Support for those in Emotionally Abusive Relationships: 13

[CharlotteCollinsislost]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
www.heart-2-heart.ca/women/page1.htm heart to heart]] a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Bloody hell just lost my long post.

Just was trying to say pony so sorry your fw being so weird and awful. No of course you shouldn't be landed with half the bill when you're not living there and he's the main wage earner so sad for you and the dcs and the dsds . xxx

Poche God how incredibly awful, I am so shocked and concerned for you and your dcs Please get out, forget signature, this is terrible, can you fly to your family however far away they are (further the better) and rebuild yourselves there? Support and kindness always available on this wonderful thread. xxx

Pony cheers I am having with you! Fruit and nut fab idea! How great to be having that watershed moment of writing our Xmas cards as a free woman

Have to say trying, feel quite sad about having to write the cards with just our names. But then, things were so awful last Christmas that I literally didn't send any cards, I couldn't bear to write them and pretend to be all happy and Christmassy so blamed it on new baby head and didn't send any, for the first time evaaaaaaah. So maybe I should think about that! [choc]

Hope your day has been filled with less FWittery than earlier?

Hi Pony yes I can imagine it's very much mixed feelings re the Xmas cards. However, I bet if the you of last year could see the you of this year she'd be awed and amazed and filled with new hope (or do I sound bonkers, having just read that over !

FW this end is still being a stupid fw, but it's simmered down from menacing - for now. The dishwasher is increasingly ineffective and I remarked that it was prob reaching the end of its life. However, apparently that's not the case. In fact it's my fault, silly me because I don't know how to load it properly and my ham fisted attempts to run a household are so useless they are now killing machines and appliances if I had that kind of mystical killing power, no not really but you get my drift So I suggested in a pleasant tone that if we worked on it together (FFS!!!!) then we stood a great chance of getting it right. He knew exactly what I was saying but because I said it brightly and cooperatively, could only mutter and adjust the plates - yeah that's going to make it work better. Grrr. Ooh driving me to drink

Poche am really concerned for you - how are you?

Hi Leclerc sounds like your instincts are sound re cards. And that's great you are seeing some nice members of his family, who will no doubt be supportive. If they know him well, they are sure to understand your plight - people (well, decent people) see more than we realise. When I told a distant relative who's also a good friend in confidence about The Great Escape plan and the reasons behind it, she remarked that she had always thought ours was a very "unusual" marriage and we were an unlikely mix but she put it down to great passion behind closed doors HAHAHA. How we laughed

Ahhhh great, he's fucked off to bed

Blimey pony you've made me think now...what the hell am I going to do about Christmas cards! We're living in the same house FFS... do I still need to put FWs name on them?

Glad you have a bit of peace trying

Hi, thanks for all the concern.
Funnily enough, just writing everything on here has made me feel stronger and I've organised everything that needs doing for DS's operation. Have hired a car and have a potential babysitter for DD so that's a weight off my mind.

TBH I'm going to be in a far better position to leave in the new year as I'm squirrelling away money, culling everything, putting all the important stuff into one place and getting him to pay for all the new baby stuff we need and ill be on maternity leave so free to go wherever I please without worrying about work/childcare etc. I'm not underestimating the emotional hardship though. It was DD constantly crying for daddy last time that nearly destroyed me.

I have a relative who (ironically) works with vulnerable families - she lent me a couple of books on abusive relationships - who would be more than happy to put us up. Unfortunately, my mum and brother really aren't in a position to do so because of complications in their own lives.

I know it'll be hard with a new baby but I'm confident that it'll actually be easier than doing it now. DS will have had his surgery that we've been waiting a year for too so that'll be another thing I won't have to worry about.

So are you all mostly still living with your FWs then? How many of you have managed to leave and not come back? How did you do it?

Leclerc, that sounds about right for the cards. I have only recently started putting only our three names on birthday cards - up until then, even though I'd left, I was still putting his name on cards for people who didn't know (but were still my friends). When I say that, it sounds really laaaaaaame...

Bertie, no of course you don't need to put FW's name on them. You are divorcing him. He is a FW. It's you and DS now (hopefully sooner, in the physical house sense, rather than later). And, did I mention, he's a FW? I am toughing it out somewhat, expecting a fair few people to taken aback that it's just our names and we have a new address (and put two-and-two together), and possibly to contact me and I have to explain it all in the run up to Christmas. But still I think better get it over with now then it's done. I have nothing to be ashamed of. I have done nothing wrong. Same for you.

trying, hurrah for some peace! I always had to go to bed at the same time as NSDH, so never got the opportunity to have that 'aaaaaaaaah' time after he went to bed. Indeed, if he was in a particularly foul mood with me, sometimes he's go to bed, switch the tv off and turn off the living room light, leaving me in the pitch dark! And then when I had no choice but to come to bed, would get the hump if I didn't want to, you know... Glad his 'menace' has dialled down. Hold on, it's nearly Monday...

bertie perhaps you could put "with much love from all of us, Bertie and family"?

