What to do? (EA? SA?) Legal advice needed as well please - warning, it is extremely long!

[StickorFold]

This is going to be long and warbled, and might not make too much sense, maybe a bit bitty, but will try and put as much as much detail in as I can so I'm not adding to it after.

Firstly, I am an old MN'er, used to be a prolific poster, so it may be that the odd one of you may work out who I am, I would really appreciate it if anyone that suspects just keeps it to themselves please.

Secondly, think it goes against MN rules to have two accounts, though I hope for this one occasion we can over look this, as it is the only way I feel safe enough to get this out and hopefully gain some advice.

Thirdly, I may not be able to reply as ofter as I'd like, but will try my best to get on when I can.

OK, so, background: H and I have been married for 11 and a half years, three children, he is a good, loving dad, he works extremely hard (60hrs a month), he is ace at helping out around the house, he does most of the cooking, involved in bath times/bedtimes (when he is here), he does put the kids first in everything, and that reason, and that reason alone, is the only reason we are still together now.

I also work, of sorts, I have two failed/failing businesses under my belt, and am now working part time while youngest is at nursery and the older two are in school, plus evenings/weekends (17-20 hrs a week). I will be coming back to my 'job' in a bit.

His 13 years older than me, we met when I was 17, moved into a flat together, got engaged, got married, and (planned) DC within 3 months of us meeting. At the time, I thought he really must have loved me, now realise he pushed us both into it, nearly losing my family along the way (didn't speak to my lovely mum for over a year, she missed my eledest's pregnancy/birth/first xmas etc.), I lost all of my friends, he didn't have any as he had moved from a different part of the country to be with me, because he loved me soooo much

He told me about a week before we got married that he had two children, by different women, that were only 5 and 6 years younger than me (the children!). He said he was young and stupid and that he'd never seen either of them, though he did pay a very small amount of CSA (big of him, eh? WHY couldn't I see it at the time? ) I have since found out that actually he did live with the mother of the second child for a while after she was born, but that it didn't work out, so all the 'firsts' we were doing to gether with our first child, weren't actually his firsts at all .

He'd had a long term relationship with someone who he said he never wanted to marry, or have children with, even though she wanted to desperately, he apparently just left her one day, and then met me within 4/5 months and declaired his undying love ("I didn't love her enough, she was nothing like you, didn't I prove that when I married you and not her?")

He had a difficult upbringing, don't want to go into too much detail as I don't feel that would be fair of me, but, very quickly, his mum left him, his older siblings and his dad when H was very young, and by the time he was a young teen, his siblings had all moved out, and his dad had practically moved in with a new lady, H was fending for himself from 14yo.

Over the course of our marriage, I have obviously matured from being a 17yo girl (in essence), and over the last 3-4 years I have come to realise that H is (subtly) EA. He was very controlling over a friendship I had with a girl, to the point where we ended up moving 30 miles away, which was very convieniant for him. And it was the turning point in my mind, I could see as clear as day what was going on, what he was doing to me, and I told him we were over, neither of us could afford to move out, so we carried on staying under the same roof, big mistake, within a month, you'd never know we were going to split. I have now 'lost touch' with my friend, and have no others.

Since then, I have done a fair amount of burying my head in the sand, trying to 'tune in' to when he was preasuring me in any way etc. couple of times I known for sure and talked to him about it, he always wormed his way out of it, and after a few days of uncomfortableness (for me) I'd get over it and it was placed under that very lumpy carpet, with all the rest of the shit.

Throughout the whole time we have been a family, he has always (and I believe will always) love the kids wholely, and properly, there are a couple of very small odd things that have become sticking points over the years (e.g. he insists that when we all eat dinner, we don't cut into a boiled potato (or whatever) and just eat the potato, we also cut a bit of the fish (or whatever!) and eat the fish and potato at the same time, I know that is really odd, but it is just one of the tiny things that sticks in my head) He also can never seem to manage the small things we ask of him, e.g. I have two sugars in my cup of tea, he never ever puts two in, why not?

About two-ish years ago, I got very drunk, with him at home, saturday night, overdid the wine, not a regular occurance. When I woke up in the morning I thought I could remember him having sex with me in the middle of the night, I asked him and he denied it, I questioned myself (was I that drunk/dreaming?) but (sorry for TMI) I found the 'evidence' as I went to the bathroom, if you follow my drift? So I knew he had, I thought maybe he was drunk as well and couldn't remember. Wrote it off as a strange night.

