I am a shrew but is DH an arse? (long)

[braketime]

Not sure what to do. Yesterday we went to the Olympics to see the diving. Long wait to the awards ceremony, so suggested we leave early and go look round the park (DD lolling around complaining she was hot). Kids fought on and off all day and I did snap at them. When we get home at long last, I start getting them ready for bed. Yell at DD not to get out of the bath to show her dad her blister but to get back in and finish off first. DH then snaps, throws washing basket on ground, calls me a bitch in front of the kids and then says I ruined his day by leaving the Aquatic centre before the awards ceremony. I'm completely flummoxed but apparently he'd already told me earlier that this was what he wanted to do and I'd put him in a bad position by asking to leave (and then clearly sulked about it for the rest of the day).

Later on I tell him it was unacceptable behaviour, he then says I ruined his life by having a second child and we should separate and take one kid each as this is the only way to stop them fighting. Refuses to apologise and says his life is being ruined by the negativity around the children. Then tells me that i ruined his day by insisting we leave the awards ceremony. I told him I would have stayed if he'd said so but he didn't - I can't see that I did wrong but according to him it is all my fault and I should have remembered that he'd said before he wanted to watch it and I'd put him in an awkward position.

We do fight a lot, we snap at the kids a lot, they fight a lot. We are a disharmonious family. We could probably do with parenting lessons. But this is extreme surely?

DH always drags up old ground, criticises my parenting in front of the kids as says I yell too much. But the other weekend he threw a cup of water in DD's face as she was rude to him when he asked her what she wanted to drink (she said "whatever"). No apology to any of us, I just had to take a screaming DD upstairs to bed.

I'm sure if I were a better parent then life would be better. But do I have a right to expect better behaviour from him. Both DD and DS challenging - DS constantly in trouble at school (10), DD (7) very dramatic and high-maintenance at home (always screaming!). We got an educational psychologist to see DS as the school were up in arms - more money out the door. I am worried that DH will walk out as he finds the kids unbearable, to be honest I couldn't afford to live with the kids on my own. Should I just bite my tongue and get on with life?

christ Callisto I'm not posting under AIBU!

I guess I am being thick because the only question I can find is this one:

Has he always been like this or is it just since the children arrived?

DH always been a bit of a manic depressive (up and down) and I have always been someone who yells first and apologises later. You will be thankful to know that most of the time I don't do this at work! I do grumble but my staff generally praise my management skills, heh.

Or perhaps these are the questions although they tend to masked by pejorative statements about me:

am I aware that my behaviour and DH's is not good modelling behaviour for the kids?

Yes of course. Wouldn't be posting here otherwise.

Why don't I do lego - well, it seems to me that lego is a very private thing - you make your own world. DD does this, DS doesn't. I did try playing card games but DD always cries when she loses so we don't tend to. But do try eg playing catch?

DS - well yes he is very dreamy and disorganised. But he is also trouble and always has been at school, starting from nursery, and has found it very hard to make friends. I could go into the psych report but this is perhaps not pertinent here. DD on the other hand is a model student and reasonably well like - although I do see some controlling instincts they are masked by her desire to be liked and she has the social skills to keep them in check.

You are clearly under a lot of stress, as is your partner, and as are your children. You are at least reaching out for advice and suggestions. Have you tried to stop yelling at them, tried anger management techniques? It might be worth reading up on some of those, or discussing your problem with anger with your GP, to see if s/he can offer any help or suggestions.

You say that your DS "definitely has something going on" - I assume you mean something like ADHD, but not necessarily that? Have you spoken to your GP and the school to ask their opinions? Does his Dad agree with you about this? If so, what research has he done to try to find out what might be the problem?

This sounds an awful way to live, for all of you.

on the water thing I was shocked but it is interesting to see how many of you are (because DH hasn't really admitted it).

seek out some counselling and parenting classes for you .

invite dh along but if he refuses dont worry so much - just getting chance to look at your own behaviour / get advice on parenting techniques will help.
[so you can then use them on dh too...]

dont focus on playing with lego or not - there are other ways to do stuff as a family, take a walk, take them to park etc.

but you could sit down with them and do for example drawing - all of you draw your family might be interesting to see how the dc draw you and h ....

and some of it is resentment. I know I yell too much. But DH just blames his bad behaviour on me and the kids, not his own lack of self control. it's hard to be selfless when you resent someone's behaviour so much.

and dont issue threats you wont carry out - you yell at them "if they don't behave I will leave them with the nanny full time and work "

if you need /want to work and leave them with a nanny then do it - but not as a punishment....

and try and stop yelling.

take a breath before you yell...
turn your voice to calm low but firm voice.

you cannot change h's behaviour - only he can

but you can surely start by changing yours.

stop yelling.

This is awful for all 4 of you. Please seek help.

I used to be the shouter in my family (like my dad before me) and I even got my GP to send me on an anger management course which didn't help.

What did help was when DH and I ended up in couples counselling for an unrelated matter. The shouting came up and the counsellor really helped. I would never have believed it possible to make such a radical change. Being controlled by your temper is a horrible way to live but I used to be raging before I was even aware that I was cross. Not any more though and I wish I'd had this help years ago.

My genuine advice to you is that if your husband won't change, he needs to leave, for the sake of your children. 1 of you getting help with this really won't work.

Just FYI, there is mild ASD in my family and some things you have said about your son and yourself are ringing bells.

My children have put me in the water situation too. I have responded by saying "Oh, you don't want any water." and not made them a drink.
Throwing a drink is really shocking.

