Does he have a point or do I? Aaaargh!!!

[peedoffbird]

Due to a £200 a month drop in tax credits which I am gutted at (not sure how we will cope now), I have asked xh if he can assist with some expenses for dd. I get that he may not want to do this as he does pay maintenance (albeit a paltry amount). If he doesn't, dd will have to drop an activity and she doesn't do much as it is. This however, is not the main point as I do realise that she doesn't NEED this.

I currently pay for After School Club and have managed to get my need for it down to one session. Xh uses it 3 times a week so I have asked him if he could pay his way as he is the one using it (paying for his own sessions that is). He says categorically that he will not do this and if I try to get him to pay then he will reduce my maintenance payments accordingly.

I am so upset tonight. I have tried to explain to him that this is only for the benefit of our dd but he sees it as "subsidising" ME. He is such a complete nob and I can hardly bear to think about him (think two holidays a year for him).

He says that, if I took this to the CSA then I would be worse off again as they take into account the expenses he pays for her.

I am at a loss and have just had enough of being so broke and am livid at xh and the government and everything and everybody!!

DP has recently been made redundant and has a part-time job but desperately trying to find more work.

Thanks for listening.

Good, you've called his bluff by finding out what he should be paying. Turn the tables so he knows you've talked to them, then see how much of a 'hard man' he wants to pretend to be.

Definitely go the CSA and let us know how you get on. If he works as PAYE then it's very straightforward. He could be awkward and not provide information but in that case they will just go straight to his employer. No expenses he has will be included.

The CSA comes into it's own when parents can't resolve finances. DH had something similar with his ex as he was paying full time nursery costs for several years after dss started school. He attempted to have mediation with his ex to work out what a suitable budget would be - DH was very happy to pay childcare & activities etc. He went to the CSA as a means of a 3rd party involvement and it's works well. No further debate about what's included so it can reduce conflict.

I would let your ex know that you have applied - position it as a neutral party to because you and he can't discuss finances without conflict. If he stops maintenance it will still be due from when you applied (which is today?)

Quick update - he is getting worse. He has now text me to say that he is sick of my demands for money and my game playing and is now going to cut contact to every other weekend with one overnight. Can't believe he would do this to his beloved dd. He may be bluffing but he is doing this to make me comply but I won't. I'm still going ahead with my plans as this is the last time he attempts to control me.

Can I please run by you his argument about why I should pay for his after school club usage please? I am losing sight of what is right and wrong as normal.

He says that I need after school club due to my job. Which of course is true. He says that as I need it I must pay for all of it out of my income and maintenance money and that, even though he uses it, he shouldn't have to pay for it as I inititiated its use to begin with. My God, I'm screwed up in the head and can't see clear. Does he have a point?

No he doesnt.

He needs it on the days he has DD, you dont because she isnt your responsibility that day.

Hes taking the piss, oh and does he realise if he cuts contact times down to once a fortnight he will have to pay more maintenance>?

Let him cut contact, it will make your life easier for the time being.

If he didn't have dd during the week would you use the afterschool club, would that be enough ie do you rely on him to help out?

Absolutely though his days childcare is his responsibility - does he need to use the childcare on his days?

Bollocks! If you feed DD breakfast one day and he feeds her supper, are you liable for the cost of her supper because you're the one who started feeding her that day? Obviously not, so why should you pay for childcare he uses just because you used it first? You've essentially gone to the trouble of organising it for him and so that means you have to pay? What a load of cobblers.

If he doesn't need to use the childcare, great, can it be scaled back to only days when you need it? Or he can find a suitable alternative if it's cheaper. But if he is responsible for your daughter on particular days, then he is using the childcare, not you.

This is really simple.
If he doesn't want you to go to the CSA then it can ONLY be because he knows he will have to pay more. There can be no other reason.

And as already said, if he reduces his contact time he will have to pay more. You already said that he doesn't always take them when he should.

You are in a very strong position. Go for it!

This is exactly what the CSA is for. Let them do their job and decide how much he should be paying.

Thanks everyone. Random, I do need to use the ASC but not much and I can cope if he drops contact, although I think he is relying on me to back down to keep the peace. Leguminous, he does need it but would rather drop contact than need it and have to pay for it because that would mean I am "winning". The last time something like this happened and I didn't back down he publicly humiliated me, which I have never forgotten.

