Support thread for those in Emotionally abusive relationships :15

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

hi, everyone hope i can join in again. posted earlier on in thread. hope no-one minds if i cant address individual people separately but my mind is so messed up at the moment and just want to let it all out somewhere.

FW has gone off somewhere for weekend thank god dont know where but the relief is unbelievable. me and dc's are so relaxed and that horrible tension isnt there of when he comes in that omg have i tidied everything, what will set him off today etc etc. and its so nice not to hear the constant criticism, "you're fat, ugly etc" why is this here, why is dd crying etc etc and the low level just downright nastiness. everything is such a struggle when he is here and weekends are horrendous. he sleeps separate as he knows that hurts me, will be really cold, not say hello in the am etc etc throw plates, amsure u all know how it is.

anyway am ashamed to say this but in spite of all that why do i miss him? feel pathetic saying it but he does help with kids but even that is tinged with i am better with them than u, they always cry with u etc etc. i dared to say they side with him as they dont want to be on his bad side and he sneered and said oh did mn tell u that?

dont feel like i could cope as a single parent and feel so depressed. i did speak to WA and SS but now dont feel like i can do anything else. my parents have just found out and my dad is angry but he still seems to think it can be all sorted out. separating is just not done but no-one realises that he wont change and my life will just get shitter. its so hard to wade through each day and feel so alone and lost with it all.

anyway dont mean to ramble on but i wanted to let some of it out. sorry cant help others atm but kind of helps to know am not alone unfortunately.

i do sometimes dream of a little flat with dc's somewhere where i could choose the bedding myself. its stupid little things isnt it that u wish u could do. and not having to tidy kids mess maybe one day leave it and nothing would happen.

so tired of this

Hi yummy you have enough on your plate without helping others, although actually just having a ramble about stuff can help others as they are bound to compare. (I say 'they', only because I am now free.)

We all know about missing our FW's btw, it is actually perfectly natural. For now, just enjoy your time without him. You say he just went off??

You know what, yummy? You would be a fantastic single parent. Haven't you just had a lovely day doing just that? This feeling - relaxed, happiness - would be much more frequent in your house without his dark clouds there.

Dip in and out of the thread as much as you need to, lovely, without feeling you need to explain or apologise. It's another thing that we all do when things are bad. I saw your nn and thought, "Oh, nice to hear from her again," - then of course read what you had to say and felt so sorry that you're struggling. But my point is, you're amongst friends here. xx

yummy you would be infinitely better off as a single person. Honestly, it is so much easier than living under constant stress and feeling like everything you do is being monitored. You would be as relaxed as you were today.
It is a big leap and I won't say it isn't scary, but it is so worth it.

Hi yummy what the others said! Welcome back, so good to "see" you and so things are so difficult.

Oh I understand leClerc - you'll notice I put 'eventually'...

hi everybody... not had chance to read the whole thread since I posted last.

yummy I'm sure it's normal to miss FW when he first goes, doesn't mean you have to stay with him forever. After all, we must all have loved these guys at some point or we wouldn't have had children and marriages and lives together! And in a lot of cases we wouldn't even be wanting to split up, if only they weren't such arses.

H has been ok over the past week. He knows that I have applied for a house (still waiting on an answer ) No shouting, minimal swearing. Though of course I haven't done anything that he wouldn't like.

I am worried that he is playing games with DD2, though. He has always been closer to DD1 than DD2 - that dates back to when H took care of toddler DD1 when DD2 was a baby. He does things like buy random presents for DD1, but never for DD2. Never expensive things, but they are both under 7 so don't care about the value of things. He always does stuff - stories, craft projects, lego - with DD1, and sends DD2 away to me. It reminds me of how he was with me a few years ago. I could not pinpoint what he'd done that was so bad, and there was nothing really serious - but it made me feel sad. I worry that he is in the process of doing the same to DD2. I may just be being paranoid.

thanku to all u lovely ladies for the 'welcome' it does help so much to have an outlet and feel that i am not mad or crazy or provoking him or deserved it or whatever else. apparantly i 'bring out the worst in him' he really is such a wanker the more i detach and reflect on it.

