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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships number *8*

999 replies

foolonthehill · 12/04/2012 09:54

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

If you find that he really wants to change

I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

OP posts:
Amitolamummy · 27/05/2012 08:10

Thanks for the welcome Fingers :)

Its sad how many people need this thread and more sad that society as a whole doesn't recognise the damage these miserable arseholes cause.

There were lots of signs at the beginning of my relationship but I was vulnerable as I had just reported my childhood abuse to the police, changed my entire life, come out of a breakdown and had my entire family and closest friends turn on me (due to reporting the abuse)

He was all over me in public, to the point it was embarrassing. He took over when I cooked a meal, without even asking and criticised the way I chopped vegetables. He constantly commented on my clothes under the pretence of 'just being honest' so I ended up changing what I wore and losing all my confidence. I once studied fashion and was very confident with clothes but the constant shopping trips and comments, backed up my his female friend agreeing with him, wore m down.
He would be far more respectful to me if I looked nice. He 'commented' on what and how much I ate. He was very very critical of his ex wife, who he had just left. He introduced me to his children straight away depsite me not wanting to meet them, by tricking me into being in the car when he did the nursery/school run. I can now see he was using me here to get at his ex wife.

His family were also very critical of his ex wife and went on about how hard things had been for him living with her. Because they all did it as did mutual friends of theirs, it seemed believable. I now know she is/was very difficult but he was emotionally abusive to her too. Sadly for their children she can't see what he is like though and has now turned on me because I got a non-molestation order against him to stop him ruining mine and my childrens lives.

There are loads more but I don't want to waffle on forever. I just did the warning signs week of the freedom programme and it was scary how many there were. He also made out I had mental health problems and everyone believed him because i previously had depression. That was the bit that he used the most and people still believe him :(

arthriticfingers · 27/05/2012 09:17

Amitola Think we've established that we are bunch of fruitcakes here.
Our mental health problems would probably fill an encyclopedia.
I myself am a paranoid schizophrenic with self esteem issues Wink

Funny how FWs take it all with them when they go Wink
Or, in my case, I left my mental health problems behind when I left.

TheHappyHissy · 27/05/2012 10:12

Sorry, I've not been able to post as the thread is so massive it crashes my phone, and even the tablet looks like it's on mogadon, hence my short and sharp links.

Fingers, you know you are doing the right thing, you are setting a massive example to your DC, you are showing your H that living in a single room is preferable to life with him.

I think I had the same kinds of messages when it was clear that he'd been ejected from my life. If I were you I'd text him back and SAY 'Come back to what? more of the same?, no thanks!' possibly with a 'If you want me to come back to the house, YOU MOVE OUT and I will.'

The text is not an admission from him, it's a plea, for you to end the example you are setting, think of how it looks to the outside world fingers, he's run out of excuses and you moving out is humiliating him, showing him up.

So the house of cards is beginning to fall...

The more he kicks off, begs, the more you know you have him on the ropes! Now is the time to be ruthless!

TheHappyHissy · 27/05/2012 10:17

ihavesomuchlovetogive your bravery shines through love!

Keep posting, keep mulling stuff over, and keep detaching. You will get out, you have to get out.

God, I sincerely hope that you PEE in the bath.

FWIW, I'd pull the plug on that totally, i think he has some kind of weird, sick thing going on and who the hell is he to tell you NOT to shave, wash or anything, tell him he's a FREAK and to get his OWN frigging bath!

Seriously, pull the plug after your bath, shave what you want to shave, wash what you want to wash. Bugger the water bill!

arthriticfingers · 27/05/2012 11:44

Hissy you read my text Wink
Either that or you sent me the words by telepathy!
You/we are all right. I have been feeling better everyday.
Seeing kids today :)

ihavesomuchlovetogive · 27/05/2012 11:52

Thanks horse and hissy

hissy I have thought many times about peeing in "his" bath, spitting in his tea, poisoning his food..........only joking Hmm

horse in the beginning I was so young and so stupid. He wasnt one of these that showed me lots of affection immediately or professed his undying love after three hours. He made me feel lucky to have him IFYWIM. And I did!!!

Things happen all the time - daily really, but I have nothing to compare him to - this is/was normal for me. A few things stand out more than others. I always feel not good enough and nothing ever seems to please him. A joke is only funny if its him telling it, if I tell one he makes me feel stupid.

