Would I be unreasonable to stop supporting DH financially

[needsomeperspective]

I work full time. Have 2 children aged 1 and 2. We have a nanny who also does washing ironing and a lot of cleaning. My DH works part time.

When we got married my DH left his job so he could move to the country I was living in. He has only ever worked sporadically since. This has been going on for over 3 years.

I work in a very demanding job where I am very stressed and stretched.

He is a part time tradesman. He appears in my view to make very little effort to follow up or generate work, shows little drive or ambition has to be prodded to return client phone calls and is just generally very unmotivated and unreliable. He is a clown with the kids who love him but I'm starting to hold in in contempt and feel very resentful that he isn't contributing more, making more effort to find work and basically thinking he is a lazy cock lodging bastard.

I pay his mortgage (which isn't fully covered by the income from his genants) credit card payments, loan repayments from before he met me and am getting fucking sick of it.

He gives me most of his wages when he get them to go towards bills but its a drop in the ocean. He isn't profligate and doesn't go out much so I can't say he is throwing money around but he significantly adds to our cost of living. Things like occasional golf games, dinners out, nothing unreasonable.

I am just getting sick of it. When he was a say at home dad I could cope with it. But now we have a nanny I'm not entirely sure what I am actually getting out of this relationship.

He does clean and do DIY and he drives me to work an back every day as we only have one car but honestly I often think I would be better off f he just fucked off because I wouldn't be having to pay for all his stuff every month. If he was a really hard worker I would be more patient but he lets clients down and let's jobs go because he is just lazy and disorganized.

Would it be unreasonable for me to say "right, from January you will have to be responsible for your own mortgage, credit card and loan payments. So I'd get looking for work if I were you!"

I had a lovely childhood Offred. Very kind supportive parents who are still together. Stable, nurturing. Great school life. Got good grades. No idea why I might make bad decisions. I was brought up very strongly to stick to my commitments, live with my choices and not let others down though. But I don't think that is a bad thing.

Yes Middle East. Not much support for women round here!

I think you need to post a disclaimer on future threads then saying 'purely venting, not looking for advice or suggestions about leaving'...

You did say in your OP, written only this morning, that 'now we have a nanny I'm not entirely sure what I am actually getting out of this relationship'. So your latest post is quite a turnaround. I did ask if you were in counselling yourself to process all this: are you?

You also asked us a question in the OP which was:
Would it be unreasonable for me to say "right, from January you will have to be responsible for your own mortgage, credit card and loan payments. So I'd get looking for work if I were you!"

The thread's drifted from that but personally I'd say YANBU. What are you now thinking yourself on this issue?

I was brought up very strongly to stick to my commitments, live with my choices and not let others down though. But I don't think that is a bad thing.

Have you ever heard of 'sunk costs'? It's an accounting term and refers to expenses that you've incurred no matter what future decisions you make.

Logic dictates that you shouldn't factor in sunk costs when making decisions about the future - you should only look at the future costs you will incur if you go down a particular route, and compare those to the future benefits.

But people are notorious for making poor (financial) decisions because they don't want to 'lose' the sunk costs, so they throw good money after bad and/or press on with failing projects.

So, yes, sticking to your commitments is broadly a good thing - but not if doing so will cost you more than you will benefit.

And, most importantly, not if it will cost your children more than they will benefit.

OP, I haven't read your other threads but I sympathise. I think YANBU to be so pissed off. I couldn't put up with a partner with such lack of drive. Good luck x

Cinnabar's post about sunk costs is excellent.

I suspected you might have been using this forum to vent. This relationship is unsustainable, for some reason you are intent on staying in it and on making excuses to minimise the things this man does to you. Your children will not thank you for this later.

You live in the Middle East with an angry man who was abused as a child, who has trained you not to question him by exploding at you, who you have building resentment and anger with and no place to direct it to because you are afraid of him and his reaction and who choked you. That is frightening.

YY totally agree with Cinnabar and Offred above.

No matter how strong and capable you are, no matter how terrible his childhood was, seriously you can't stay in this situation. It sounds dangerous to me, pretending it is fine will not keep you or dc safe.

Tell him either get a full time job or be the SAH parent and look after the kids and house so you do not need the expense of the nanny

I have just read some of the other threads.......what a waste of effort. If you are putting up with something that makes you less than happy, and you are happy to carry on, fine but I'm not going to waste my own emotional labour on this thread op. Good luck whatever happens.

My question was would it be unreasonable to tell him he had to pay his own debts. Not should I leave my husband.

The views seem to be mixed.

Some seem to think its actually abusive to ask my husband to work more than part time to pay debt he incurred before marriage and didn't tell me about until afterwards because I "hold all the cards" financially.

Some think its reasonable.

I like the suggestion that I stage or gradually. By x I'd like you to take over paying y etc.

Thanks for that suggestion. I think I'm going to do that.

If I said that to him snazzy he would say something aggressive and sarcastic like "oh sorry I do fuck all round here. Maybe you should find some other c&nt to do stuff for you if I'm not good enough".

Oh dear. You love him, sometimes (presumably when he's not being abusive and resentful that he's a kept man). He's a good dad (when he can be arsed, and as long as he's not "trapped in the house" with the kids, who he wasn't really keen on having). He "does stuff for you" when he can be arsed.

He can't be bothered looking for work, but you've had to engage a nanny and a cleaner because he can't manage to lift a finger to manage the house and children while you work your butt off.

You have to come on a website and vent at strangers, but that's not going to make one bit of difference to your situation, which requires him to change if it's going to get any better. He's not going to change - why should he? He's got a nice little life there with you paying all the bills and frightened to challenge him to pull his weight.

So it's not going to change, not going to get better, it's just going to get worse and worse.