You don't sound like you're in much danger of being selfless. You say you yell and then forget about it, I bet the kids don't forget. Think about how scary and stressful it is for someone bigger than you to start screaming every time you mess up. Which all children do because they are learning how to control their emotions.

You seem to be saying "I yell but DH is worse and it's not my fault because he won't take responsibility". Grow up, refuse to engage in squabbling and one-upmanship with the other ADULT and protect your children.

Your DH and the water incident is awful, you tolerating it is awful. Who is going to protect that little girl?

Woa here a minute ladies.

This woman is well aware that things are bad and she needs help.

Yes the water thing is awful but let's save the 'shoot from the hip' judgy pants for AIBU.

She is asking for advice - not an angry pasting.

You see, here's the thing. When one parent is dashing water in a child's face and the other is yelling and screaming and you are considering taking one child each if you seperate, you must know why your children behave the way they do. And you must know you need counseling, you, DH, and family counseling. You must know this.

You know your DCs are not growing up in a good environment. So I don't understand why you are posting here asking what to do. Have you tried anything different? Have you put any strategies in place?

And btw to say you would take one child each is pretty awful.

She clearly doesn't or why would she be asking for advice and opening herself up like this

yes he is an arse...

Yes some kind of family therapy would be best, maybe counselling for you two.

As someone else said, sort yourself out and the rest should follow. You and your DH need to act like adults rather than children.

What do you think yelling accomplishes? Surely you know by now that it doesn't turn children into obedient angels. Quite the contrary.

Throwing a drink into the face of a 7 yr old girl for a sulky answer is truly shocking. 7 yr old girls are sulky, moody, and whiney. I know, because I have one Still you need to lead by example and show her how to talk/act in a socially acceptable manner.

FussArse what do you think made the difference? Any tips?

I am pretty sure DH won't go near a counsellor and tbh having forked out close to £1k on getting advice on DS I don't think I can afford any help for me!

on DS - i think he has a very strong world view and if things don't go according to this then he gets cross - it's his way of making sense of things. However teachers and children don't appreciate being told what to do by a 10yr old, even if sometimes he is right. And there are some things he does that drive me wild (automatically doing the one thing I've just said don't do is one). I get on much better with DD but she is the one who drives DH mad.

why do people post on Mumsnet? It's because they can't tell anybody else what's going on without feeling vulnerable. I forgot I'd used this nickname for DS before (and also for my lust for a mulberry bag) but basically I post because I'm trying to work out in my own head whether my life is shit or not.

oh and it was not me saying we would take one child each - that was DH's solution which prompted all of this posting.

Yelling - don't any of you ever yell? i guess not. I am not a patient person, I am an angry person, and my kids annoy me hence I yell. At work nobody annoys me so I don't yell. Yelling is an indulgence, it is a lack of self control - I know that, but I lack the self discipline not to yell because I do care whether eg we get to school on time.

Why is everyone being horrible to the OP about the "one child each" thing? That was her H's suggestion, not hers, no?

I was upset as much as anything by the fact that her H openly says (repeatedly?) that the second child ruins his life. How can you wish your child didn't exist - and say so? Her H is not taking responsibility for anything. He is saying that the child ruined his life, the two fighting are ruining his life, the child exists because of its mother, ergo everything is someone else's fault and he gets off scot free. He sounds like a pathetic teenager.
They are his children (and hers); he needs to be a parent, and set the tone, not react to the children's tone. Fighty whiney children do drive you up the wall, but you just have to fake it and pretend you don't want to run screaming for the hills, not start whining and being aggressive yourself. I get the sense that OP knows this but he doesn't (OP was trying to mitigate the whining by going for a walk, in other words finding ways to facilitate their decent behavior even if putting aside your preferences to see the awards or whatever). I think it is pathetic that he thinks he is a victim of the tone set by the children when it is his job to enforce - singlehandedly if necessary - the tone he would prefer. Be the change you want, I suppose. Truer even of parents than anyone.

Op, you seem to think yelling is normal. It's not. I dont yell neither does do. I hope you seek the help you need.

I think you both need to see that your behaviour is unacceptable and very far from putting the children first. If you will excuse the psychobabble, the two of you admitting that there is a problem will be a massive step on the way to the solution. But it sounds as if both of you take the option of blaming the other person.

That said, you don't make your partner out to be very approachable, at least not at the moment, so it's easier said than done. At the very minimum, I would ask him to discuss any issues he has with you out of earshot of the children.

Are you sure you want to be in this relationship? I know you said you can't afford not to have your partner, but he can't just disown his own kids. Sounds like nobody is happy right now.

x-post with OP - I also meant to ask Fussarse if she could share some of the anger stuff that actually worked.

OP, if you gave your DH an ultimatum - counselling or bust - would he go?

You seem to think it's OK to yell at your DC because you are "like that" they annoy you!

It is not OK. Stop excusing yourself, and him.

Do you and DH love each other? If not, you should split up.

Yes, i yell at times. I hate it. No one is a perfect parent. Although some of us give that impression, on here particularly

I think that you would both benefit from going to Parenting Classes, yes. Your DH must surely acknowledge throwing a cup of water in his young daughter's face is the worse thing he should be doing and then he wonders why she's on the ceiling?

And the constant pulling apart of your parenting skills infront of the children is a no no too. They copy the argumentative unhappy tension at home and the only way you can change things is by being a united front or going your seperate ways. I think you need some serious talks.