Sensitive question about H

[ThreeLittlePandas]

I've been putting off asking this because I'm scared of what your answers might be. I'm really evaluating my relationship with h atm and wondering wether to leave him and I think the answer to my question might heavily influence my decision.

in advance.

Dh and I rarely have sex. When we do it is rather boring but he is considerate.

The other evening I went to bed early as I was desperately tired. I was woken a few hours later my dh who had his fingers in me. I was heavily asleep and by the time I realised what was happening he was having sex with me. He finished quickly and that was it. I really hadn't wanted to have sex and feel like I wasn't given an option. The next day I felt a bit angry and almost violated to be honest.

I'm not looking for anything other than an opportunity to talk this through because it's been bothering me. This is about the third time in the last couple of years that something like this has happened.

Nettle - Smart for 12.
I don ever want her in the unfortunate position of the OP. Or in positions that I found myself in.

Its very hard to hear the RAPE word. I think this thread has certainly raised alot of questions which, given the curent campaign on MN, probably need answering and clarifying. The op probably doesnt want it clarified as rape, and her husband CERTAINLY wouldnt want it identified as such.

But given that the OP has told him. She CLEARLY told him the time before this. At first she had been uncomfortable (hence telling him how she felt and how she didnt want him to do it again), but when he did it again after having apparantly understood and apologised and saying he wouldnt, she then felt violated. I dont see how he can have thought she liked it, despite what he said as an excuse.

He probably doesnt see it as rape, but he sure as hell knows its wrong. Maybe having it spelt out to him he will now understand that it was rape. Its because of these blurred lines that men and women seem to have, these attitudes which are continued that its OK really,no big deal, that allow it to happen in the first place.

I would teach about these myths early in secondary education. I would make sure that everyone, male or female, FULLY understood that any sex needed to be consensual, and have discussions as to what that means. For the protection of boys as well as girls. Blind drunk means its not consensual, even if it might appear everyone is up for it. Drugged off your tits the same. (deemed incapable of making an informed decision) Passed out or sleeping a definate no no. Going 'too far' or getting 'carried away' during petting - again, no excuse.

But this is going off topic, and probably should be put in the campaign thread.

Suffice to say in the eyes of the law ignorance does not absolve you of having committed a crime - jusst because he (who obviously has a warped sense of entitlement) might not call it rape (and would he want to view himself as a rapist) doesnt mean that it isnt

Cailin we are all adding to this horrible thread hijack by engaging Georgie and allowing her to promote rape myths. This has led to that particularly noxious post about 'crying'. We should I think now completely ignore until MNHQ take action.

Curious - I think you need to stop talking on this thread.

You need to listen to what the OP is saying about her marriage.

You have your views about your marriage, but they only apply to you.

So maybe you need to start your own thread about your own marriage if that is what you want to talk about.

CG I find it unusual and a bit strange that your husband has sex with you when you are unconscious. But if you've given him permission to do this then who am i to argue.

Are you totally sure that this is a decision YOU have made, that you are totally happy with? Are you sure he's not the one who has told you that as your husband he has the right! Its just that you keep pointing out that he's your husband . . . That doesn't give a person automatic rights to your body.

--------------------

PANDA - please feel free to start a new thread as this has become the curiousgeorge show and is of no help to you or others in similar positions.

I agree fab

Also CG does it not hurt when you wake up? If you are not awake i would imagine you don't become aroused. Does he use lubrication?

Panda I've been lurking on this thread and I just wanted to say I'm so sorry this has happened to you. It is rape, it is vile and I really feel for you.

I'm really disappointed to see rape apologists on here - there is no excuse for rape. None.

I suppose you're right Charbon. My concern is that curious is starting to see that something is wrong with her situation and is lashing out, which is a normal response. I'm sad for her, but yes, it's not fair to take over Panda's thread.

One last thing, and then I will stop, I promise. Just to say, Curious, if you don't want your husband to have sex with you while you're unconscious, or to wake you up at night for sex when you're tired, then he absolutely should respect that.

In answer to a few questions about my marriage.

My first marriage ended and I was alone for about 3 years with my eldest two dc. We did fine tbh. I worked and looked after them with little input from their father.

When I met dh he was the perfect gentleman. Very kind and considerate. He has children from his first marriage and he was/is brilliant with them. We did take things slowly at first. He was never controlling or aggressive. He did have a problem with porn though.

We got engaged after a few years and then found out I was pregnant. We married two months before dd was born. He was still brilliant at this point.

After dd was born things were fine at first but when she was a few months old I developed pnd. He was hugely supportive during this time. Even my cpn commented on how good he was. Seriously, everyone thinks he is some kind of saint.

I'm not sure when things started going weird but the first time he did this was well over a year ago.

His porn use has always been a problem. I have a huge problem with it from a feminist point of view. He has promised to not use it and then lied to me to try and cover up the fact that he has. This has happened on about four occasions. He says he hasn't been near it for months and months. His form makes me think he is probably lying.

Good to see you back Pandas. How are you feeling?

Hi Panda. I think it is quite telling that your DH is lashing out now and being snipey. He obviously understands he has done something wrong. The porn thing doesnt surprise me at all. Do you think he has a porn addiction? Do you know what sort of porn he watches?