You can work just as hard here, where there are laws which will protect you.

Come home. Pull the plug on this one for your own sake, and the children's sake. Don't let them grow up thinking this is a healthy relationship.

It is the angry thread at the MIL you need to re-read need. Your husband has grabbed you, choked you, constantly verbally abuses you, you refuse to accept he is violent and abusive. He blames his childhood for his behaviour but will not seek help to sort himself out so that he doesn't behave abusively. Your response seems to be "I am scared of challenging him but he was harmed and I love him and want to be the one constant thing in his life, if I stick it out I can fix him/make him change", that is what a lot of women in abusive relationships think, it may have been what your MIL thought too and one day someone might write the MIL post about your decision to stay with him.

I'm not sure what you learned from childhood was to stick things either it seems to have been to stick at things at any cost which is totally different.

needsome - for a log time i thought i could mak my exp happy. i could not.

he had some similar isues. like you i wethered the storms, bla bla bla. he could be very nice as wella s nasty. he ahd depresison anxiety. etc.

he left his work due to stress, i was main earner, he was SAHP but constantly moaned, i still had to arrange other people to help him if i wanted to go out...
so i can totally get why you get a nanny in; a competent stay at home "parent" to rely on because you cant rely on him....
but in the end, it isnt good enough. whatever his excuses. (when i met him he was in good job, infact earned slightly more than me at the time; bu i "overtook" him..).

do some real thinking.

where do you see yourself in two; five; ten years time?

(i rememmber telling a counsellor that clearly we would not stay together once Dc grew up because he was so critical of me, such a moaner, nothing was good enough etcetc. it wasnt worth the "good" bits.
she asked, why wait? it was a simple quesion but it was more profound than anything i had thought about til then...why indeed...)

will you grow old together when kids grow up?

is it so great that you can wait to spend time with him in your old age? wll you be happpy to be the sole earner for ever more? do you actually want an equal?

will you really be happy to stay with him, watching fo th next blowing up?

it is really beneficial for the dc to live like this?

it is ok to choose to be with him in sickness and in health -so long as his "illness" is not abusive... you can choose to tolerate his anger, violence etc...but what abou dc? what choice do they have?

To add to Cestlavie's post - A friend told me that her counsellor told her to stop talking (ranting) about her partner and focus on just herself, her behaviour and her actions/attitudes during the sessions. It's advice that stuck with me. The friend is now divorced but on good terms with her ex and happy.
OP, I strongly suggest you go to counselling yourself.

I was wondering as I came to the end of the thread is this was the strangly guy, and I see that it is.

If these threads are helping you to stay with this dangerous abuser, then I think we are doing you a disservice when we reply.

I sympathize with both parties - I am self employed and not very good at it whilst I was an excellent and highly productive employee - throw
anxiety into the mix and it is the perfect recipe for procrastination, self loathing, anxiety and further procrastination in a vicious circle -

I expect this isn't a matter of just lazyness and taking advantage of the OP but more difficulties in actually getting his shit together. The bottom line is you really need to talk - seething resentment will eat a way at you -

I agree with others that self employment may not be for him - ask him what would motivate him and make him happy, little point in nagging him to do stuff he isn't motivated to do. Do some reading on procrastination to get an insight into why he is putting those clients off, not taking action etc - much of it is based around fear even if we do not consciously realise it. His self esteem will be suffering as well which will make it harder for him to put himself out there.

Indeed, sleigh

Thanks greeneyed. That's a helpful perspective

I've not read all this thread but I'm not dissimalar to the lazy DH.

It sounds daft but the only thing that has ever helped me is a book called How to Get a Grip by Matthew Kimberley.

You can't withdraw the money immediately buy I think if you did it gradually over twelve months it would help. He needs some motivation.

ask him? he is a grown man.
it really is up to him to come to op and explain what could work for both of them and motivate himself and be happy himself.

it really is down to him. he is an adult. repeat ad nauseum. he is not the op's child. he is supposed to be her partner and a fellow adult working with her to bring up the dc. you can talk and talk with someone but if they don't see it themselves they wont act.

Hi, My personal opinion is that he has become complacent and is happy with the current state of affairs... He gave up his job to move to your country so maybe he feels you owe him in some way (not saying that he should, just saying it might be the case?) I think it's time to sit down and talk. You should not be carrying him financially, and as a father he should be doing more to support his children. I think it's time to sit down and talk: tell him you are beginning to feel resentful and want to address some issues before it develops in to something more. I'd just tell him that you feel you are carrying too much of the financial burden and that he has to make a concerted effort to contribute to the household. This may be by working more (if possible) or losing the nanny (if you've not tied yourself into a contract with her).
I would be careful - even though you feel angry - to be calm and to (if you can) praise the good things he does (ie tell him what you told us: he's a great father, you appreciate he doesn't go out a great deal himself and that he hands over most of what he does earn etc) but that you are feeling strained to breaking point. Tell him what you would like to happen specifically and ask him what he thinks...whether you can reach a compromise??

OK, so getting this all straight...

You have a DH who didn't disclose his debt before you married
He expects you to pay for him, including said pre-marital debt
He does not work to anywhere near his full capacity, and sabotages his own business potential
You are afraid to talk to him honestly
He is verbally and physically abusive
And you live in a muslim state where the male is effectively the owner of the female

But you don't want any advice. You know why you don't want advice? Because you are frightened. You are frightened of what will happen if he leaves.

Well, that's fair enough but you come across as bright and strong. You can get through it without any problem. But seriously, think about your kids. Do you really want them being brought up in an abusive, controlling, unbalanced home life? Especially given their place in the world. Life as an expat is tough - for the kids too. Don't do this to them.