Since then I have woken up to feeling him ejaculating on me, or wiping me with his t-shirt after he has ejaculated on me, or woken up just as he has tried to actually put his willy in me, sometimes I have asked him what the bloody hell he thinks he's doing, sometimes I just pretend I'm still asleep. Any time I bring it up, I apparently should feel lucky that he still wants me after so long, and after the children, and if I was more willing he wouldn't have to resort to these measures. Now I am the first one to admit, our sex life has suffered over the years, we tend to go in spits and spats, sometimes it can be two or three weeks, sometimes 5 or 6 times a week, no pattern to it, sometimes it is when I am most angry/hurt that we have more sex, not sure if that is me trying to regain some control?

Money has always been a problem, we've never seemed to have enough(!) (though TBF we have never been as tight as it is right now, now we are struggling for food at times, whereas, whilst there might not have been much left over 12 months ago, there was some) I was a SAHM until 2 years ago, I have tried and failed two different businesses (trying to work around child care etc.) neither of which had big outlays, but both of which really needed money for advertising that we just didn't/haven't got.

H point blank refused for me to get a part-time evening job, either in a bar/shop/etc. Saying that we'd never see each other, I'd miss the kid's bedtimes etc. But we were desperate for money. That stupid bloody program came on the telly about the phone sex line girls, H jumped on it, said it was be perfect for me, I could do it while the kids were out, and maybe some evenings to get extra money in, and that it might open my mind a bit and give us a boost in our sex lives. So for the past 4 weeks I have spent many evenings, in and out of the garage conversion, to deal with bedtimes etc. while trying to take/dodge calls from people. He will say things like "Did you touch yourself for any of them?" "Have you made much on your wank line?" "Oooo, bet you're all turned on now, talking to those other men". He sits in the living room watching the phone to know exactly when I'm on the phone and when I'm not, watching porn, sending me pictures of his errect penis over a photo of me, sending videos of himself wanking over pictures of me on the laptop etc. This is all supposed to get me in the mood... and and .

So, after a shit week last week, and having made some extra money, I went and bought us some wine on Saturday, I drank nearly two bottles (again, I like wine, but not usually that much!) H actually poured the last glass of the second bottle but I said I'd had enough and was going to bed, we had sex and I went to sleep. Next thing I remember waking up, he was on top of me, having sex with me, my legs were closed underneath him, he was completely squashing me, I was whimpering, actually whimpering (makes my bloody boil when I think how I was), I was saying no, ow, no, but strangely, I wasn't screaming and shouting it, or trying to move away or anything, I was just a pathetic whimpering heap, why didn't I try to stop him? He ejeculated in me and gave me an extra tight squeeze, and rolled off me. I asked him why he just carried on when I was saying no, and he said he thought I was moaning in pleasure He asked if we were ok, I said yes, rolled over and went to sleep.

He spent Sunday morning walking on egg shells, being extra nice, I didn't say a word about it and just acted normal, thinking I needed time to work out what I was going to do, and it was best to keep my cards to my chest as it were.

Yesturday we got into bed, he asked, actually asked, out of the blue, "can I cum on you?" I said no in a lighttone and pointed to the bathroom, he seemed to shrug it off, gave me a kiss on my cheek, turned over and started to fall asleep, I turned over and led there with my eyes open, he obviously presumed I was asleep, he started wanking, I purposefully moved to see what he would do, he just carried straight on, I heard/felt him get his t-shirt to clean up (it is always his t-shirts) and then he was asleep, I came downstairs and cried. He has absolutely no respect for me, I think the porn thing is playing a part in this, he never (seemed to) used it before a couple of years ago, and slowly but steadily, he has been using it more, and in the same time frame I am becoming more and more of his object to do with as he pleases, when he pleases.

So, for anyone that has got this far (and bloody well done if you did!) firstly, am I being unfair on the kids to take them away from their dad when he is brilliant with them? They love him to bits, it will break their hearts and I don't want to risk being the cause of the that.

Secondly, we rent our house (both names on tenancy), he owns the car but I drive it 99% of the time, we have no savings etc. My mum lives 200 miles away and it is the only place I could go. The only way I can get away from him, with some money in my pocket to get us there and a means of getting us there is if when he next get's paid (last working day of each month) to move some money from our joint account to my own, (this will leave bills here unpaid), take the car, pack up everything I can get in it, and take the kids and I to my mums. He will know exactly where I am, I'm not scared of him, but the fact I have cut all ties (except the kids obv.), will show him that we are over. He will hate it, he will hate me for doing it, but he will calm down fairly quickly, and realise he's pushed it too far, for the sake of seeing the kids.