I am so sorry you are going through this. Please keep posting, or start another thread if you feel the need to get away from all the shenanigans here.

What are you going to do and do you need any help with anything?

good god CG are you still posting here?

Right, well, considering you have seen fit to judge the op, second-guess what she should be thinking, and what her dh should be thinking, and have basically dismissed everything she feels and fears and has had the courage to post here, here's what I think.

I think you read this op and it struck a chord with you.

You looked at the words of the op and what they said, and suddenly you realized that this is your relationship.

And as you realized this you realized that you've never had an issue with it, never thought to have an issue with it, because to you this is normal - not only the concept of your husband beginning to have sex with you while you're asleep, but him continuing to do so even if you wake up.

And it can't be rape - how could it? After all, you both love each other, and he wouldn't do that to you, so it's not rape. Except he does it to you, and it's never occurred to you to mind, or object, or question that it might be wrong. How could it be wrong - he is your husband...

But you know it's wrong, don't you? You can't admit that it's wrong though because you've accepted this state of play in your own relationship, and rather than accept that this is how it is in your own relationship, you have to fight against the assumption that the op is right, and those that don't agree with her are wrong.

If you genuinely believed you were right you wouldn't still be on this thread protesting just how right you are - you would have read it and moved on because it didn't apply to you.

But instead you feel you need to stay on this thread in order to convince everyone else that it's not like that.

But it's not everyone else you're trying to convince, it's yourself.

Think about it.

whobuilt here have started a thread, as you were x

Saw it, beautiful, very pleased you were prompted to post.

Because so many people seem to have difficulty with understanding that consent is rather more than just not actually fighting and screaming your refusal at the top of your voice, I think it would be useful to spread the word that what everyone should be looking for during a sexual encounter is enthusiastic participation from anyone else involved. That means smiling, saying how nice it is, returning kisses and caresses, actively touching the other partner, positive movement etc. And if you are having sex with someone who is not showing any indication of enjoyment, unless there has been prior negotiation about liking sex with way and/or an agreement to play out a particular fantasy or something, you need to stop and find out what's wrong.

Fabwoman, thank you but not yet. I don't know what I'm going to do at the moment. You know that feeling you get when somebody tells you some bad news and you feel shell shocked and stunned? That's how I feel. Im not able to even think straight. I need time to process everything and then I will come to a decision.

Can someone link the new whobuilt thread for me?

WannaBe and Hopkin - I stopped posting almost an hour ago, not because I felt what I was writing was wrong (I don't) but because I just couldn't seem to get my point over without offending and that really wasnt my intent.

However!

I'm not the OP and I'm not going to stand by while you label my relationship something it is not, and my DH something he is not.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with any aspect of my relationship, thanks very much.

My concern over this thread has nothing to do with myself and more to do with a friend, who was falsely accused after a girls story gained momentum with this sort of mob mentality.

That is all.

Pandas - I genuinely hope you're okay. Perhaps DH will come home tonight absolutely aghast that this is what you are thinking, and in that respect, perhaps this thread will have done some good. If not, then I hope you have the support in RL that you need.

Threelittlepandas- a poster upthread mentioned an old thread started by me, about my P's hidden obsession with rape porn, including finding a video that looked like a real video of a drugged rape on a young woman (eg. not 'fantasy' rape}. Your whole thread about not being sure if it 'classifies' as rape has made me feel sick, my P has done EXACTLY the same thing to me through 7 year relationship, having sex with me while I am asleep or plain not giving up even if I say no ten times. AI've always minimised or downplayed it until literally now, for the same reasons as you

I hope you are feeling OK? Please take power and control of the situation, it is the only way to stop any further crumbling of self esteem (I have had exactly the same problem with overcoming the shock/disgust etc)

My P was also a 'good' person, he projected good morals, politeness etc. But the TRUTH is that he gets off on women being raped.

Reading this thread today has sent me into a tailspin over again, I had put everything to do with sorting the probs/leaving P on hold until my babys born (due in 2wks) but what your H does to you is exactly what my P has been doing to me (I'm not on medication that makes me sleepy though) except he has done it tens of times over the years, literally I havent counted, I feel ill from this realisation.

Thinking back he has said in the past 'its better than me cheating on you' and blamed my low sex drive. And I didn't physically stop him despite saying no, I gave in every time. And did the same as you regarding telling him in daytime in plain terms that I did NOT want to do it again or at the time, and felt used in the worst way, by someone you should trust. I do not remotely trust him now, and understand he has a sexual interest (rape) that i dont want in my life. This thread is another piece of the jigsaw fitting into place, please look at your H's computer and his download history may help you to realise he isn't what you deserve, he isn't a wholesome/normal person. If your self esteem is as low as mine, well its took me lots of bits of 'evidence' and my own removal of masking whats been going on to protect myself, in order to start thinking about getting out.

Sorry post is so disjointed but this thread has shaken me up horribly, I hope you are feeling OK

Panda - I do understand that feeling as I have had it myself. My way of not dealing with it is to not think about it if I can help it.

Pandas can you say any more about what you mean by 'weird'? You said in your OP that what happened has occurred about three times in the past two years. What other things have you noticed about his behaviour (either towards you or others) and can you link it to anything?