Support thread for those in Emotionally abusive relationships :15

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

That's a good enough reason nini (FW aside) - at least I hope so, cos it's one of my reasons too. Even though FW is now well out of my picture.

It is very hard to study at the same time as living with a FW - when I tried it we had 2 computers in the study, he was always on the other one playing a strategy game, and my concentration would be interrupted by his game 'Not enough bricks my lord' it would report...

I know, Silver. It's just very depressing when you see people come and go, the thread number gets higher, and you think "What actually has changed for me?"

Lol at 'not enough bricks my lord' . NSDH just doesn't ever think that maybe I need time to myself to study because I should be doing all the childcare. He'll want to go to bed early, which means I'll have to move all my study books downstairs. And he'll say in a patronising way "Don't stay up late and push too hard". I wouldn't have to push myself so hard you fucking wanker if I got time to study during the day!!!!

And he's decided that DD's books are 'too babyish' and was trying to make her read a much older book at bedtime tonight. She got upset. I had to remind him that she isn't even two yet and can read whatever book she wants to you controlling arsewipe.

Charlotte, I had the 'if you go to sleep while I'm talking to you late into the night, you are very ignorant and you've made me angry' reaction too. I can remember conversations where I knew my eyes were rolling back into my head and I was desperately trying to say awake so he didn't lose it again. When I find that bloody script, why, I'll, I'll...er rip it up.

twelve, it's the batting between 'jekyll' and 'hyde' that is so unsettling and absolutely exhausting. You never relax properly because you're always waiting, waiting.

Nini, hope you get some studying over the weekend. Am at you having to negotiate this - as your husband, he should be doing all he can to facilitate you achieving the things you want to, not deliberately making it more difficult.

No dramas today from FW, all v civilised and quick. He brought up fecking tons of stuff this morning. Took me about 10 trips up to my second-floor flat to get it all in. Pechs and regrets wishing she could do some exercise Had another sad/enjoyable afternoon sorting through it. Then this evening at the handover, I noticed he wasn't wearing his wedding ring any more. I had been thinking about taking mine off, not sure what to do, but seeing his off was a bit of a jolt. And I realised he was dropping DS2 off at 5.30pm, he could have easily taken him home and had another hour of time with him. And I also noticed he'd changed from this morning, had a smart shirt on and reeked of aftershave. Do you know, I now think all the agro I go from him earlier in the week about not being 'available' to pick up DS2 earlier than normal was nothing to do with getting the girls home on time. I think it was all to do with the fact that he has somewhere to go, and wanted shot of him before 6.30pm. Again, bit of a jolt thinking of him 'out on the pull'.

:( Leclerc

Yes, don't overthink this.

Am impressed at you building Ikea... but not !!

FW here always apologises for the most ridiculous things. Think I may have said before that he said to my dps once, "Sorry I've ironed all the things you asked me to wash after they got wet in the storm yesterday." Er, they weren't burnt by the iron, so I think what you really meant was, "Look at me, aren't I wonderful?"

If he's anything like this one, he's probably trying to come across as considerate and hasn't the first idea how to do it convincingly!

Leclerc on its own, that text seems OK. Like he doesn't want to disturb you, maybe.

Nini good luck with the studying. Not easy fitting in the study if you're not a full time student, but so worth it.

H is relatively OK tonight, except for saying that if I "let" the DC get up before 9 tomorrow morning I'll regret it. They always wake up around 7.30 - 8ish at weekends, so we will sit in one of the DCs rooms and read quietly. He may still kick off, I don't know. I tried to say that I can't prevent the DC from waking up - they need to go to the loo, for one thing - but he told me to shut up *** and that was that. We have had this discussion many times before.

I know that my sense of perspective is skewed. I don't get upset anymore, unless he goes really OTT.

Leclerc don't mean to dismiss your concerns about the text. On its own it does seem ok, but I don't know the full background story.

Argh, Leclerc, a text like that would piss me off. Charlotte has this behaviour sussed. My NSDH is the KING of this. By acting all meek and 'I don't want to disturb you' he's playing the part of the innocent downtrodden man trying to do well but swatted down by an overbearing woman. Which of course we all know you absolutely are NOT. My NSDH learnt this technique from his Dad, who plays this part to this day - result is that NSDH hates his 'overbearing' mother who he hasn't seen for 14 years despite her trying as of course meek little wouldn't-hurt-a-fly Dad is perfect.

I deal with this type of behaviour by rolling my eyes and screaming into my pillow when alone. It's all mind games.

Pony I felt so for you when you spoke about your ds. I really hope he and you feel much better soon xxx I don?t know if it?s helpful, but my lovely and big-hearted DS has also said things like this at times, eg ?I?m not worth anything, I don?t deserve to be loved? etc ? he went through a particular phase of it a few months ago, I was so worried. He?s stopped now but I guess all we can do is a) get away from fws (which you?ve done, yay! And hopefully I?m about too [scared and very small yay]) and b) be the loving, kind mums we know we are. You?re so great and empathetic, he will definitely benefit hugely from having you as a mum and from you giving him the tools to deal with that kind of feeling Re your fw reeking of aftershave and all the other symptoms ? don?t put it past him to have done all that specifically to jolt you ? to show you what you?re missing I understand how upset you feel (I would too FWIW) but really, whether it?s true or made up moving on on his part, you?re the winner, hands down ? you?re lovely, normal-minded - and you have the kids. He?s effed up, controlling and doomed to fail in all relationships due to his fwittery.

Teapot - I googled NPD and my God my fw ticked every box with a loud clash of cymbals ? thank you for this info! (Not that I want to effing cure him, obvs!). But it does explain stuff a lot.