Though having read pony's post in fact I agree with her re cards, bertie!

trying, that's a good idea. I've done that a few times when I just didn't know what else to put. It covers all situations.

Poche, glad to hear that you are gathering strength. It's amazing how just venting on here can make such a difference, but it really can. Keep on. Only you know what's best for you, if you have a plan then keep reading books (and have a look at the weblinks at the top of the page, they're all useful), keep squirrelling, keep planning. But also, keep safe. If he senses a change in you (and they can seem to sniff a scent of 'she's leaving' from a mile off), his abusiveness, including the physical stuff, will get worse. Be prepared to go whenever.

I left my FW just over six months ago. I just decided one day enough was enough and bolted to my parents' down the road with all I could carry (in a couple of car loads) with my two kids (6 and 5 months at the time). I'm now in a lovely flat, me and my boys. NSDH (not-so-darling husband) is trying to change, getting therapy, still living in our house. Not sure he can change though, but every time I think I'm getting to 'the point', he does something to make me doubt myself. It's hard, even after six months.

Pony yes thank god we are living separate lives; when I was still in the sham of trying to "make things work" (gah), each and every time I would creep up to bed hoping to get some me time with my book and within seconds his radar would sense this and I would hear the dreaded footsteps on the stairs. Then it would be, as you say, "you know", but he would expect me to initiate because I have "hurt him so much over the years" for not wanting to be sex on a tap for him with no other emotional input. Reading was out of the question. Even a tiny reading torch under the fucking covers created enormous strops. Oh, it''s bloody miserable now but so much better than when we shared a room. Hooray for baby steps. I've seen another flat that was one I loved before but it got rented out, but anyway I wasn't fully in the right place then; now it's come free again. However, unfurnished, but dm and others will rally round with temp furniture and I plan to sneak what I can out of house and into storage over next month. Flat comes up 1 Feb so leaves enough time for organising and not doing a runner just before Xmas. It's above budget but hopefully I can negotiate (deja vous)

Pony thank god for family, eh.

poche I am still "inside" but working up to the great escape. I am nearly there, I can taste freedom, but it's so bloody hard breaking through the mental wall IYSWIM. As you, and all of us, know. I am glad you feel stronger for venting, please vent as much as you like - good that your relative understands and you have a haven to run to in emergency. As pony said, read the links over and over, they are very liberating lightbulb moments, I found. Good luck!

That sounds good re the flat trying. Fingers crossed for some more negotiation - you sound like you're good at it, if you did it before (I'm terrible!).

I've just had to change a still-poorly DS2 - poo coming out of his babygrow arms & everything. Can't believe he was at NSDH's all day and he said he didn't poo once, lost count of the nappy changes yesterday, am almost half thinking he's just saying that to undermine me, paranoid much!!

Anyway, flat reeks of poo, I've already got a wine headache, and I think it's time for bed! Good night all.

Ah pony poor you and DS2! Poor poppet - I hope you and him get some quality sleep tonight. Gnight! x

hi pony, how are you today? its so difficult doing everything on your own when they are sick isn't it. i hope your ds is better. dd wasn't well this week either and its very draining... when she goes to dh his mum just does most of it. i was thinking to wait till they go on holiday and then say im sick and send her up for a few days, or book that week myself and say im on hols, just so he can see for himself what its like looking after a dc on his own. just for a few days - do him no harm! does your FW realise he is emotionally abusive and what kind of therapy is he getting? dh admitted everything to me when we first separated but since then he hasn't, and apart from saying there is things he did wrong, he is more saying i was to blame too and stress was to blame. i don't think he would ever go to counselling as an 'emotional abuser'
the whole thing is so hard - i can't get my head round divorce yet. but its hard to make plans for the future when we are living in limbo like this separated with no real understanding of whats going on. i guess i just want answers of whats going to happen now, but lifes not really like that.

Morning! DS2 pretty unsettled in the night (no more escaping poo, thankfully) and very whiny this morning. Poor wee boy, he must be feeling really poorly, that's nearly a week now. Sorry to hear your DD been unwell too, jan - it is draining (am knackered today)! That's an interesting question about does my NSDH realise. I really don't know. He's sent emails saying he knows he's been abusive and apologising, and sounding very repentant. But it's just writing words, I'm not sure he would admit it if I spoke to him face-to-face. He gets a bit defensive. There are no 'abuser programmes' near where we are so he's getting CBT at the moment - he has other problems, not just being abusive - and that is addressing how he reacts, etc, but still doesn't tackle the root I don't think.