he went off as apparantly he 'needed space' doesnt matter how i pleaded with him for space after the last incident, its all about them isnt it. i think he is either at a friends or at his mums. i think he will be back 2moro eve as he had an appt on monday but in true FW style is not giving me the luxury of knowing his plans as he knows that stresses me.

have been reading the lundy bancroft book, its depressing though as u start to realise how badly they treat u over such a long time and it becomes normal. cant see a way out atm but am trying to force myself. its so hard does everyone else have it all constantly in their head even when he is not there? its like i cant 100% relax as feel he is still watching me and am dreading his return already. feels like pressure in my head and i will explode with it, find it hard to sleep as thoughts just occupy my head. also feel v alone as few friends in rl dont really 'get' it as they are lucky enough to have normal partners so cant relate and just think its normal fights etc.

aaargh this place is such a lifeline and is really helping me and i hope others to see no human should have to suffer like this from someone who is supposed to love them. do others feel like they dont really see u as a valid person more like a thing they can abuse and do whatever they want to. have felt like a dog at times as one of his favourites is pushing me to floor and kicking me in the side.

That is awful, yummy. Glad you have a small bit of space from him. Even before I knew about EA, I realised that I could never have survived this long married to FW if it weren't for the frequent trips away he has had to do.

fool, and anyone else for that matter, I just came across this site - Abuse can be subtle and deadly - and wondered if it was something that would be useful in the thread opener? A few people have said recently, "I think there's something wrong, but I can't see what it is." FW is all over this page, whereas he seems to be an afterthought on some of the others, because he usually restricts himself to the more deniable, head-spinning elements of EA.

yummy - yes, I know I get that way. When he's not in the room (or elsewhere although that's not happened in awhile), I stress over when he will come back in and whether he's going to kick off over something. When he's sleeping, I stress over when he'll wake up and how he'll behave. When he's in the room, I stress over whether he'll kick off at us (me and children).

We've had a fairly quiet day as H spent a majority of it in bed. Always get that feeling of doubt when he's being pleasant, then he snaps at us and it flits away for a bit again.

twelve, you're not saying being absent from family life equates to being pleasant, I hope? "Absence of hostilities" is not the same thing, though I have often equated it with being pleasant in my mind.

bertie just wanted to pick up on your DS reaction to you/FW. The series of his reactions lead me to worry, just because he said one thing immediately before reacting completely the opposite. My DC really hold it all together on visits and very careful to be smiley and 'up' for fear of some sort of reprisals if not - get home, meltdown; shouty, resistent, (I think shot to pieces with all the effort). I have asked [FW] before 'what did you all get up to today, because theres upset here' answer, 'just hanging out at home and obviously DC didn't want to come home and scared of you and thats why' but I have since heard /seen evidence to contrary that DC actually do put a lot of effort into not upsetting, even when have been deeply upset by awful carry-ons and terrible disappointments, any expression of that evokes anger, or put downs - from 'stop being stupid' to full on rage at them for not performing happy enough, convinced of bad mood and angry with for that. Plus there's the usual adjustment of being with each parent, which takes a lot of working through because of the conflict between each which is evident just from seeing faces & postures which they read very quickly. DS saying only to you.. 'too rough'

Sorry to hear Leclerc it is so very wearing, wearying. I haven't said anything about ex relationship, other than the obvious stuff witnessed experienced together (if that comes up) or DC relayed to me after split, and then deal with current stuff. I keep my thoughts about him totally to myself for DC sake. I figure DC have enough to sort thro and decide about it. Its a bit like saying we can moan about our kids to friends, but its not the same if our friends were to moan to us about our kids I think thats how DC feel conflicted when either parent is talked about by the other, and it sadly causes feelings of isolation in the child I observed extreme reactions when this was happening a lot (I was being openly slagged off) the fallout at home was obvious to me (although DC SAID NOTHING of what causing it). but every visit there was deliberate argument picking and total rejection towards me, very angry at me, disagreeing with everything said. I contrived a conversation with a good friend in front of DC, which I thought might be the issue, DC stepped straight forward and said, crying, 'thats happening to me and its making me really depressed' this is why I think books and chats that don't require direct talk to them are such good tools to help them sort their stuff out in their own heads and come to us for answers. I found it a real difficult path to pick through dealing with such anger and confusion from DC when trying to unravel everythin fo ryourself too; I keep saying to myself... but its all moving on and better that it comes up, and awful /worse for it all to be quiet and kept in (as it is with FW!). Hard not to just feel like a punch-bag at times tho

