sex while asleep

[silver999]

my partner woke me up by having sex with me, I was really shocked at what was happening and not sure what to do or think about what has happened.
I told my friend but she just laughed about it, any advice? thanks.

The legal definition of rape also includes that the man must not reasonably believe that the woman consented. It's a very grey area and within a relationship where consent is often assumed rather than explicitly stated and where consent has been denied on previous occasions (e.g. I'm not in the mood tonight) it's not necessarily unreasonable for a man to assume consent where there is no indication otherwise. That would depend on a whole variety of factors within the relationship.

(I don't know whether the law is as explicit for sexual assault)

Thats the thing, in our house, sex happens, if either partner responds to advances, it goes ahead. If one partner is not up for it straight away, the other may spend some time "persuading" the other partner (i was told my partner was a rapist on a thread once, becuase he will often "persuade" me to have sex. If the other partner really doesn't want to do it, then the other partner accepts this. I don't think consent is every formally established though. After 20 years i think we know each other to know when no means no or no means, well, no, but if you press the right buttons you might change my mind.

It's a totally understandable fear MrGin, and it differs if it's the other way round. For example, if my DH had managed to impregnate me whilst I was sleeping/semi asleep, at the very least I then have the recourse to decide whether I continue with the pregnancy or not, regardless of DH's thoughts on the matter.

In the case of your friend and the OP, they have no choice as to whether the pregnancy continues or not.

Lucy - One of the limitations of the internet is that we only get a rough idea often of what people mean as a typed post does not really give us the background info we need. So persuading would in some situations mean raping i.e. putting someone who has made it clear they don't want sex under a lot of pressure to have sex. So I can understand why if you used the word persuade, some posters may have said you were raped.

I often put my DS to bed when he is asleep.
He is groggy and if I change his clothes to his pjs he is "awake" and groggy.
As will he take medicine, whilst half asleep.

He is obviously not consenting to be put in bed, nor really to have his clothes changed. (unless he really wakes up and tells me that yes I need to change the tops as well. )

I'd think that men knew the difference between a sufficiently woken up partner, enough to give consent, and one who's too groggy to even know what's happening.

And it's not too burdensome, to ask your partner if she wants sex.

Yes Sigmund. I'd predict any conversation on that topic would go thermo nuclear within one page.

What would be the purpose of a 'who has it worse?' thread about victims of sexual assault or rape?

And having read the update , even worse if said sex may mean having an undesired baby.

Yes Pan it does leave me wondering that. And if this isn't real, it does piss me off

So far in this thread we've had

• it's not rape if it's the first time it's happened
• it's not rape if it's a partner
• rape only happens in relationships with pre-existing problems
• it's only rape if someone says no, rather than not saying yes
• he probably enjoyed it anyway

What a lovely reassuring thread this is..

I agree Empusa.

This thread reminds me of the deleted one in AIBU recently, where a woman was repeatedly groped on a night out depite making it clear she was unavailable, and many posters blamed her.

I agree with the poster upthread that there are a lot of myths about sexual assault and rape that need to be addressed somehow. However when it's being laid out in black and white in conversations like this and some posters still fail to understand, for example, what consent is, it's a bit depressing.

True MrG, thermo nuclear (understatement) would just about cover it! It would be an interesting debate without the usual suspects, but the chance of that happening is zero.

Yes it is depressing

Pan I think there are a fair few threads that are questionable in that respect on MN. At least that's my feeling. Is it genuine or an attempt to force debate on a particular issue ? I think one has to take the issue / OP at face value really, especially if it concerns sexual assault.

I've seen too many threads where support turns to suspicion when the poster reveals they're a man not the woman they were assumed to be.

Fair point Mr Gin. I would hate for someone genuine to get a hard time because of unfair suspicions

I agree MrG re taking at face value - it's just difficult to do that when the OP presents the 'face value' so poorly.
and yes it's really sad to see rape myth alive and well and living on MN.

I think this is a (horrifyingly) fascinating thread, because of the issues that it raises, and the way in which some posters have responded.

Suggests that MN has some work to do with its 'I believe you/we believe you' campaign.

No it wouldn't be an 'interesting debate', Sigmund. It would be thoroughly distasteful to use male and female victims of sexual crimes to score points in such a manner.

Do people think then that the legal definition of rape should be altered?

"Under section 1(1) SOA 2003 a defendant, A, is guilty of rape if:

_ A intentionally penetrates the vagina, anus or mouth of B (the complainant) with his penis;

_ B does not consent to the penetration; and,

_ A does not reasonably believe that B consents."

And not include the reasonable belief statement?

silver so sorry for what has happened. What your dp did was bang out of order and sexual assault. If you were my friend and you told me about this I would not laugh .

The reaction of your dp, laughing it off, is horrible.

This would be a dealbreaker for me, as there is no way, given her reaction, that I would ever share a bed with her again.

'No it wouldn't be an 'interesting debate', Sigmund. It would be thoroughly distasteful to use male and female victims of sexual crimes to score points in such a manner.'

Really? Perhaps someone should tell the FWR then.

No. If you're driving at this specific case or similar tyler, it's unreasonable to assume consent if the object of the penetration is unconscious.

The OP said he told his friend who laughed, not his partner.

His partner laughed as well - from the last post of the OP:

"Didn't make it clear in my posts that it was my girlfriend that started sex when I was asleep. I've tried to talk to her about what happened but she just laughs it off"