I fell down the stairs once into the living room. I was sort of wedged with my leg behind me at the bottom. He was sat on the sofa 4 feet away and didnt move to help me up, see if I was ok. I just remember feeling so sad that he didnt care.

Today I was talking to my sister, he was coming in to put some food on the table for breakfast - there was some washing folded on the table. He stood there looking at me food in hand just looking saying nothing - waiting for me to (mind read) stop having a conversation with my sister, jump up and move the stuff off the table - which I did. Because I know the retort had I said "move it yourself before you put the food down" would have been "alright then the children wont eat this morning because you wont move the clothes". I only challenge him at the moment when I know the kids wont be dragged into it.

ponygirlcurtis · 27/05/2012 15:56

Arthritic, hope your having a good time seeing your kids. Thinking of you.
lovetogive, I know exactly what you mean about choosing the times to challenge him. From my (allbeit limited) experience with a man like this, if you do start to regularly challenge things then they change their behaviour. But not necessarily for the better. My NSDP would sense me standing up to him and stat being really nice, only to revert back a few days later, once he'd hoovered me back in. Or he'd be even harder on me, laughing at me when I attempted to put boundaries in place. I remember him laughing at me scornfully when I told him one night that his door slamming and shouting was out of order as it was intimidating. Told me I was ridiculous and too sensitive. I never knew which way he'd go.

That all said, I'm still finding it hard to completely detach. Every time I see him, to drop our son off or pick him up, I get drawn into a prolonged situation. Sit down, do you want tea, how are you, can we talk properly, etc. I end up getting upset and I feel that I look weak, which perhaps is what he's aiming for. He wants me weak because then he knows there's a chance I'll buckle and go back. At the morning drop-off I was trying to talk again about the house situation, talk about my needs (after counsellor told me I'd allowed him to not meet them, with no consequences), but he was still set on staying. But instead of walking away from him and saying 'fine, if you wont meet my needs, I'll take that as an indication of your ongoing commitment to changing', I ended up crying and then asking for a hug because he was standing right next to me rubbing my shoulder. Kicking and shouting at myself in my head after that. Stupid stupid stupid. Blush Angry Sad

But yesterday evening, I saw my stepdaughters for the first time (have texted and spoken to them though, they're great girls), and we were chatting and having a laugh. When I was going, I was different to how I've been - more consciously upbeat, not wanting the girls to see me getting upset. NSDP was distinctly off with me. Spoke curtly. Looked at me funny, slightly intimidatingly. I could give him the benefit of the doubt and say he was feeling funky because he'd just woke up. Hmm Or he didn't like seeing me being 'ok' with everything and normal. Putting stuff in the car, I did ask him if he was ok (he does this silent staring thing where you feel he is waiting for you to say something). He said he was sad seeing the girls with DS, that they were struggling with the situation. I felt guilty. Which I suspect was the point of him saying it. He said a couple of other things along those lines. Then later, I got a text from him saying how he missed me, it seemed a long time till Wednesday till we see each other again. I know his MO by now, and knew that text would come. I replied saying it would actually be good to have space, not heard from him since...

Sorry, my posts are all ending up dead long because I don't get to post that frequently. Heigh-ho.

Keep enjoying the sunshine everyone. Wine o'clock yet?

ponygirlcurtis · 27/05/2012 16:33

So much for space, just had another text off NSDH saying it's v quiet there (at our house) & he's missing us all big time. His girls get picked up on a Sunday at about 2.30-3pm, so he's been on his own for all of about an hour. I just want to scream at him 'it's your own fault that you're on your own, stop trying to make me feel guilty!'. But I do feel guilty, although I know I have no reason to. Our gorgeous DS is six months old today, and I wish we were all together as a family. I'm so angry with him for fecking this all up. But I do also feel much more relaxed in myself now I'm out of the house, and I can see my older DS is too - I can cuddle him without fear of being told I'm babying him (he's 6...). Oh blimey. Massivelymixedup.com

ladybird69 · 27/05/2012 16:38

Hi haven't posted lately as been having such a hard time, too long and too painful to share but my arse wipe is evil scheming mad man.
Fingers i've been thinking about you so much and sending you strength, it takes an enormous amount of strength and courage to leave. You are a wonderful strong woman who is doing whats best and not taking the easiest painless option.
Amitola I totally get you! I have been with my stbxh 25 yrs i was a young fun 16 yr old but now I am nothing! he's sucked the life right out of me. In public evryone was so jealous of our 'loving marriage' yet it was all an act so that if I ever told anyone they'd say no you're wrong he's wonderful.
Also the mental health, he's trying to convince everyone i have mental health issues! I'm on tablets for the stress living with him!!! yet he's threatening to have me sectioned!
One day and hopefully not too far in the future we will all have the peace and happiness that we deserve. X