Would I be facing any legal repercussions in taking the car/money? I just dont know how else to do it.

Right, this is humongous, I am sure I still haven't given all the details, but I really just wanted to get as much as I could down. Thanks to anyone who has made it to the end, and if anyone has any advice, I am all eyes ears.

And yes, of course the thing to do is to get out of the situation don't worry, i didn't think you thought differently to this.

i just find/found it disturbing that you would say "well you know he's not hitting you" and then tell her to tell him what she's planning. when being raped is just as violent and serious, if not more under some circumstances, then being hit.

when you are suffering violent abuse, it's absolutely insane to tell the abuser you're planning to leave. that's how women end up being murdered by their partners.

leaving without a word is actually the safer option. i understand the impulse to want to minimise fear by defusing the situation (by telling him/talking to him) but that is utter fantasy. there is no reasoning with a violent criminal. the safest thing to do is disappear.

i think telling the op to do the opposite is dangerously naive tbh

^ that was addressed to ImperialBlether btw

Wow, lot's of food for thought.

IB, I understand exactly where you're coming from, but when I read your post, shivers went up my spine. There is no talking to him, honestly, somewhere between the tears he would have flowing and all of the "I have no one else" "don't take them away from me" the odd bit of "it's alright for you, you get to keep them" thrown in (why can I only see now that that is such a ridiculous thing to say?!) I wouldn't get more than a little toe out of the door.

Re. the chat line, I will at the very least be stopping it in the short term, when we are more settled, I may go back to it, as said it actually isn't as bad as it sounds, the hours fit in around child care, the money is fairly crap actually, but £70-ish a week for 16/17 hours is better than anything else I could get. That will be a wait and see I think. It is actually quite good knowing I can have a job, and at least not have to solely rely on the state.

I don't know what to do about something else. The car tax, spoke to H last night about it, just saying that he'd have to get it sorted on Monday (when he get's paid) I assumed he'd go to the PO, but now he is saying he is going to do it on line to save him having to dig out the paperwork or something (I don't know, I have never done it, so don't know what's involved) I said but if you do it on line, you'll not get the actual disk until after the 1st, and he said it's OK, it will still be taxed on the computer, and it'll only 4/5 days to come through the post. I am planning to be gone by then, if I stay and wait for the disk, then the bills will be late out and he'll know I've moved the money. I don't know what to do? How bad is it to not have the tax disk on display, even though it is taxed?

That is one strange thing about him actually, he used to be a policeman (sort of) he did around about the two years training, something happened re. his boss made him stop and charge a friend of H's for something, but then the same boss overlooked someone he knew that had done something wrong, but he has also mentioned lots about how prostitutes can say anything while they are in police custody, how she could say that one of the police had attacked her, and that the force always had to reprimand the officer until it was proven otherwise, he was taken to court about something that happened, though I am guessing whatever it was was thrown out, I don't think he has a criminal record, he had to have it checked for work purposes and it was OK? But something deffo happened. He is also a stickler for the law, he would never ever dream of taking the car out with no ins. but then will speed (like a nutter!) and use his phone while driving with no problem. It's like he has decided what is breaking the law and what isn't?

Sorry, am waffling, am trying to remember things over the years, trying but failing to understand why/how I have managed to get my 3 gorgeous boys caught up in all of this.

Your last paragraph is very revealing where you say you think he decides, in his own mind, what constitutes breaking the law and what doesn't. Get away from him as soon as possible, he's violent. Good luck, stay strong and keep posting.

The car tax can be sorted later. For gods sale don't stay around for a tax disc.

So prostitutes lie about what the police do to them in custody and he got sacked from being a probationer did he? I can add those together quite easily.

What a creep. Run like the wind.

The car tax and all those bill issues and anything else can be sorted later. There is no need to stay physically in the house because your name is on the council tax! You could go to your mum's and pay it from there. Or anything.

You've spent nearly half your life being groomed and controlled by this deeply dodgy person. It's going to feel a bit weird at first being able to make your own choices. Only when you have been doing it for a while will you start to realise just how much you were his puppet instead of an independent human being. And just how fabulous it is to be the latter.

Damn, just lost a post again.

I don't actually know how/why he left the police, I don't know if he was sacked, asked to go, left of his own accord, I have no idea.

