Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships number *8*

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

If you find that he really wants to change

I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

I'm not sure I realised I wanted to rescue mine. I definitely wanted to make him better, give him love he hasn't had. Our families are both similarly dysfunctional, and I thought we could make a life together, erasing all of that we had gone through.

I'm going into hour number three since texts were exchanged.

It doesn't mean though, that he can't sort himself out. It might happen, but probably won't while he's got you as a crutch. Sometimes people have to reach rock bottom simply so that they can come up again, start from scratch as a new person. But yes it is unlikely.

Alcohol is another layer of complication, perhaps Alanon will be able to help you with this - they are very good at helping partners of alcoholics.

Hour number three! Listen to yourself RKG! You are enmeshed, intertwined, co-dependent. Let him go - he will be fine. Plan your schedule for tomorrow - or your telly for the evening.

he has to realise he's broken though, and he says he hasn't got a problem with how he is. I'm the one with the problem.

cherry that is quite common. He says he is ok because he is so tightly controlling himself and his emotions (a self protection reaction to his childhood). You can't break that.

I know it sounds pathetic keeping a tally, I just feel like it's an achievement if you see what I mean?

RKG go for 3 years, not 3 hours! Try and distract yourself. X

Yes I know...I'm finding it easy not to text him. It's if he texts me, that's the challenge for me. I often rise to the bait. (Yes I could change my number, but I know I won't).

cherry do you have children with this man?

cherry you could try reading some of the alanon books and see if they help you, my dp is ea but not alcoholic, but I read Courage to Change, it is about detaching with love, I struggle with the with love part as I actually despise dp now, this started about 6 months ago after birth of dd and his subsequent behaviour and dv. But the book helps me and would help anyone dealing with an alcoholic, my df is an alcoholic

Rachel keep going, no contact ever again would be good. Delete his number

cherry wow, you are going through a lot. what you have described is just terrible, i feel so sad for you. what is your situation at the moment? Are you still with him? Like others have said, it sounds like his childhood is a big cause for the way that he is. And because of how he has conditioned and controlled you, along with the fact that you care for him it is natural that you would want to try and fix him and help him. but you can't. only professionals and he can. and only if he is willing to admit to himself that he needs help. sending love and positive thoughts your way. xx

thanks for kind words, they have helped validate my feelings. My head spins sometimes, what have I done wrong etc. He does so much for me, but I'm so lonely. I can't understand why he observes social "niceties" with other people. I've been having gynae problems/tests for around 6 weeks and he doesn't even ask how I'm feeling, yet I've just heard him on the phone sympathising with his friend who is ill. I get upset over stupid petty things. I feel so rubbish that when someone is nice to me I get suspicious, I think they're taking the p!
My children are not his, my husband died in 2003. They are 17 and 20 and I'm so proud of them! xx
I'm sorry, I feel I'm clogging up this thread with a petty whinge when lots of you are having really bad times, hugs to you all xx

Reading Dr Irene. Helpful so far.

cherry it's not petty. Sorry to hear what you are going through, it sounds really tough and I know all you want to do is help him.

I'm managing ok with the fact my ex (split up 2 months ago) was abusive. It's hard but i'm getting stronger. There are 2 things i can't deal with though. He turned everyone against me. I don't even know what he said but he admitted to telling his family etc everything was my fault and slagging me off. Why are people so happy to believe its all me?
Also my 4 yr olds mood changes instantly when he sees or hears from him. We had a brilliant day but his dad phoned at 4 and he then had a major tantrum, treated me really badly and went on about how perfect daddy is. I'm scared he will turn him against me :( I have no idea how to deal with this and make it better for my children.
I just don't understand why people believe him! normally people like me,he must have been doing this from day one!

leaving in my mind, it is a form of psychological abuse to manipulate a child into believing that their main caregiver (you) is the enemy. It is a very serious matter, and in my mind it is child abuse. The difficulty is getting evidence that he is doing this. It sounds as though he is - I would talk to womens aid or even childline about it and see what they think. It's not what people do to people they love is it?

I think if he's turning adults against you it might be a good idea to confront it in some way. If these people are your support network it is worth fighting for that. I've never been in that situation but I'm sure there are few women on here that have been. Hopefully they will be able to help.