LemonDrizzled · 27/05/2012 21:32

Ladybird don't be intimidated these bullies often seem to threaten to use mental health problems against us but as you say they are causing them with their behaviour. Once you get away you will find yourself a much calmer happier person. I left after 28 years and you can too. You are NOT nothing he has just made you believe that. Think what fun you will have finding out who you are and what you enjoy when you are free to choose!

The Mental Health Act could never be used to Section you as you are not exhibiting psychotic symptoms nor are you suicidal or a threat to others. A psychiatrist and a Social worker would quickly spot that you were stressed but normal!
Wishing you peace and happiness too xxx

ladybird69 · 27/05/2012 22:43

Thanks for your reply Lemon. He using everything against me, children, house, mental health now even the pets! I thought things were bad before, but there is no level low enough that he will not stoop to.
He left me and kids and it was truly wonderful I was so happy, but once he realised that i wasnt falling to pieces without him, that i could survive and be happy! then he moved back in and he's been putting me through hell, constant hell. No wonder I'm stressed but in front of kids he's Mr wonderful...................I still care about you, but when their backs are turned he sneers and says I've never loved you!!!!!!!!!!!!
I can't wait to be free, Bless you Lemon xxx

foolonthehill · 28/05/2012 11:48

Ladybird: so he's broken his own spell. Now you know it is deliberate, nasty and thought through. Well done, you've got the anger and the motivation to "fly away home" and create something real and genuine and lovely...your life.

make a plan, lovely lady because he may be acting Mr Wonderful but the children will be feeling the mismatch even if they can't call him on it. And the mask will slip eventually anyway.

OP posts:
Horsetowater · 28/05/2012 11:57

What about him interrupting when I'm talking, then looking askance and yawning when I finally get him to stop and listen? WTF? It was a conversation about the computer FFS - one of his pet subjects. This just can't go on.

I've just worked out that I am stuck because he thinks I should be a housewife, looking after him and dcs needs without question.

foolonthehill · 28/05/2012 12:02

Horse that's what he has told you to be. What do you want to be? You can look after your DCs and others without losing yourself....

OP posts:
Kernowgal · 28/05/2012 12:16

It's now three+ weeks since OH moved out, and I just wanted to say that things are great. Yes there are times when I feel a bit lonely, but I've just got back from a week in Spain where I did everything I wanted, saw things I wanted to see and ate where and what I wanted. There were a few occasions when I saw something he would have liked or been interested in, which made me a bit sad, but generally I didn't miss him; I barely thought about him, to my surprise.

He couldn't believe it when I said I was going away and first asked me how I could afford it (er, I have savings and I'm not a tightwad like you) and second whether I was going with anyone else (ie had I been seeing someone else behind his back). I haven't, and I told him so, but I don't think he believed me. Tough tits there sonny jim! I just didn't want to be with you any more!

Now he just has to come over and pick up the remainder of his stuff. I will be strong and not rise to the mournful faces or petty comments about how I've changed the house since he's gone. It looks so much nicer now his shite's gone ;)

It's also occurring to me that I must have done a lot of detaching in the last few months of our r'ship - I feel like I've done all my grieving already and am already making plans for the future.

ladybird69 · 28/05/2012 18:43

Fool yes he certainly has! think I was expected to fall apart without him and beg, and then put up with all his crap and be so grateful to him!!!!
I will be 'flying away home' yes indeedy, a happy stable healthy environment full of fun and laughter can't wait. And I pray that once my children see that, they'll come flying back home to their mamma too, away from all his poison!

foolonthehill · 28/05/2012 19:03

Grin lady.

Hi Kernow good to see you again, and doing so well.

