' Hmm

I said well I feel sorry for the ow, knowing she was a rebound gf. He then said I don't care, only doing it to get back at you! I feel for this alleged ow!

This morning he had a go at me for not making him a cup of tea. Then ranted as he went into the kitchen that I was full of crap -words to that effect-

Spent the most of the day out. This morning doing my volunteer work and this afternoon with dd around my best friends house and her family.

Did me wonders, so feeling strong again.

TheSilveryPussycat · 16/03/2013 20:08

Trust it is understandable that you have sent that email. But really all it should have said is, "As I requested in my last email, please contact my solicitor regarding these matters."

Sending strength x

arthriticfingers · 16/03/2013 20:34

Trust What Silvery said. for every future email.

TisILeclerc · 16/03/2013 20:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheSilveryPussycat · 16/03/2013 20:43

Dillie well done you have engaged while remaining detached, by the sound of it, and lo and behold, FW has explained himself to you in words of one syllable! More power to you Brew

Tea and the making thereof is a very important metaphor in a relationship. Never underestimate it :)

ponygirlcurtis · 16/03/2013 20:47

Let me just start with saying Charlotte - it's not you!!!! It's his dodgy boundary, not yours. He should have shown you some respect by not promising you out like he was loaning out his lawnmower or something.

trust - I can see why you are getting upset by his behaviour. He does sem to be saying things that would normally get the reg flags a-twitching. How he's being with DS is a big one. But only you know how things normally are, if this is an exception rather than a rule, if he's stressed (and will take take a telling about not taking it out on his family). Keep posting, if you are in any doubt, it sometimes helps to just rant about it.

Leclerc - I have taken your advice onboard. Tis v sensible. hic. Wine Magically, I feel better!!!!! I am jealous of your dancing/night out opportunities. I miss it. I want to go out with friends and have a laugh, and maybe even snog someone entirely unsuitable. Grin

Matchsticks - yep, a call to CSa to get their help working out what you should be receiving from him. They told me that it's better to work it out between you as they are going to start charging to use them as a go-between (in a couple of years), but you can still use them to work out what you should be getting.

Dillie - they all threaten that, about quitting their jobs to avoid maintenance. Shows the type of people they are. But glad his FWittery is helping you stay strong!

arthriticfingers · 16/03/2013 20:56

Pony What you said about CSA made me go and look online - where I found this article:
www.guardian.co.uk/money/2012/oct/20/threat-child-maintenance
I had the idea the idea behind CSA was that the government (any government) thought it was easy to deal with FWs.
Seems like even the authorities want nothing to do with them :(

minkembra · 16/03/2013 21:13

trust it all sounds very stressful for you. the one thing i noted you dude not mention was whether when he apologies he blames you or says yes i Will change if you change too. keep an eye out for that. if it happens i would really worry.

No one is perfect. if get recognises mistakes and tries then see how it goes. if he is blaming you then that is no good.

minkembra · 16/03/2013 21:27

I am still wondering about CSA. for various reasons to suit ex, his ex wife and her kids i agreed not go until end of May. even though i did not have to and even though he still keeps going on bout how unreasonable i am being. (when i am currently accepting a third less than i am entitled too)

But am a bit worried if i leave it too long i Will get charged to use them. he will pay by direct pay but i really cannot seem to get a clear idea if what the craic is.

snowshapes · 16/03/2013 21:28

Hi everyone,
Just reading through.

trust, I read your post about your DP's attitude to your DS with a sinking heart. One of the major reasons I left FW in the end was his attitude to DD, not his biological child. Some things stand out at me from what you have said:

  • blaming a child's behaviour for their unreasonable behaviour - as you say, who is the adult
  • that you feel you have to police your child's behaviour to prevent your partner getting annoyed (now it may be something you would like to improve anyway, but you note that you try to get him to eat with his mouth closed so that your DP approves, not because it is more socially acceptable (with DD, it was not eating with her elbow on the table, FW started to actually push it off, rather than ask her to not do it, have to confess it was not a biggie for me, as she didn't do it in a slovenly way, just sometimes when she was not paying attention, so if I told him not to push her arm, I was undermining him and stabbing him in the back etc etc etc)
  • it was always me who was apparently stressed and anxious the whole time, and that was why FW reacted the way he did (wonder why I was stressed and anxious?)
  • not caring what DD was watching or doing, if he wanted to do something else, his needs came first - though this was also true with me, he just achieved it in a different manner (criticising my choice, talking through it etc)

He also used to wind her up, even though I asked him not to, to the stage where she would storm off or say 'FW's name' is annoying me' and then he would say, well, you annoy me too. It did get to the stage that whenever we had words, somehow it was DD's fault, he started to criticise what I bought her, the time I spent tidying her room, there was an absolute standoff on Christmas Day which I won't go into, but I cannot forgive him for, as that was my Christmas day with her, and then he pushed her over in an altercation (which was apparently her fault too, and for me, the final straw).