I have to admit that I am fearful of going head to head with him as he will find a way to get back at me. He is very vengeful.

Money is very important to him and he already thinks that I have taken "his" money from him when we settled during the divorce. By the way, I only got what was the norm in terms of money and no more - had to sell the family home and split the money etc.

It's very difficult to describe what he is like. I am so exhausted at the moment from working full-time and these mind games.

Sallying, I think you are right. He can't bear to let the status quo be changed and he is very angry at me for trying to do so.

The less contact he has the more he will have to pay so he is shooting himself in the foot. I agree, just hand it to the CSA and let them sort him out. You won't get anywhere arguing with him, he will never understand where you are coming from because he doesn't want to, so save your energy. If he is cutting contact and the CSA are handling the money, he's lost all his power over you so there's not a lot he can do to get back at you.

Oh, and you are right, you should not be paying for the childcare he uses.

Yep go to the CSA.

Tell the ASC that you are booking in for days x y z and to send you the invoice for those nights only.

Inform him in writing that if he wishes to continue with contact on nights a and b to let you know and if he wishes to use ASC to arrange it himself

Sounds like he want to control you and when you step out of line he loses it?

Definitely go to the CSA.

You pay the afterschool club per session, right? Not the whole week?
So it doesn't matter who started it.

You could be using a childminder.

He pays for what he uses for childcare.

For the sake of your DC you could point out that the CSA will make him pay more (check) than what he pays now for the club, if he cuts contact.

Yes Random, he wants total control.

Am feeling a bit sick - have just had a very cold text from him outlining his "two step plan" for reduction in contact. My poor little girl. He has outlined how much money he will give me according to the CSA calculator, which is more than his current money plus paying for his own ASC bill a month. I don't get this at all.

He will then implement "stage two" in September when he will drop even further.

My God, what is he doing. Dd will be devastated and I don't understand any of this. All this from me asking him to pay his way in ASC.

He is getting married soon and had intimated a couple of months ago that he would look at dropping contact as dd is getting older (10 yo) - shit, I feel freaked out by this.

The absolute cruelty of this - dd will never understand.

Words fail me.

Basically, he will be paying more under his new system. WTF?

He sounds like he's getting married and doesn't want dd in the way but is using you as the basis to get what he wants. Stay strong, any man can father a child but it takes a true man to be a daddy.

Groovee I think you have hit the nail on the head. But he has been such an attentive, good dad with no hint of this before other than the conversation a couple of months ago. Has he been pretending? I think he has. He has always called me a crap parent and criticised me constantly.

I am shocked beyond words.

She will understand... the truth about her dad. :(

So, don't feel guilty if he does cut contact.
He was going to anyway.

Have you pointed out to him that he is doing it to his daughter, not you, and that you'll be happy to have more of her around?

Your dd will develop more interests in her friends etc, have more homework. Do not let him emotionally blackmail you into backing down.

If he reduces contact that is his choice and your dd will see him in his true colours in the end.

I would still go through the CSA so he can't suddenly stop paying and leave you in the lurch. Do you think he will really give you 15% of his wages or is he still just pretending that he is?

Actually has he been using your dd to show his wife to be what a wonderful doting man he is...

That poor woman

Like my ex.
Keeps calling me a bad mum, but he's the one who cut contact with DS and always calls half an hour late.

Lueji, I have text him back to ask him why he is dropping contact and how he is going to explain it to dd. I have also said that she will be very upset by it.

Random, he has given me very exact figures and I have checked them out on the CSA calculator. They do seem to add up to what I thought he was earning.

Still not going to back down because he was always going to do this anyway wasn't he :(

God yes, that poor woman that he is marrying, although I do think she has something to do with it too.

Lueji, sounds like you have first hand experience too. You know that, no matter what you say or how clear it all looks, you will never get through to them because they are incapable of seeing the truth.

A hard but necessary lesson to learn.

Yep he was.

Does he currently live with his partner and does your DD like her?

Random, he doesn't live with his partner but interestingly, they are getting married in September and moving house. My God it is beginning to make total sense now. I feel sick to my stomach.

Dd does like her thankfully. I don't know where they are moving but I am smelling a rat now.

Sorry, I'm not drip feeding info but realisations are hitting me every minute as i sit here and piece it all together.