Being drink does not mean you deserve it.

[OhNoMyFanjo]

I have been reading some comments on tge DM site re an interview with a women who was raped. Her rapist has just been convicted. She has had many terrible things said about her in her community due to the rapist being a pillar of tge community.

I wanted to share this comment that someone has made as it sums up what should be obvious to everyone but unfortunately there are some people who don't get it.

You don't get raped because you are drunk - you vomit because you are drunk. You get raped because the rapist standing next to you made the decision to rape you and acted on it. The rapist is the only one accountable for going on to rape a person. End.

There's the rub, you are unlikely to be in control drunk or not. It has no bearing on it. Rapists control and create vulnerability.

Offred, no, again you are implying that I am saying 'in general'. I would like to think that by this stage I've made it perfectly clear that is not what I am saying. I'm not sure why you think I'm back pedalling. I know I said that my boys/my girls comment in the context of coming at it from both sides. Ie giving the message not to rape to boys/men while still telling women that they are vulnerable in certain situations. I was told not to walk home drunk and/or alone. I don't think there is anything wrong with that message because unfortunately there are rapists out there who exploit women in that situation. This does not mean that I am saying it's the only situation in which women are raped.

Tbh I would tell my boys not to drink to excess either becuase it makes them vulnerable too but that wasn't really relevant to the particular point I was making.

Yes boys - don't go around "generally" raping people(!)

I refer you to my original comment about the "I will teach boys x and girls y" and why it is "victim blaming" and rapist entitling.

Have you established that there are rapists who opportunistically attack strangers because they are drunk?

Tdada, thats why rape myths should be challenged as vocally as possible. It stops the muddying of water and potential victim blaming.

I tell my ds not to get unconcious drunk as it could kill him through inhaled vomit, liver damaged, falls off cliffs etc. He could be raped anywhere anytime.

Offred, sorry but I don't understand either of your last posts.

Yes, daughter nor anyone else cannot be fully in control. Conscious men and women are victims everyday, sadly. Giving sons and daughters advice or various risks is NOT passing the buck from the criminal to the victim. It is always the victim to blame.

However, I am aware of certain behaviors of some men and I will help my daughter and sons by passing on my advice trying to do so in a positive way. Karate may not save my daughter but it might give her an option that she may not have otherwise had. Same for my sons who also fight karate.

It is always the criminal to blame off course...apologies

The statistics on rape are shocking and I think too much time is spent with the focus on the victim. So I am switching off cause this must be hugely frustrating and angering to many closely affected. So I teach my daughter karate but spend more time talking to my son about his sexual conduct.

Bumbley, if your earlier posts weren't perpetuating victim blaming rape myths, why were so many of them deleted?

I'm not sure running. I may ask MNHQ myself.

Do that, Bumbley.

I don't think you'll like the answer though. They were deleted because MNHQ made a pledge as part of the I believe you campaign to not allow rape myths stand on the boards.

Well seeing as I wasn't posting rape myths then they are in the wrong.

Plus, you are wilfully misunderstanding what aspect of your posts people are objecting to.

It is completely irrelevant that you agree that not all rape victims are drunk - what you said is still objectionable even if it only applies to a minority of rapes.

It is objectionable because it is victim blaming. Whether you think you're victim blaming or not is irrelevant too - what you have written here (much of it now deleted) is victim blaming.

Running, nothing I have written has been victim blaming. It may have been misinterpreted and reported but it's pretty clear that a lot of posters haven't actually understood my posts given the accusations. MN have been deleting a lot of posts recently - have a look at all the complaints about it on the chat board.

Running, what aspect of my posts is objectionable/victim blaming in your opinion.

Oh, I thought they've pledged to be more even handed about deletions now. But they did pledged not to tolerate rape myths - why else did your posts go?

The worst examples were subject to the big red button Bumbley - but surely for so many posters on this thread to read victim blaming in your posts, you must have been....er... victim blaming.

Walter, I think sometimes these attitudes are so entrenched in society, people don't even realise that they are victim blaming.

Actually running, reading back, it looks like some of my posts were deleted because they were replies to deleted posts by kiss and Walter.

Walter, you're wrong. Admitting vulnerability is not admitting guilt and suggesting vulnerability is not blaming.

I think you're right running. But there have been literally hundreds of well-written, well-informed posts on here that would surely give pause for thought?

Actually running, a lot of people jumped on the band wagon in agreement with other people's interpretations of my posts. It happens a lot on MN. Some of the twists were completely ludicrous - a poster earlier today suggesting that I must think she's 'gagging for it' becuase she's more vulnerable becuase she's disabled for example yeah right.

Nice try, Bumbley. Many of your deleted posts are before Walter's attack. Why don't you just take some responsibility for what you wrote, and stop trying to blame every one else?

Everyone was incensed by your posts, your inability to take on board the very eloquent arguments against your posts. And you're still here - trying to insist that you didn't say this or that, that people were jumping on the bandwagon

Did I say all running? I said some. I think this is part of your problem - take a post, read it, discard what you dont want to see and twist it into what you want it to say.