OP posts:
ThePinkPussycat · 28/05/2012 19:04

Hi all, am going through a bit of a stressy time. Thought I had come up with an acceptable deal, but it seems not. I am so fed up with him being Here All the Time. I find it v difficult to do anything with him around, even when he's in the study. I want to garden, but can't find the oomph... I expect I'll be ok when I get started.

arthriticfingers · 28/05/2012 20:49

:( Pink

LemonDrizzled · 28/05/2012 22:37

Anyone for a Wine and some cheesy nibbles? It's been a long day and some of you are struggling a bit.

kernow you will be ok, the rule is that it takes a month for every year you were together to recover after a breakup. You woke up quickly before too much damage was done, unlike the rest of us who spent decades working it out!

tryingtoescape · 28/05/2012 23:46

Hi all, can I join in the Wine and cheesy nibbles?

My fwh has just nicely displayed nice example of his fwittery infront of dm who is somewhat shocked while I am just - well this is my life and it's why I have reached this point. Dm's shock has brought it into perspective for me though.

Can I share?

Ds has been suffering from really bad hayfever; swollen face, eyes, unable to sleep etc. I asked the pharmacist's advice and he said half a piriton. I gave this to ds tonight as last resort. FWH, after letting me do all the putting to bed and coping with kids who can't sleep in this weather (still ignoring me, letting me "cope alone" is his punishment for something, god knows what...although he is now talking to kids again after week of ignoring them...), he heard from ds that I'd given him pill. Cue lots of shouty crap about "might as well give him heroin and sleeping tablets every night". So standard I hardly listened but dm totally shocked by the venom and sheer rudeness.

Anyway have started asking for help; big step telling dm and asking her to come and support me. Have found it impossible in past to tell people.

Myfaultagain · 29/05/2012 00:14

Hi

Just posted in relationships.... I got a blunt and scary response from Any F@@ker..... I am feeling very vulnerable and can't sleep..... Can any of you read my post.... I am not trying to wish myself into EA am I?

alypaly · 29/05/2012 00:32

i recently met a man on the internet after being on my own for 16 years. i am in my mid 50's and wanted to find someone nice. he seemed lovelt to write to and then we started phoning each other. he said all the right things and ticked all the boxes. so i took the bull by the horns and drove to cornwall. he seems caring and cooked meals for me but occasionally i noticed that he took no notice of the fact that i had 2 children ( he had no children from his previos 2 marriages). He never rememebered their names or which one was a uni etc. Anyway i put that to one side and booked a holiday with him. What a nightmare. i could hardly get a word in edgeways. Everything i said was wrong and he would go "No, no, no thats not right and run me down all the time. He never asked me what i wanted to do in the 3 weeks, he just did his own thing and expected me to do what he wanted. He didint want to have lunch so it was a case of if you want lunch you go and have it on your own. He was actually one of the most selfish men i have ever been out with, yet he comes over as such a genuine kind and helpful person to his friends. He did nothing but moan about how badly done to he was by his ex's and how he is used by his friends. He never stops bloody talking and i thought i had gone deaf when he went to sleep. oh my god, what a lucky escape and i pity the poor woman that ever falls completely for his romantic texts and phone calls.

He also mangaed to come over as reasonably intelligent before the holiday but he changed into a horrrible man whilst we were away. he criticised overweight people despite being v overweight himself and called bigger people awful names. He actually talked so much rubbish that i was bored to death with his company. he talked bollocks and he was a bully.

i decided not to see him when i got home and for some reason he still wants to see me and says he is still in love with me. how could i be so stupid.

Horsetowater · 29/05/2012 01:15

You weren't stupid at all Aly, thank god you had a lucky escape. These people are survivors. They know how to adapt their behaviour enough to get someone interested in them. Yours was obviously not smart enough and showed his true colours too quickly. Most of them are not so foolish and can go for months and sometimes years before the bullying starts, by which time you are putty in their hands. The way to look at them is that they are only nice because they need to be, but it's not the way they are naturally. They simply don't know how to love anything but themselves - they became like this as children as their only means of emotional survival and real love is uncomfortable and unpleasant.

TheHappyHissy · 29/05/2012 07:42

Myfault, you are already being abused love.

AF may be blunt, her responses may unsettle, but she has a heart the size of a continent.
She's right, you have to stand up for yourself, your son will learn to treat you in the same way, and any girlfriends, wives, or children.

Please have a read through the links at the to of this thread and see if anything resonates?

Come back ànd post here as much as you need to.