The thing is, it didn't start out like that all the time, mostly, he seemed quite caring, obviously, but there were a few moments, I look back now, and I think, okay, that was not right. And actually, at least one of them, I nearly did walk, but he blamed back pain so I thought, okay, and gave him the benefit of the doubt. Actually, there was another time, he laid into DD for not vacating the bathroom quick enough, and I told him to leave. DC2 was five days old at that point, he walked out the door and I was a sobbing mess, thinking what have I done, so he came back. I know I did the right thing, as I did everything I could to try to make the relationship work, including calling him on his behaviour to her, but if there is one thing I feel really, really sorry for, it is that I let him treat my precious girl badly.

I am not trying to say, leave your DP or anything like that, quite possibly I am projecting too much from my own experience and I don't want to make you feel worse in any way at all - but do keep an eye on his behaviour, trust your instincts, you are both under stress, and people don't always behave well under stress, but as you know and you say, your DS is stuck in the middle of a situation he did not create and he is not the adult here. All good wishes.

TheSilveryPussycat · 16/03/2013 21:29

Thanks, MN HQ Brew Wink

snowshapes · 16/03/2013 21:30

Ooops, sorry for the essay, clearly all coming out there. Yes mink is right, FW was a blamer, so yes, keep an eye for that. I hope he is prepared to work on things, though, and take your points on board.

minkembra · 16/03/2013 21:32

Oh and bingo on the threatening to quit job. and do you know what if he did i would have noooo pity. as if he would lose his pension. he lives for his pension.

Am a bit worried if he moves in with someone else with kids. ( about CSA.) Will be well.peeved if me agreeing to wait despite him being horrid about it results in my getting shot in foot. i.only did it suit dscs.

and re. do any new take their family that seriously/ selflessly. yes. a few. some of my friends have genuinely lovely husbands.

TheSilveryPussycat · 16/03/2013 21:33

snowshapes that essay was well worth it - you have described the 'boiling the frog slowly' strategy, and that's a v useful reminder to us all.

TisILeclerc · 16/03/2013 21:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

snowshapes · 16/03/2013 21:59

Thanks, silver, for your kind words as I feel utterly drained and sad for DD after writing it. It got worse as she got older, and expressed herself. She was 3.5 when I met FW.

There is so much on this thread which resonates. A bit more detached when I saw him today. But he can still manage the Fwittery. Too tired to go into it.

Yes, it was like boiling a frog. I could see it with DD but I still struggle to call it abuse the way he treated me.

Love and strength to all. Sorry for not being able to contribute more.

NoraLuca · 16/03/2013 22:00

Evening all! (anyone who remembers me, that is!) I do miss having the internet at home. Well I'm on the computer all day at work but don't dare post on MN in case Scary Boss finds out and anyway, I don't have time.

I have read through the thread and wish I could offer words of advice like the other posters but I don't know what to say. I feel like I ran away from H (metaphorically speaking, in fact I see him every day) but not sure it was the right thing to do after all.

It's been 6 weeks and the DDs still won't stay overnight on their own with H, even though they are happy to spend the day with him. DD1 says that she "won't know what to do if he gets cross and you aren't there to stop him" and so I stay over with them. H insists on 50/50 shared care, and I will do anything to avoid an argument about access because he is from another country and if he takes the DDs there, there is nothing to guarantee that he will bring them back.

This is going to sound awful selfish, but I wish I could leave them with him just so I could have a night on my own. I haven't cried about leaving H, or about all the things he said to me over the years and years, or even about the time he smashed my laptop... I thought I'd break down when I finally left, but I haven't. Then a few weeks ago I found out my Mum has cancer, she is pretty upbeat but it's still a frightening disease.

Am in a silly happy mood which feels totally wrong.

BreatheandFlyAway · 16/03/2013 22:01

Hello lovely ones.

Just nipping in to say a quick hi. Have read through and will write more later but just sending hugs and support for now as am sitting with dm and dd and dcat and chatting.

NoraLuca · 16/03/2013 22:01

oh gosh that totally was a me me me post. One day, I will have words of wisdom and support to offer.