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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

What to do? (EA? SA?) Legal advice needed as well please - warning, it is extremely long!

493 replies

StickorFold · 25/04/2012 10:57

This is going to be long and warbled, and might not make too much sense, maybe a bit bitty, but will try and put as much as much detail in as I can so I'm not adding to it after.

Firstly, I am an old MN'er, used to be a prolific poster, so it may be that the odd one of you may work out who I am, I would really appreciate it if anyone that suspects just keeps it to themselves please.

Secondly, think it goes against MN rules to have two accounts, though I hope for this one occasion we can over look this, as it is the only way I feel safe enough to get this out and hopefully gain some advice.

Thirdly, I may not be able to reply as ofter as I'd like, but will try my best to get on when I can.

OK, so, background: H and I have been married for 11 and a half years, three children, he is a good, loving dad, he works extremely hard (60hrs a month), he is ace at helping out around the house, he does most of the cooking, involved in bath times/bedtimes (when he is here), he does put the kids first in everything, and that reason, and that reason alone, is the only reason we are still together now.

I also work, of sorts, I have two failed/failing businesses under my belt, and am now working part time while youngest is at nursery and the older two are in school, plus evenings/weekends (17-20 hrs a week). I will be coming back to my 'job' in a bit.

His 13 years older than me, we met when I was 17, moved into a flat together, got engaged, got married, and (planned) DC within 3 months of us meeting. At the time, I thought he really must have loved me, now realise he pushed us both into it, nearly losing my family along the way (didn't speak to my lovely mum for over a year, she missed my eledest's pregnancy/birth/first xmas etc.), I lost all of my friends, he didn't have any as he had moved from a different part of the country to be with me, because he loved me soooo much Hmm

He told me about a week before we got married that he had two children, by different women, that were only 5 and 6 years younger than me (the children!). He said he was young and stupid and that he'd never seen either of them, though he did pay a very small amount of CSA (big of him, eh? WHY couldn't I see it at the time? Angry) I have since found out that actually he did live with the mother of the second child for a while after she was born, but that it didn't work out, so all the 'firsts' we were doing to gether with our first child, weren't actually his firsts at all Sad.

He'd had a long term relationship with someone who he said he never wanted to marry, or have children with, even though she wanted to desperately, he apparently just left her one day, and then met me within 4/5 months and declaired his undying love ("I didn't love her enough, she was nothing like you, didn't I prove that when I married you and not her?")

He had a difficult upbringing, don't want to go into too much detail as I don't feel that would be fair of me, but, very quickly, his mum left him, his older siblings and his dad when H was very young, and by the time he was a young teen, his siblings had all moved out, and his dad had practically moved in with a new lady, H was fending for himself from 14yo.

Over the course of our marriage, I have obviously matured from being a 17yo girl (in essence), and over the last 3-4 years I have come to realise that H is (subtly) EA. He was very controlling over a friendship I had with a girl, to the point where we ended up moving 30 miles away, which was very convieniant for him. And it was the turning point in my mind, I could see as clear as day what was going on, what he was doing to me, and I told him we were over, neither of us could afford to move out, so we carried on staying under the same roof, big mistake, within a month, you'd never know we were going to split. I have now 'lost touch' with my friend, and have no others.

Since then, I have done a fair amount of burying my head in the sand, trying to 'tune in' to when he was preasuring me in any way etc. couple of times I known for sure and talked to him about it, he always wormed his way out of it, and after a few days of uncomfortableness (for me) I'd get over it and it was placed under that very lumpy carpet, with all the rest of the shit.