I'm not worried about the bills, they won't be paid on time, but I will catch up and sort it all after somehow. The car tax, I am not staying to wait for it, who knows he might even send it on to me to show how reasonable he is being?!! What I do need to know is what trouble I can get into for failing to display a current one?

Next thing, my lovely sister and her lovely husband (the BIL I mentioned earlier), they would do anything to help, I know this. But do I get them involved? H involved them last time we split, my BIL had H ring him in tears, H rang my sister and told her I had a drink problem(!!) all bollocks, just his way of putting me in the firing line I guess?

Thing is I don't know how to tell her? She does read MN from time to time, should I point her to this thread? Do I completely leave them out of it, i.e. the less anyone knows the less he can do to do whatever he is going to do? Of which I am getting more and more worried about. Do I need to get out on my own to 'prove' to myself I am capable? But if it goes wrong, I'm on my own.

I am worried because I have told out right lies to everyone over the years to save his arse, to cover for reasons why we are doing stupid things (e.g. when he stopped paying the mortgage on our old house, near my friend, so we had to move here, I told everyone we'd stopped paying it to save the money to move.) Will they understand that even though it was me saying those things, that he was actually the one making my mouth move and making the noise that came out? Oh, there are so many things that need to be unraveled.

I'm not sure I even know the truth of what's gone on in my life for 11+ years.

I think you'd be surprised how much of his bullshit people have seen through, bit said nothing to keep the peace out of concern for you. If your sister and bil are a source of potential support, take that support. You don't have to go this alone.

I don't think they have seen through him, my mum descibes him as the a fantastic dad, my sister and BIL came to stay with us about a month or so ago, for the first time in ages, they went back and told mum how happy a family we were and how they loved being here, and have since mentioned coming back to see us poss on the bank holiday at the beginning of May. I'm not blaming them for that, we put on a bloody good show, had lots of practise!

The only one that saw him for what he is is my friend, she is the only person that came to our house, socialised with us, heard/saw the difference in me to when he was home or when he was at work. She used to say when we first got to know each other how romantic H and I were, how we did a whole love story, fell in love at first sight, knew we were meant to be, planned all of the children, lived as a whole happy family, by the time I had to cut her off, she couldn't stand him.

I think I am going to text my sister and ask her to find this thread. I don't know if I can say it all out loud to someone yet, if I do and it really hits home, I don't know if I'll be able to keep the pretence up to H till next week, and I can't risk him even getting a hint something is happening.

Wish I was a bloody alcoholic, might be able to get the courage up to send a bloody text!!

A man as vile as this is obvious to a lot of people. They will have felt uneasy about him (and concerned for you) for a long time. Once you get away and start telling people what's been happening, person after person will say stuff like 'I knew there was something funny about him*. Or, I'm afraid, they may disclose that he has raped or abused other people too, which seems extremely likely.

People tend not to want to act when they suspect abuse because they don't know the best way to help, and it's sadly true that abused women who are not yet ready to leave will either deny that abuse is taking place or minimize it. It doesn't mean that people don't know and don't care, if they say nothing until you tell them yourself.

Stay strong. You can get away.

Well, that's just it, there is no one to tell, other than family, there is no one else. We live in a different part of the country to my family, 45 mins drive to his closest family, we have no friends, we don't go out, barring school runs and the odd nip to the shop for milk etc. the last time I went anywhere was the weekend before last, H's nephew's bday party, before that... no idea? Aside from the chat lines, my sister and mum (once a week, when I'm allowed!), the last time I had a conversation, a proper one not just a 'hello', would have been at his nephew's party, before that, probably at the beginning of March, t'was the last time I had anything to do with anyone to do with my failed business no.1.

OK, am going to send a text. This is it isn't it? The First Step. Once I do this everything starts. No going back.

Stick, I have just read this thread and it makes a very chilling read. This 'man' does not love you or your children, he doesn't view you as individuals or a person in your own right he sees you all as his possessions, as objects :(

This friend he made you cut contact with, does she live far away? Could you contact her again? She will very likely be there for you, she is just waiting for you to be ready.

Hope you have sent the text. You can do this, you can get away.

Do it. Do it now.

I've sent it, she is probably reading this right now (Hello?! I have my very own 'Leave the Bastard' thread!! ) she has already done more than enough, just by knowing and not ringing me!! (xxx)

I can't get my friend involved, she has enough to deal with her husband, no wonder we were so bloody drawn to each other!

Right, The Second Step: stop the bank stuff, this is where it could get 'iffy', if he smells a rat, it's all over.

Oh dear lord, the abuse and isolation of you just gets worse and worse love. Be brave, you have to do this, either with or without help.