I can't get my head around divorce either. The thought of it all, and all the upheaval, the conflict, the unknown, makes me want to run away. I'm nice and settled in my flat at the moment, I'm not sure I can face another change of dynamics, but I know it can't stay like this forever. And I don't want to do it. I can't visualise actually having to do it. But I think it's inevitable but I don't know how to get from where I am at the moment to there.

Bertie, I was thinking about you and the Christmas card situation earlier (because you are all on my mind, even if I'm not online). I found that the world didn't end last year even though I didn't send cards - I was concerned people would be majorly offended, but I think in general they either didn't notice, or if they did I'm sure they understood, or perhaps just thought 'Hmm, bit strange, oh well'. I guess what I'm meaning is - don't give yourself extra stress, just do what you want to do and what you feel comfortable doing. If the thought of cards and what to put is too much - just feck it. If anyone asks, you can always say you decided not to send any this year and donate to charity instead (or something like that). Or just send them to those you people you want to. It feels like a 'big' thing, but once Christmas is past, it wont be a big thing at all.

i don't think i am going to send cards this year. i hope noone will get offended...

hmm so he is getting CBT for other problems! yeah. it just make me worry that nothing about his attitude to you is really changing - words are words. my dh is like that all the time... he made everyone cry with his wonderful wedding speech! and is still the same... can talk the biggest rubbish of how sorry he is how much he loves me. if he went to counselling i know he would just be talking about what a rough time we have had, and how sorry he is for himself etc.... i am not convinced it is going to help him change.

someone i know whose worked with sufferers of domestic violence for years has said she has yet to see an abuser change. this really discouraged me. she did tell of someone getting back with someone though, and things changed because SHE was stronger, and wouldn't take the crap from him anymore. she also said that divorce never really becomes an issue until you want to remarry - but the thing is, how can you just remain separated for years, knowing that divorce could be on the cards at any time in which case all your possessions or savings for yourself or dcs could be at risk. it all seems very risky. aw well i am worrying here but i know God knows the future.

i hope you have a better day with your ds today... im also exhausted today i don't feel like doing anything at all. hard to keep going at times!

jan, I emailed Respect just after I initially left, and told them what had happened, said that NSDH had gone into counselling (at that time he was just in ordinary counselling, he's only just started the CBT in the last few weeks), asking what was the likelihood of NSDH changing. I've picked out a few relevant things from the reply I got.

'Unfortunately, [ordinary] counselling does not get to the route of the violence and abuse and in our experience does not work. Only you will know if the support he gets is making a difference,you will know by his actions and behaviour towards you and by his responses towards you. If you feel safer and no longer feel like you are walking on eggshells that might be a sign of his behaviour changing. However, even if he went on a violence intervention programme it would not mean that he would make choices not to be violent and abusive towards you... he will almost certainly blame you or minimise the violence and abuse, which means he is not taking responsibility for his violence and abuse towards you.'

It's actually been useful for me to look over that email reply again - I wrote it from the perspective of having just left, my mind whirling and full of thoughts about whether I'd done the right thing, whether he could change, etc, etc. It's strange reading it back, six months down the line. My NSDH has always been able to write and say beautiful things that make me melt. Reading his emails makes me cry. But I also used to cry when he'd shout in my face and hurt me.

I know what you mean about divorce - I think without divorce, it would feel as if there was no closure. I don't know what to do right now. Probably nothing, at least till after Christmas.

that email is very useful and so true. they can go through anything and still only we are the ones who know and have the right to say if they have changed or not. thats quite a revelation for me - I can choose, not him, or anyone else, whether he has changed sufficiently for me to be able to cope with having him back again.

yeah. you are right... there is no point worrying at the minute, lets get christmas over with, then see what happens from there. i guess while its important to feel like theres a closure, there isn't a big rush for it all to happen either. i things were rushed i think it would just cause a lot more stress - one thing at a time is the way to do it - easier to deal with that way.

Phew what a lot of posts. I/we sent no Christmas cards last year, except a couple of Jackie Lawson ecards I sent to Mum and a friend. I am about to write letters to people to explain my divorce and send a card. Some of these are friends I'd lost touch with, except for Christmas cards, because I had no positive things to tell them about my life - or rather, no positive answers to work for either me or ex, our hols (hah! what hols) and our life as a couple.

Poche he sounds as if he might have times when he is sectionable - I speak as a mh service user here. Do bear this in mind. A danger to himself or others

Ok a question for you ladies...

Why would FW be asking for DSs passport and birth certificate? He texted me this morning asking for them (and his will). He knows i keep all the important documents so it may be that he just wants copies of them...but I'm incredibly suspicious of everything he does at the moment...

I believe I'm right in thinking that as we both have parental responsibility (married and on birth certificate as parents) either of us could apply for a copy of DSs birth certificate or for a new passport. So it doesn't really matter if I keep the originals and just give him photocopies for his records....what do you all think?