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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Sensitive question about H

709 replies

ThreeLittlePandas · 14/03/2012 11:52

I've been putting off asking this because I'm scared of what your answers might be. I'm really evaluating my relationship with h atm and wondering wether to leave him and I think the answer to my question might heavily influence my decision.

Blush in advance.

Dh and I rarely have sex. When we do it is rather boring but he is considerate.

The other evening I went to bed early as I was desperately tired. I was woken a few hours later my dh who had his fingers in me. I was heavily asleep and by the time I realised what was happening he was having sex with me. He finished quickly and that was it. I really hadn't wanted to have sex and feel like I wasn't given an option. The next day I felt a bit angry and almost violated to be honest.

I'm not looking for anything other than an opportunity to talk this through because it's been bothering me. This is about the third time in the last couple of years that something like this has happened.

OP posts:
ErikNorseman · 14/03/2012 14:33

Some people like to start to have sex with someone while they're asleep, and it doesn't have to be a vicious thing, it doesn't make the sleeping person a piece of meat

If the person that they are having sex with is unconscious and unwilling then that is rape

The OP already told her H that she did not consent to him doing that. He did it again, more than once. Ergo he raped her. It is not incorrect to say (not scream wtf) that this was rape.

curiousgeorgie · 14/03/2012 14:34

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that a husband waking his wife up for sex is a completely different thing from a stranger breaking into your home and raping you. It's completely different. I'm not saying one is right, but it is in no way on a par.

AnyFucker · 14/03/2012 14:35

he didn't wake her up for sex, CG

he was having sex with her when she woke up, not giving her a chance to consent or not

don't you see the difference ?

ErikNorseman · 14/03/2012 14:36

He isn't 'waking her up for sex'

That would be a different matter. He is starting to have sex with her without her knowledge or consent. Why don't you grasp why that is rape?

curiousgeorgie · 14/03/2012 14:37

I'm not saying it isn't rape. I'm saying that the OP has to be sure. And that people can interpret situations in different ways.

Charbon · 14/03/2012 14:37

Posters who have got an axe to grind against women and rape victims, or who have stayed with a man who once raped them, should not only get off this thread, they should get off Mumsnet.

OP are you any nearer to talking about this with Rape Crisis? I promise you they will understand and will be brilliant.

Ephiny · 14/03/2012 14:38

Indeed, there's a difference between waking someone up 'for sex' and penetrating them without their consent while they're asleep. And medicated so they can't easily wake up or say no.

Yes being raped by your husband is a different thing from being raped by a stranger breaking into your home. However both are absolutely wrong, both are awful things to experience, and both are illegal.

LucyManga · 14/03/2012 14:39

The OP is clearly worried about what is happening.

'The next day I felt angry and violated' - in her OP - a massive clue, no? Hmm

Where are these rape apologists coming from? Bonkers.

AnyFucker · 14/03/2012 14:43

back to the OP...

pandas there was a lovely poster on here who suffered from panic attacks when the r word was used and her experience was from several years ago

she had a very long support thread

everyone understood how that word is very triggering

she was advised to email R Crisis/Women's Aid and ask for someone to contact her back without referring to that word, just to talk about her feelings

I think the first time, as is common I believe, she simply sobbed the whole time (I may be conflating here, but stay with me) but the person hung on the line and let her talk about it in her own time, in her own way

would doing that work for you ?

you have taken the first step by telling us here, but there is only so far a board such as this can go (and all the myth-peddlers don't help)

BellaOfTheBalls · 14/03/2012 14:51

Sex without consent is rape regardless of the perpetrator. End of. The only thing that can change is the level of violence involved. However if someone has sex with you when you had said no or were in no fit state to say to give consent; its rape.

OP I'm so sorry this has happened to you. I am a bit reticent of just immediately shouting "leave him!" as it's not always that simple & is often easier said than done. I like to think I know what I would do in that situation but TBH I'm not sure I do. What would you be saying (either on MN or in RL) if somebody else was telling this story?