sorry for that long one! that sounds like a rant (masquerading as support!) but it wasn't intended to be.

despite all the difficulties, and they do feel insurmountable at times, they're far preferable personally to the ones living with a FW! The difficulties that I faced since separation have been awful, but life has changed loads and keeps changing and moving on, whereas with him, it just stayed the same awful and living at heightened anxiety on eggshells, etc. I think at times I have taken the peace of being away from that for granted (which felt like a massive luxury at the start!) take care all xx

Yummy so so sorry, really thought I'd replied to the last PM last week but just seen I didn't so sorry, hope you are ok, glad you came back on the thread. Fw here watching me, thinking I'm having an "affair" on my phone so will respond properly asap when I'm not being monitored so sorry again xx

For all with small dc I can recommend The Huge Bag of Worries by Virginia Ironside. It's a picture book that deals with a little girl's worries that are weighing down on her. It has really encouraged dd to open up and tell me when something is bothering her.

nail on head Charlotte re absence of hostilities = pleasant - does say an awful lot about the situation.

It is very hard, impossible, to remember pain, but want to hold onto the good (our hopes of love, affection, warmth we believe exist in the relationship), arguing with oneself, its not always bad, its not been bad today, but sinking to those depths is what made the whole thing bad and unacceptable, and crossed a line that should never have been crossed Yummy

our hope is, they will never cross it again....

I hope, thatyou can relax and have peace while he's away. but in reality like twelve said, its hard to ever have peace whilst they're still in your home.

oh dear. (actually I have much stronger language running through my head, but I'll refrain) H got up with children, let me lie in (interesting as I'd already been up with 1 DC an hour prior anyway). Within an hour, shouting (including shouting at them to be quiet or they'll wake mummy - which he'd already done by shouting at them). That settles it for me. Cannot allow him even an hour for a lie in.

The fact that the kitchen looks like a bomb site is not helping, but irrelevant.

Now that I'm up, he's declared that he's ill and needs to lie down and sleep for awhile. I suspect this is gearing up to avoid going back to work this week, so he'll be home for another week or two. Please PLEASE let the GP tell him to go back to work. sob

Even for EA at the children Leclerc as so many consider it "discipline."

H shouts at the children (often calling them names and sometimes using dreadful language or phrases) and then when I insist he stop, he always rants into "fine! so you WANT them to be animals! I'm not allowed to discipline them! My opinion doesn't count! YOU deal with them then!"

It's NOT bloody discipline to treat them like that. My father was very much a shouter, and called us names (stupid, etc) and I hated him for it sometimes. I really struggled when he died a year and a half ago, such conflicting emotions. He also spanked us with the belt (and my mum spanked us with things like slipper, wooden spoon, etc). Back then it was more accepted as "discipline". Not now, and I remember how awful it felt when my dad shouted at us, calling us stupid, then expected us to be pleasant and sociable immediately afterwards (or else another bout of shouting). I've explained this to H, how much I hated my dad for this, because I didn't want him to have this type of relationship with the children, but obviously it fell on deaf ears. Perhaps we really do marry our fathers.

leclerc he's not supposed to go back to GP, but I can see this coming. He'll say he needs to call tomorrow first thing and make another appointment as he's obviously not well enough to go back in his opinion. If he gets another GP note for the next week, there go all my plans right out the window, as I'll never get to a solicitor or the other GP when he's home.