If without, let US help you, just say what you need and we'll try to make it happen, OK?

You have to get away from him, seriously

I've been thinking of you.

I'm sorry I don't have much practical advice for you, but I think your plan sounds like the safest way out, and I am rooting for you.

Well done on texting your Dsis, you're on the way now. Good luck with the bank stuff today.

It's OK, I have just gone to cancel the first one, it says as long as they receive the instruction before 5.30 the day before the payment will be stopped, so I can do all of that on Monday, and hopefully he won't have had any phone calls/texts about it until at least Tuesday, by then we'll be gone.

OK so, The Second Step (revised) is: I have no bloody idea!

Sorry, reading posts and they're just not going in, thank you for the offer of help, I think I am OK, now I don't have to risk the bank stuff, everything can be normal.

As long as I get out of here with the kids, it will all be OK won't it? Anything else is by the by really.

Get all paper work that you need into locations where you can simply pick it up and run. Not necessarily obviously, but so you're organised.

Work out a list of the things that you're going to take. Things that really matter - irreplaceable things that remind you of good times, photos of the children when babies etc. Get photos off any computer onto something you can take with you - or google+ or something similar. Sort out a new email address if necessary to do this - one that only you will know.

Work out essential packing for the children - again, things that are irreplaceable for them.

Put petrol in the car.

You need to be able to get things together in as little time as possible and go.

StickorFold. Good luck.

I identify with so much of what you have posted. Get away from him. As quickly and safely as you can. Please.

I was abused and controlled for 18 years. I was lucky to keep my home. My ex went from our family home, to a rented house, and now he's living God knows where and rarely sees his kids. Do I give a fuck? No. Not anymore.

You've had some cracking advice on this thread.

I would add, on the school issue. I was told that even though we were divorced and my ex-husband had been in trouble with the police and had severe mental health issues, there was nothing I could do to stop him picking the children up from school if he turned up. I would have to go to court and get his Parental Rights revoked before they could officially refuse to let him take the children.

I went into school, talked to the Head and it was agreed that IF he ever did try to pick the children up, they would stall him and ring me. I also have had to tell my children that "if Daddy ever comes to pick you up, you go back into the classroom and tell the Teacher to ring Mummy". Having to tell my children not to leave with Daddy is hard, but necessary.

Thankfully that's never happened so far because he's a selfish prick that is probably wanking over his porn collection constantly instead. Oh, and he also told everyone I was an alcoholic so you're not alone in that respect.

It'll be rough for a while but it's do-able. Really, it is.

It's not quite getting PR revoked, it's a prohibited steps order you need to prevent an abusive parent from picking up Dcs from school. It can be done.

In fact op when you are getting the non molestation order sorted a prohibited steps would be a good idea too.

Well, I've got all day tomorrow (well school hours) on my own, and the same on Monday, also can do the paperwork shuffling while I'm in the garage.

The kids will be fine with their laptops/phone/iPad etc. the little ones will want some of the Cars and Thomas Tank toys.

I will fill the car up on the way out of the village on Tuesday, if I do it before he may see the money go out of the bank, and we don't usually pay for fuel (work perk!).

Am hoping to be able to get everything sorted Monday, then Tuesday, move the money, pack the clothes, put everything in the car, fill it up, and leave.

Am I dreaming to think he might well turn out to be reasonable about it all? He might hold his hands up, say he's sorry, let me come and get more things when we've got somewhere to live, help us sort where we go from here (obviously not together). Would I be able to trust him if he did?

FlyingFig - hippy was referring to post 50something from Adelaide Aussie about the diagram.
while i'm talking about that adelaide - it means that if the man rejects the woman's advances, or withholds sex as a form of control or punishment.
regardless of whether the man wants sex- if the woman's offering it, he says no. usually because of excuses like she's too fat, or ugly, or he doesn't fancy her. It can be just as dangerous as forcing sex.

It's highly unlikely he's going to be reasonable. And if you return to get more stuff, bring your bil or another bloke. I know some on this board get annoyed by suggestions of a woman needing a male protector, but in that situation I think it is best.

you won't be "done" for not having the correct disc on display.

if you are worried about that, as soon as you get to your mum's ring the DVLA and tell them that you've changed address and want the disc to be sent to a different address.
Not your mum's though if he doesn't know it, best to keep that from him for a while.

It's logged on their database that it's paid, and it can't be used on another car, so if it comes to it and you don't get it, you can ask them to send you a replacement.