Throughout the whole time we have been a family, he has always (and I believe will always) love the kids wholely, and properly, there are a couple of very small odd things that have become sticking points over the years (e.g. he insists that when we all eat dinner, we don't cut into a boiled potato (or whatever) and just eat the potato, we also cut a bit of the fish (or whatever!) and eat the fish and potato at the same time, I know that is really odd, but it is just one of the tiny things that sticks in my head) He also can never seem to manage the small things we ask of him, e.g. I have two sugars in my cup of tea, he never ever puts two in, why not? Hmm

About two-ish years ago, I got very drunk, with him at home, saturday night, overdid the wine, not a regular occurance. When I woke up in the morning I thought I could remember him having sex with me in the middle of the night, I asked him and he denied it, I questioned myself (was I that drunk/dreaming?) but (sorry for TMI) I found the 'evidence' as I went to the bathroom, if you follow my drift? So I knew he had, I thought maybe he was drunk as well and couldn't remember. Wrote it off as a strange night.

Since then I have woken up to feeling him ejaculating on me, or wiping me with his t-shirt after he has ejaculated on me, or woken up just as he has tried to actually put his willy in me, sometimes I have asked him what the bloody hell he thinks he's doing, sometimes I just pretend I'm still asleep. Any time I bring it up, I apparently should feel lucky that he still wants me after so long, and after the children, and if I was more willing he wouldn't have to resort to these measures. Now I am the first one to admit, our sex life has suffered over the years, we tend to go in spits and spats, sometimes it can be two or three weeks, sometimes 5 or 6 times a week, no pattern to it, sometimes it is when I am most angry/hurt that we have more sex, not sure if that is me trying to regain some control?

Money has always been a problem, we've never seemed to have enough(!) (though TBF we have never been as tight as it is right now, now we are struggling for food at times, whereas, whilst there might not have been much left over 12 months ago, there was some) I was a SAHM until 2 years ago, I have tried and failed two different businesses (trying to work around child care etc.) neither of which had big outlays, but both of which really needed money for advertising that we just didn't/haven't got.

H point blank refused for me to get a part-time evening job, either in a bar/shop/etc. Saying that we'd never see each other, I'd miss the kid's bedtimes etc. But we were desperate for money. That stupid bloody program came on the telly about the phone sex line girls, H jumped on it, said it was be perfect for me, I could do it while the kids were out, and maybe some evenings to get extra money in, and that it might open my mind a bit and give us a boost in our sex lives. So for the past 4 weeks I have spent many evenings, in and out of the garage conversion, to deal with bedtimes etc. while trying to take/dodge calls from people. He will say things like "Did you touch yourself for any of them?" "Have you made much on your wank line?" "Oooo, bet you're all turned on now, talking to those other men". He sits in the living room watching the phone to know exactly when I'm on the phone and when I'm not, watching porn, sending me pictures of his errect penis over a photo of me, sending videos of himself wanking over pictures of me on the laptop etc. This is all supposed to get me in the mood... Hmm and Sad and Angry.

So, after a shit week last week, and having made some extra money, I went and bought us some wine on Saturday, I drank nearly two bottles (again, I like wine, but not usually that much!) H actually poured the last glass of the second bottle but I said I'd had enough and was going to bed, we had sex and I went to sleep. Next thing I remember waking up, he was on top of me, having sex with me, my legs were closed underneath him, he was completely squashing me, I was whimpering, actually whimpering (makes my bloody boil when I think how I was), I was saying no, ow, no, but strangely, I wasn't screaming and shouting it, or trying to move away or anything, I was just a pathetic whimpering heap, why didn't I try to stop him? He ejeculated in me and gave me an extra tight squeeze, and rolled off me. I asked him why he just carried on when I was saying no, and he said he thought I was moaning in pleasure Hmm He asked if we were ok, I said yes, rolled over and went to sleep.

He spent Sunday morning walking on egg shells, being extra nice, I didn't say a word about it and just acted normal, thinking I needed time to work out what I was going to do, and it was best to keep my cards to my chest as it were.

Yesturday we got into bed, he asked, actually asked, out of the blue, "can I cum on you?" I said no in a lighttone and pointed to the bathroom, he seemed to shrug it off, gave me a kiss on my cheek, turned over and started to fall asleep, I turned over and led there with my eyes open, he obviously presumed I was asleep, he started wanking, I purposefully moved to see what he would do, he just carried straight on, I heard/felt him get his t-shirt to clean up (it is always his t-shirts) and then he was asleep, I came downstairs and cried. He has absolutely no respect for me, I think the porn thing is playing a part in this, he never (seemed to) used it before a couple of years ago, and slowly but steadily, he has been using it more, and in the same time frame I am becoming more and more of his object to do with as he pleases, when he pleases.