Nora at cake-gate ? bloody hell, that?s appalling . And your fw?s command re 9am start and no earlier when of course dcs wake when they decide to and of course you can?t control that or stop them going to the loo that?s so bloody awful my love. I agree with what you say about how we lose the perspective, me too, big time, but from an outside POV you sound like a hostage and what?s great about this thread is that we all work to rescue each other from our hostage situations

FW BB - pony I laughed so much at your description of its outcome ? all dead by morning Meanwhile we?ll be having shoulder and head massages, soft music and lighting, glasses of fine , cups of , wafting and being really loving and understanding of each other plus POSL with lots of jokes over in the Commune of Loveliness! Oh and cats, dogs and [choc]! Leclerc is ToD packed and ready for his surprise FWBB entry? Or will he be sitting there like a furry Poirot all along?

Nini I love everyone on this thread too and what?s so great is that we?re all at different stages and we all understand how bloody difficult it is, none of this RL crap of LTB that we?d get if and when we confide in RL. It?s so massively complex, serious and bloody difficult. I am in awe of you managing to study at all; good luck with your exam, we?re all rooting for you massively

Charlotte I second that we?re stuck to you like glue my love (in a non-sinister way )

Silver not enough bricks my lord SO funny and so fwittish.

News from here ? I am feeling terrified and keep forgetting what?s happening while I?m working or whatever, then remember and have a moment of ?waah, I can?t leave my home, this can?t be happening, it?s not real, I can?t cope!? So please keep giving me gentle kicks on the arse and reminding me why this is the right thing to do!

Tea I meant PPD sorry!

leclerc has he been browsing magazines with airbrushed, stick thin teddies again ?

Well, if it helps, leclerc, tell him Rupert has always seemed a little dull TBH, with all his earnest rushing about, whereas Pooh and Paddington seem like natural sort of no-nonsense teddies with proper beary-curves

Sorry I've been absent for a while, it's tough keeping up with a two-month-old baby in the house. I'm doing better here, once I recognised that I was being emotionally abusive it was remarkably easy to stop. I think I had falled into bad habits, I suspect influenced by DH, and just didn't realise what I was doing.

It's not going so well on DH's side though. I've been trying to stand up to him a bit more but it's not working too well and the older children are taking the brunt of it since the baby was born. I'm on the cusp of trying to chuck him out but I suspect he won't go and I don't have an exit plan so I don't really want to move to the next step unless I think they're in physical danger which seems pretty remote apart from a smacked bum perhaps as it's mostly name calling and threats to take away their toys. I knew his mum was emotionally abused by his dad but from other things that have come up recently I suspect it went both ways. I didn't realised how damaged DH was by his childhood. I think he really needs counselling but there's no way that's going to happen.

Anyway sorry for the me me me post. I'll catch up on the whole thread and see what's been happening with you all.

WoIsMe - I think the trouble with counselling is that they don't take anything on board. H has had it once and deemed himself "fine" and then quit, well before it did any huge amount of good. I suspect he didn't want to know if his behaviour was unreasonable so quit before it became apparent that it was.

I find it frustrating when I tell him his behaviour is OTT and he acts either surprised (as if I'm overreacting) or angry (like I'm being overly critical) and then acts defensive and puts it all back on me. I know it's a common thing to do, much like the "you make me angry, it's your fault" thing, which I also get from him sometimes. But it still shocks me that he can't see that the way he is behaving is so wrong. He sees it (and criticises it) in OTHER people, but not himself. Double standards, I suppose.

H gets annoyed at the children getting up early as well but they are early risers and always have been. He can't wait to get them to bed at night, so they're not "cutting into the evening" but hates it when they are up early (which they always are). Some days it just seems like he doesn't like them, although he swears it isn't true.

Jeez, Leclerc congratulate yourself again on getting rid - and may he never darken your doorstep again.
FWIW, I think the text was sneaky snide - but then I have had it up to the back teeth with FWs find objectivity with regard to FWs difficult.

i feel very unsettled and shaky this morning after dh picked dd up. nothing really awful happened. its just the way he makes me feel and the way he looks at me. i have asked him repeatedly can he email or text me about matters and not bring them up at the door. well he started going on about some tax form he needs, and i said nicely, would there be any chance you could text or email me about this as i find it hard to remembter these things and its good to have them written down. he gets all annoyed and goes 'its just a simple request' and i said well im just asking you a simple request too, that can you just text me these things and not bring anything up at handover. so he gets annoyed and leaves.

yesterday i sent him an email saying that dds routine had changed and she needed to be home earlier as she'd been going to bed after ten and it wasn't suitable for a 16 month old, so i said i was aiming for 8 o clock bedtime and could he bring her home at 7.30, 7.45. he didnt' mention this at all and walked away. i said 'did you get my email?' he said YEAH (as if, why are you asking me?) and i said, well it would be helpful if you would reply to let me know you have got it. he just rolled his eyes at me and walked off. never said when he was bringing her home or if he agreed or anything.

im just really upset and i don't know why. i do everything in my power to be reasonable, to sort things out in a reasonable manner, and whatever i do, he makes me feel the unreasonable one, i am the one ends up feeling rubbish and upset. is there something seriously wrong with me? i have always been an oversensitive person and of course this is what he would say is wrong with me. now he is ringing me on the phone flipping heck. im not answering.

oh i was trying to catch up on this thread from my phone last night (can't post from my phone) and someone was saying about they are still with their FW and feel like what has changed, but at least they are still on this thread. sorry i can't remember who, but i just wanted to say things ARE changing. even if you are still with the FW, YOU are changing. you are learning more and more that its not your fault, you are learning not to take it anymore, you are gaining knowledge and support which will give you power and control over your own life.