Narcissist?

[BabylonPI]

Is there a straightforward definition please?
Is there a list of narcissistic tendencies or traits

I hear the term a lot these days and a lot on here, but I don't know what it is/means.

Thank you.

Grimma I was once told by a prof many years ago old age is the only cure ...but like you to Swallow I think death is the only cure tbh as you can't change them...but then the memories can haunt too...sorry!
UA reading your post about your ex was like reading one of the stories in Narcissim (name of book) your ex was text book example too!

so, is this narc thing on the increase, or are we just more knowledgeable about it? Or more focused on it so we see a devil in every woodshed?

springy have thought of fostering...to give all that love you got to young children who you can empathise with as been is some of their shoes. Giving love is what you grave to and it would be therapeutic both ways as you could have relationships that could be life long!

It is the same as any disorder/condition is it increasing or is awareness and diagnosis better these days....but internet sites that allow attention they crave is Disneyland to a Narc! So we see more due to being a smaller world due to communication systems such as FB, websites etc

springy have you thought of fostering

crave

sorry someone must have moved the keys

at someone moving the keys.

i just read a novel called, "into the darkest corner" which has a scary gaslighting freak in it who moves things around etc. his victim ends up having ocd but the ocd is actually incredibly rational in a way in response to what he put her through. a really good page turner - when i got it it was 99p for kindle. do like the opportunity to recommend a book if i have enjoyed it.

Why do narcs crave attention.
Is it because they didnt have it properly in the cruical early years of their lives?

Amillion, my mother doesn't have any mental illnesses or learning difficulties, neither does she suffer from mood disorders. I hope that answers your question! I'm not a psychiatrist to diagnose her, although I have spent hours detailing her patterns of thought & feeling to professionals treating me.

I have depression and CFS/ME. My house is partially-decorated, chaotic and grubby. It's a small house and not in disrepair, just neglected. A handful of able-bodied people could sort it out in under two days.

This is starting to feel like self-justification, though I realise you didn't mean so. I'll leave the conversation again for now :)

I am sorry if I have upset you in any way garlicnutty.
I realise this situation is upsetting for you.
If it helps,when you next come on here,you can tell me to stop posting on here,and I will.

Seriously,I will come and give you a hand with your house,if I live anywhere near you.You would need to pm me with just the general area of where you live if you are interested.
Cant do DIY though,as I am hopeless at it .

Amillion, I've devoted much of the past ten years to learning about personality disorders in depth, and in therapy to fix the damage to my psyche. The answers to your questions are complex I'm afraid.

I understand both my parents very well - my siblings, not quite so well these days. My father was a proper psychopath - I suspect he was diagnosed during a particular work episode, though he wouldn't have told anyone of course. He confided in me (inappropriately) and I have a very good picture of the horrific torment of his soul. He was in hell. He projected hell onto other people, too. Mum is either a narcissist or so flea-infested it makes no difference. Her inner core is - in her own words - a peaceful void. I could go on about the dynamics between them, me and my sibs for ... well, ten years and counting!!

It seems pointless, but perhaps necessary, to reiterate that my entire family - next generation included - is "glittery". They're abnormally beautiful and accomplished. It generally takes strangers about six months of acquaintance to start noticing that they are somehow strange.

In family photos, I am the one who is visibly dysfunctional. Not them.

Oh, that's really sweet of you! Thanks :) :)

I have an idea of where you are, amillion - not close; you're off the hook. Really appreciate your kind thought! x

thanks swallow will get that bargin for 99p!
Gaslighting I think is the cruelest thing out of all the tools a Narc uses! I nearly lost my sanity over it esp the satan songs on special dates and kicking my door when ds and I alone in the house! I thought it was some sort of evil phenonimonimon projected by ex doing damage and just making me go out of my mind with sleep deprivation, terror and close miss breakdown!

garlic you possibly know more than most criminologists! You should go round UK giving talks and get paid a lot for your knowledge on the subject! It is an area UK is still in 'stonage' compared to USA.

yes they can get worse before they get better though - as in supposedly they typically get much worse when their parents die and there are no checks and balances above them. then of course, as you say, they get older and can mellow through needing their children or simply through pragmatically knowing they can't have total control over their adult children so have to restrain themselves somewhat. especially if those kids start to exercise boundaries. it's all very precarious though - they can surprise you with an explosion that doesn't serve them at all really but they couldn't hold in their rage.

thats really interesting Swallow - my parents came here in the 60's from Ireland, and so never had the influence of extended family. My Dad never had to answer to anyone, yet had to have total control over us and our lives.