So, for anyone that has got this far (and bloody well done if you did!) firstly, am I being unfair on the kids to take them away from their dad when he is brilliant with them? They love him to bits, it will break their hearts and I don't want to risk being the cause of the that.

Secondly, we rent our house (both names on tenancy), he owns the car but I drive it 99% of the time, we have no savings etc. My mum lives 200 miles away and it is the only place I could go. The only way I can get away from him, with some money in my pocket to get us there and a means of getting us there is if when he next get's paid (last working day of each month) to move some money from our joint account to my own, (this will leave bills here unpaid), take the car, pack up everything I can get in it, and take the kids and I to my mums. He will know exactly where I am, I'm not scared of him, but the fact I have cut all ties (except the kids obv.), will show him that we are over. He will hate it, he will hate me for doing it, but he will calm down fairly quickly, and realise he's pushed it too far, for the sake of seeing the kids.

Would I be facing any legal repercussions in taking the car/money? I just dont know how else to do it.

Right, this is humongous, I am sure I still haven't given all the details, but I really just wanted to get as much as I could down. Thanks to anyone who has made it to the end, and if anyone has any advice, I am all eyes ears.

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StickorFold · 26/04/2012 14:37

I tried to go last time, and look what happened, still here.

I have no idea how he is going to react, part of me thinks he will 'behave' to show everyone he isn't like that, and to be able to see the kids, part of me thinks he is going to fly off the handle and I don't know what that means.

Why can't the child have both? The toy and the normal mum? I'm not making excuses, I am trying to plan for all eventualities, I know on Tuesday, one way or the other we're leaving, it is what happens after that I am trying to predict and hopefully avoid the worst of, for all of us.

I am going to wobble, the guilt is a big player in that, and is something I am just going to have to deal with, but I need to know my plan is at least worth a shot at, if I do all of this and something happens and he finds out either before Tuesday, or he catches us up before we get to mum's, I will cave. I'm not stronger than him, physically, emotionally, mentally, in no way. And who knows how things would change when we came home? I can't risk that, which ever way the plan goes, it has to work. Keeping him out of the know for as long as poss on Tuesday is a big part of that.

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ExitPursuedByABear · 26/04/2012 14:41

Could your sister drive to meet you on the way to your Mum's?

StickorFold · 26/04/2012 14:42

I couldn't leave my mum to handle him possibly turning up on her own. And he is deffo the sort that would search every hotel up and down the motorway for the car. He doesn't know her address, but he knows roughly where it is, he'd only have to go to my (other) sister's and follow her around for a day and she would lead him straight to my mums.

In fact wouldnt put it past him to ring the police and report the car as stolen, or even have some secret tracking device on my phone, or on DS's! I am being deadly serious about that BTW!

If he did ring the police, and they found me, what would happen then?

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BadLieutenent · 26/04/2012 14:43

Do you have to put in the note that you are going to your mum's? If you say that Women's Aid are housing you temporarily, and you won't know where, then that might put him off the scent until you feel safe at your mum's?

StickorFold · 26/04/2012 14:44

She could, a would, but not much point really. Besides, I feel like I do need to do the actual getting away bit on my own, to prove myself to me.

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StickorFold · 26/04/2012 14:46

I had already thought of telling him that, but i think he'd still call my bluff on it. And besides, when he speaks to the kids they will tell him they're at Nana's.

Right, time for school run. Again, thanks everyone, it really is helping me, if only just to get some of the thoughts out of my head (though now worried about the police!)

OP posts:
ExitPursuedByABear · 26/04/2012 14:47

You are allowed to leave your husband. Be strong.