I think if it happened to me I would be out there on facebook, saying everything that needed to be said.

rotool You asked about whether it would okay to move your dcs 45 minutes away. You might want to ask on the legal board, as you'll get good advice there. From what I understand, his solicitor's letter doesn't carry legal weight and can't stop you going. If your ex went to court, you would be expected to show what arrangements you were putting in place to ensure continued access, and the onus would most likely be on you to bring the dcs to him rather than the other way round. But if you're not leaving the country and not deliberately moving just to frustrate contact, and can show that there are advantages to the dcs to moving to the new place, you have a good chance of being allowed to move. This isn't a total guarantee - iirc one poster has a court order forbidding her to move, but the usual thing would be that you'd be allowed. 45 mins (I presume you mean a 45-min drive or public transport and not an airplane ride!) isn't that far.

Struggling :( His whole family, his ex wife and everyone who was friends with him is on his side. His children will be too because they can never see anything he does is wrong. Well actually his son can but nobody listens to him so he puts up with it again.
I thought he had been turning people against me for years but now I know he was I don't know how to cope with it. I was desperate to be accepted by his family because mine never wanted me and he used that against me and set it up so my worst fears came true.
Now he is making sure his ex wife gets a better deal than me and their children get more than mine. I would be very happy if they never saw him again but I doubt he will ever give on the image of doting dad.
I can't understand why his family can't see what he is really like, its like they are all brainwashed by his parents.
We very nearly got on well for a while. It was a couple of years ago, he had some counselling and saw his parents for what they really are. He didn't want to face it but he started to, stood up to his mum and she shut us all out for 3 months. Eventually she spoke to me on the phone and muttered something about moving on from it. She didn't say a word to him, but he accepted that and was straight back in the toxic family net.
They absolutely hate me now. I've shown their family up for what they really are and they know I will not fall back in line now, so i'm out and his ex wife is back in. They hate her too but she doesn't stand up to them anymore.
Sorry for rambling on. I have nobody to talk to in rl. I need to be really strong for my children but I can't keep it up all the time. I knew he didn't love me, I knew years ago, so why the hell didn't I just walk away?! In one sense i'm so glad I didn't because my wonderful boys wouldn't be here, but in another I feel so guilty they have him for a dad. I'm to blame for that and I don't have the first clue how to protect them from him. People always say not to turn the children against the absent parent, but if they are abusive surely you can't not say anything?

LittleHouseofCamelias : Your post about cooking made me smile. My DH has taken up GARDENING. After nearly 20 years of watching me break my back to keep our 'grounds' tidy and well planted, never lifting a finger or offering to help, sitting about watching television. NOW he's 'gardening'. WTF. It makes me angry and sad at the same time. Why couldn't he have been NICE to me? Why couldn't we have DONE things together? But we were never a team with anything, really.

I feel bad sometimes that he has the children 50% of the time, as well. He's just not nice, moody, angry and at the moment depressed. They are so adorable and I hate 'sending them home'. I want to just protect them. But I know I can't. It's frustrating and sometimes I worry that they might have been better if we were still together - at least they would have had ME around all the time to counteract his behaviour.

I was ill last month and Nice Boy was incredibly supportive. He didn't leave my side. I found it all baffling, when ExH just ignored me when I was ill, and always left me in hospital by myself. Nice Boy just held my hand and stroked my hair and sat by my bed all night. I kept telling him to go home but he was utterly baffled about why I was saying that. "Why would I let you go through this by yourself?" I don't really know - but ExH always did. Compassion feels like a treat I don't deserve.

Thanks for the chance to ramble...

leaving - your ex sounds dire.

It is so tough detaching from the situation and not get hurt by others reactions - I have had difficulty with this too.
I try my hardest to focus on 'all that matters is me and ds/dd and to hell with what everyone else thinks'... you're only two months out, I guarantee in a year when you have settled into being seperate it WILL feel better...just be gentle with yourself in the meantime.

With a 'normal' breakup - no resident parent should slate the absent parent just for fun...thats wrong.

But you are describing him being abusive to your 4yr old, this is wrong and certainly you should highlight this and take it into account when arranging access.

Hi big just be glad your garden is getting attention. It would be worse if it was neglected.

When I went round for The Talk with FWH on Saturday FWH was being "the wronged wife". My mate put her finger on it exactly. In his script he is the marvellous one struggling as a single parent to keep the home together for the DC work full time cook and shop and make ends meet. (With only the help of the gardener the housekeeper and his £9000 a month!) There was a funny moment when he dropped his guard and ranted at me for daring to only work "part time" ie 30 hours a week which I have done for 22 years. I could see the snarl. Then he went back to weepy and put upon. And asked if I would help with his bills (!) after the kids have all left home for uni..... off to the solicitor this am to find out whether I should.

Little. It's funny how they feel even more entitled to the poor little me act when they are the ones staying in their own home!

Hi little, just wondering does it have to be the kids live with him? Sorry if it's wrong of me to ask that.