Since my mum died, his behaviour has got worse, because she kept things on an even keel.

His recent explosions are certainly not serving him well, as he is sitting alone, dying from terminal cancer, but STILL he cannot stop the rage.

Although I've done the fostering training, sea, I'm not ready to foster. I'd love to do it (and had planned to one day) but there is too much going on with my family at the mo - I couldn't introduce a kid who is already traumatised into the current mess (for both our sakes, but especially the foster child/ren). There has recently been a very horrible resurgence of family stuff and it's all out on the surface at the mo - very painful for me, not a good time to foster. Thanks for the vote of confidence though.

hi - i asked mumsnet to take down my last post as i realised it was way too identifying if anyone (particularly family) read it.

I read it, SAF, and empathised.

It's such a pity that we're frightened our relatives might read our confessions of vulnerability.

Oddly enough, after deciding I'd had enough of self-censoring, I explained the whole business in detail to them ... and they still pretend everything's normal!
Thinking back, I don't know what I was afraid of. Must have been that old FOG, eh.

I'm lucky then because my family couldn't give a toss if I was dead except my mum...actually my sis said to my mum 'as far as I am concerned they are both dead' (meaning ds and I) about 5 years ago ...my brother is around the corner from both of us in the cemetery:(

Just delurking.

I have been following this thread since Sunday, it has been particularly helpful as we are going through some family crap again. My own family are actually lovely (so hope I'm not being an intruder) but dp's family are not. There is one member who we no longer contact due to appalling behaviour who I suspect is a narc, and most of the others certain have narc traits ie fleas. The member who we no longer contact is poisoning other family members, and definitely trying to punish us. We try to withdraw, as I really don't want my dc to be affected by their toxic behaviour!

The backbiting/gossiping/refusing to acknowledge awful behaviour/ lack of responsibility/saying sorry/blanking is all too familiar. I find it extremely weird as my family are open and honest with each other, but every time you even try this with ILs it just results in nasty backstabbing. I cannot get over how it is ok to say the most awful things about people behind their backs and yet beyond the pale to try to discuss any problems. This is a little vague as I don't want to be outed either, I have already said my bit and am now facing the consequences but don't want to make it worse . Dp's family literally cannot have any family gathering without some kind of fallout, often about something really minor, but it just gets escalated into ridiculousness with nobody backing down and then afterwards pretending nothing's happened. Dp is definitely the scapegoat, and by extension the dcs and I are too. I don't think we would ever pretend it was all ok and then say sorry, though, I suppose it would make life easier until the next time.

Oh, I have just read "Into the darkest corner", ironically I think it was in a pile of books from Christmas I hadn't got round to reading, so probably from one of dp's family. It is a real page turner. I couldn't believe her friends wouldn't believe her, but maybe that's because I have no experience of this myself.

Sorry, that was an essay!

interesting essay

kudos for not running for the hills when you first met his family! hope things settle down.

How interesting it must be for you to see a family like this close up, but not actually know from your own family experience what this is like, chick. (don't think I worded that too well ie you probably see is more clearly than those of us brought up in it. You have a good benchmark to compare it to as well.

I am so the scapegoat in my family that my family has done everything they can to separate my children from me. This goes back years and years, though I've only just recognised it for what it is.

Not sure it is interesting!

I think I didn't run for the hills as although I "knew" they were dysfunctional and dp had been on the receiving end of EA; it has been only over the years, particularly since having dc that I have actually experienced it.

It is completely horrific and stressful to deal with as an adult (who is relatively stable, happy etc.) let alone for a child. I feel so sorry for dp and anyone who has had to grow up with this. Dp was told by a psychiatrist as a teenager that it wasn't him but his parent that was the problem. We have very little to do with his family, we "manage" mil by withdrawing when bad behaviour occurs but the rest live far away not far enough.

springyhope, how awful! The unfairness just gets to me. My df said to let it go about the latest drama. My df came from a family where he too was the scapegoat (what does that say about me?) so wise words.

Colleysmill
From what I remember of the 3 years of hell that was my life when I was with him, most people adored him on first meeting, it was only as they got to know him better that you got feeling that something wasn't quite right although most couldn't put their finger on what that was.

I'd be interested to hear more on this , I highly suspect my ex is the same and as turning my brain over that I could be creating a monster in my mind