BadLieutenent · 26/04/2012 14:50

They can tell him where you really are once you are there- I'm just wondering if you say it's WA in the note and then don't answer your mobile en route...what type do you have btw? If it is an iPhone, check that it doesn't have Find My IPhone or similar installed, because he will be able to track your whereabouts with it. Same thing goes for the kids.

sugarice · 26/04/2012 14:54

You are fab and being so strong. Keep thinking of yourself and the kids and the good times to come without him controlling you. Don't let any fear hold you back. Lots and lots of luck Smile

MooncupGoddess · 26/04/2012 15:00

Why do you have to leave a note at all?

Can you speak to him as normal just after 9 with the kids in another room so he can't hear them, and jump in the car then? You'll have three hours' start that way - more, by the time he's got home, wondered where you are and set out after you.

BadLieutenent · 26/04/2012 15:07

Yes, if you leave a note, you could put it somewhere not immediately obvious, and just tell him where it is after you've spoken to him from your mum's house.

mistlethrush · 26/04/2012 15:22

I would ring 101, explain your situation and that you are fearful that he will chase you and track you down and report the car stolen etc. This will not be a lie - you are clearly terrified of this happening. If you don't feel able to do this, perhaps your sister would to get some advice for you, perhaps once you feel he's on his way tracking you down, a call can be put out to stop him if he's speeding?

I would ring him from the garage on Tuesday morning, with children in the house. Leave immeidately afterwards. Then you can call from your mobile at lunchtime.

TheProvincialLady · 26/04/2012 15:26

I don't know if you are ready for this but you have the option to ring the police right now and tell them you have been raped by your husband. I think I am correct in saying that you will be asked to make a statement and then he will be arrested. That will not only give you time to get out of the house (while he is in custody), it will also give you police protection and backup while you go and when you are gone. It will make applying for the various prohibition orders etc easier. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

What is the worst thing that could happen if he DID catch up with you and you were in the car? Make a plan for what you will do. Personally I would drive to a public place, keep the doors locked and dial 999. Do not get out of the car, no matter how hard or if the children are crying etc.

nickelhasababy · 26/04/2012 15:29

a thought - do you do your sex talk stuff at home on the home phone?

if you do, take the phone off the hook and leave it off.
it'll sound engaged to him if he rings
then text him to say "lots of work today, text instead of calling!"

nickelhasababy · 26/04/2012 15:30

then you can leave whenever you want.

mumofkyle · 26/04/2012 15:41

We can worry about the material things at a later date. We can go up in a van and clear everything out, as long as they have their main things they will be fine. There will be plenty to keep them busy. The toys aren't important at the moment.

I really do think it's best to leave as early as possible, as I said we can come up in one car and follow you down or I can drive yours - whatever would help, it's a long journey. I could even meet you half way if you want to actually leave on your own. You only need to ask, you know we will both be there in a flash.

nickelhasababy · 26/04/2012 15:53

i agree - go as soon as school starts

solidgoldbrass · 26/04/2012 16:08

It's definitely a good idea to speak to the police DV unit before you go, to say that you are frightened he will come after you, that you are leaving him because he has repeatedly raped you and there is severe ongoing abuse in your house. You have every right to leave him and never see him again. EVER. You can get a court order banning him from coming anywhere near you. All contact between him and DC can be arranged via a solicitor and take place in a contact centre under supervision.
This man targetted and groomed you when you were still pretty much a child yourself and has abused you for years. He likes abusing people weaker than himself and he is a danger to your boys; even if he doesn;t progress to sexual abuse of them he is already emotionally abusing them. Best of luck with your escape. It can be done.

StickorFold · 26/04/2012 16:16

Thanks MoK, I know you would be there x (It is so strange talking to someone I know in RL on here!)

I will be leaving as early as poss, that is a given, but I need to get a story straight in my head, as pointed out, liars can sniff liars out, so it needs to be in my head and ready to come out naturally. I think I might tell him (at 9, when he rings) that I'll ring him before I go to nursery, and that I'm going to take DS3 for a McDonalds in the next town. But then just text before 12 instead of ringing and say I'm flying out of the door, and I'll ring him when we get back from McD's. That'll give me till around 2-ish before he starts questioning why I've not rang, hopefully by then I'll be well on the way. Am hoping to leave at the very latest of 11, I should think we'll be ready for 9/9.30 with any luck.