NarkedPuffin · 14/03/2012 14:56

What AnyFucker said ^

mindofgreyfluff · 14/03/2012 14:58

Pandas
Please do contact either Women's Aid or Rape Crisis. You do not have to use the R word. I called RC a few years ago in a very similar situation (with a 'D'P rather than H) I did not want to see it as Rape, I even told the woman on the end of the phone that I thought I might be wasting her time as I lived with and shared a bed with my 'D'P. I was shocked to hear how common actions like these are in a relationship.

I told my partner the morning after the first time that I was uncomfortable with what he'd done that night, and that I felt violated as I had no choice. He told me he thought he was being 'loving' and that it was something normal in a relationship. I asked him to wake me up next time before trying anything. It happened again, we had the same conversation, it happened again and I mentioned something to someone who used the R word.

I completley denied that it was Rape as we were in a relationship, he didn't hurt me, and he was perfect in every other way. After speaking to RC I looked into his internet history and he'd been looking at Rape based porn for months. Only then did it sink in.

I hope you are looking after yourself. Feel free to PM me if you'd like to talk.

NarkedPuffin · 14/03/2012 15:00

It's sad how often those trying to mitigate this kind of behaviour have similar happening in their own lives.

AnyFucker · 14/03/2012 15:05

I reckon 99% of the calls to RC begin with "I don't want to waste your time, but...." Sad

That's what peddlig rape myths does

it puts people off asking for help, well done to you all that do it

Charbon · 14/03/2012 15:06

What a brave and generous post mindofgreyfluff

I think there could be a link between what you say here:

"I looked into his internet history and he'd been looking at Rape based porn for months. Only then did it sink in."

and what the OP says here:

"He avoids sex with me. He never ever comes to bed at the same time as me. Even if I wait up really late."

AnyFucker · 14/03/2012 15:09

Early in the thread I wanted to ask if he is a prolific porn user. But I didn't, because it often derails the thread. I wouldn't be surprised though.

LiarsWife · 14/03/2012 15:10

My STBX used to do this but blamed it on the fact that he was sleeping(!!) .. used to say that he didn't remember anything in the morning

I used to wake up as he was trying to penetrate me but I started pushing him away and going to the loo..

Another reason I am well rid!

mindofgreyfluff · 14/03/2012 15:11

Charbon, I had no one to talk to in RL about my situation as I felt it was my fault and that people would see me differently. If Pandas can see that it does happen to other people, and it's not their fault then maybe it will help her to come to terms with it.

My Partner had been staying up late watching porn, which is why he wasn't coming to bed at the same time as me. It didn't matter if I stayed up later with him, he'd always make an excuse of not coming to bed at the same time.

BlackCatsAndPurpleDogs · 14/03/2012 15:17

I do take medication that makes me sleepy. It always takes me a while to come round.

Ok, tell him this, and tell him if he ever wakes you up for 'sex' again, it is rape as you don't, and never will, want this.

Make him know if no uncertain terms. And if it happens again, leave him.

CailinDana · 14/03/2012 15:26

BlackCats - she's already told him not to do this, more than once. I don't think suggesting someone should get raped again before leaving is good advice.

curiousgeorgie · 14/03/2012 15:33

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

Whobuilt · 14/03/2012 15:34

My DH has tried it on in the night more times than I can I remember, always says he's asleep but I stop him and then he tries again. Told a friend and she said it was normal, her DH does it too. At what point should I be worried?

CailinDana · 14/03/2012 15:35

Curious, if you tell your partner not to do it and he does it anyway it is clear cut rape, yes.

CailinDana · 14/03/2012 15:36

Whobuilt, if you're ok with it and it doesn't bother you then there's no need to worry. It's not for anyone else to tell you that it is this and that. What are your feelings on it?

CailinDana · 14/03/2012 15:37

Just to add Whobuilt, if you said no and he continued anyway that would be rape under the law, but no one can tell you how you should feel about that.

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