No, not police, certainly not yet. It might be an idea to do the 101 thing tell them I am leaving and he might get 'nasty', give them his reg and the route and to ask if they could at least keep an eye out for him, that should at least cover me for if H rings them to report the car or something, even if they don't actually look for him IYKWIM? I think until I know how he is going to react, I am not even going to think about police etc.

The other thing that keeps going through my mind: He works all over the north-west, wouldn't it be just my luck for him to see us on the motorway before he is even due a phone call! There is absolutely nothing I can do about that, and the chances are slim, but my god, could you imagine it?!

OP posts:
StickorFold · 26/04/2012 16:28

Sorry, the note, I want to leave a note to give him the chance to do the right thing, to tell him what ever it is I decide to tell the kids, to tell him that I don't want him to follow us imediately, to tell him I'm not (at least in the first instance) going to stop him seeing them etc. basically that he can either accept it, or not. And, I know I shouldn't, but I still can't get over the picture of him in my head when he realises that we have gone, a note has to at least give him something to do with himself, to keep reading it, or give him some idea of what happens next, I would need something, else I really wouldn't know what to do.

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OxfordBags · 26/04/2012 16:31

Sweetheart, if you needed any further proof that this man is a minster you must leave immediately, then just reread how you're freaking out about his reaction when you leave and how you're trying to minimise how bad he'll be, you're scared to let anyone else have dealings with him, you think he might already have spy stuff ongoing. The fact you know all this shows you know he is a monster. A woman leaving a normal man because the relationship has broken down doesn't even consider any of these things. And a genuinely good father would not even dream of reacting in the ways you outline. Not in a million years. If he does act like this way, it's not proof of his love and devotion, it's proof that he is enraged and terrified that his chattel (you, his family) have dared to think and act autonomously.

Your sister is a star, don't be afraid to let her help you in every way she can.

OxfordBags · 26/04/2012 16:34

PS A vile pig rapist like him doesn't deserve you doing the 'right thing'. The note might also might give him false hope or seem like taunting him. Just leave. Stop overthinking the minutiae (I know it's hard when years of abuse have let you having to analyse every tiny thing to try to minimise or ward off further abuse) and for heaven's sake, stop worrying about him! He does not deserve it.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 26/04/2012 16:38

I would not leave him any such note. He will not do the "right thing" by you, why change the habits of a lifetime?.

He suckered you in good and proper when you were much younger and impressionable. He controlled you from the very outset and continues to do so as well.

I would certainly talk to the police prior to your leaving as well.

And as for guilt - well sod feeling guilty. Do you think he feels guilty, not a bit of it. He shows no remorse or compassion.

Your sister is indeed a star.

StickorFold · 26/04/2012 16:44

Do you know what, I am actually as stubborn as an ox (family trait Wink), and there is a little bit of me that actually doesn't want to leave like this because he has always said I would end up leaving him like this, and of course I always promised him I wouldn't! Now I feel like he's right again - my head is completely messed up!

Maybe I should just text him when I get to mum's? Think I might buy a PAYG sim for my phone and use that, only put mine back in when I am needing to talk to him for whatever reason? Having said that, he'll know mum's number because it will be on the bill. If he can't contact me on my phone, he'll only keep ringing hers.

I can't stop/help worrying about him, I have been with him my whole adult life, the fact that he is such a big part of me is exactly what's taking me away, but the fact remains, he is still a part of me, of who I am. It's not going to make me stay, but yes, the thought of that moment when he realises, it hurts, physically.

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StickorFold · 26/04/2012 16:48

Sorry x posts - yes she is a star, the best Grin

I'm sure he doesn't feel guilty. I hope I have more empathy for others than he ever has.

And his family, his mum and 3 of his siblings won't give much of a toss, but his sister and I have grown quite close to each other in recent years. The kids adore her. How does that all work? Will he ever realise what he has done?

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