desperate for dating advice - should I ask a younger guy out if I'm a client?

[autumnflower]

This would sound silly, but please help bear with me, if you can!
I'm divorced and have been single for a bit (unsuitable short relationship of 2mnth early this year, older man who turned out to be too controlling). I'm really ready for, and wanting a relationship, ideally would like to get married again and possibly have a child. I'm pressed for time as to children, but if this doesn't happen, still want to find a soulmate. The problem is I seem to be no good at all at developing a relationship in early stages. I tend to get excited quickly if there is mutual attraction and start imagining him as a lover and future husband, which means i have no patience developing things slowly. I asked a couple of men out myself over the last two years (apart from that relationship where older man intiated), both younger, thinking they were single - both turned to be married, so of course that stopped there, but it made me weary of asking someone again and being disappointed. I also read those books and kind of believe the idea that a man should be the one asking me out - I'd enjoy that more. I only asked those two out because they had no means of contacting me, fleeting encounters.
I'm now looking buy a new place, and lo and behold, I now fancy one of the estate agents! Partly i let myself fancy him as it looks like he's attracted. But I just don't trust my judgement after mistakes and a long gap in dating, as he could be just either nice, or wanting me as a client (I now view most properties with him and not other agents). He's younger, and that also scares me a bit - but he does seem to make an special effort, and they are busy anyway with sales, but also he blushed last time when we were shaling hands saying goodbuy. We seem to chat more amd more beyond the neccessary, and ther is eye contact but sometimes he looks away rather than look confident. The thing is, I feel that he won't ask me out because i'm a client and he might be scared of losing a job? does anyone have expreience of agents asking then out? very silly i know, but I think there is really something worthwhile between us! Just feels that he likes me. And he's apparently single (didn't ask directly but going by fact that he lives with friends). If he can't ask me out, should i do it? I'm pertified of making an idiot of myself again, if i misread it. Or he might be just interested in casual sex, but I'm not! I'm close to buying something so I might have to stop viewings next week and will stop seeing him, but can definetely see him at least once more. Oh, and I love his voice - always found it was a good sign. And it seems like i have a thing for younger guys - AND been encouraged by MN success stories. A woman in her 30s behaving like a teenager i know, but please help. Is it true that if a man really wants someone, he'll ask her out no matter what???

Yeah. Im gonna be honest with you. I've been through mucho shit. Child abuse. Abusive marriage. Lots of singledom hood. Naff sales jobs, then finishing degree and second marriage. I'm only 30. So background there as I never used to know my ass from my elbow with men.

Now I know sales patter, I've also had a lot of help to sort my own shit out. Now I was lucky. I happened across a man who with money has his head screwed on wrt houses/cars. Oh and life and respect.

He knew what she was doing and kept trying to include me in the convo. She kept ignoring me. Staring it at him, offering him a test drive, blah, blah. Full on flirting in my presence.

Yeah he's good looking, I was not jealous, she was trying to flog him a car. In the process totally disrespecting me as a woman. Why couldn't she sell to me? So yes, damn bloody right I spoke up.

bubble - well, she was quite stupid if she couldn't see she was putting you iff - doesn't she know that in marriages it's a wife who makes decisions and that it won't be positive when a woman is disrespectful to the wife/full on with H? no wonder she lost the sale. Well done for sorting so much out by the time you are 30, now you can be in control of yr life.

imo this is the main thing: and he said, let's see how it goes with your offer re he is only interested in the sale. As someone said, estate agents are known for using all the tricks in the book to get that sale! Their salary is based on commission and they see £££ signs - particularly as they make a good percentage. They will sweeten clients up any which way.

He smoozed you flower - that's what they do! That's what 'my' estate agent did - him and others too. That's what they do. They see a woman on her own buying a house - kerching they think, this'll be easy. I doubt very much if you were the first to get sweet on him, or the last. Or his colleagues. They're gits really but most see it as a bit of fun, nothing more. I don't think they are being purposefully cruel but I'm afraid they can sniff vulnerability a mile off.

don't think this agent is a little sweetie - he has the killer instinct (has to to do his job, otherwise he'd do another job that paid a steady wage and wasn't dependent on commission). He wants to and likes scoring, any kind of scoring, probably.

don't think this agent is a little sweetie
that's actually exactly how i saw him, especially as he's not a typical loud talkative type..!
springy - you're back! I've been called a stalker here which is unbelievable - were you accused of stalking when being sweet on that agent?[hmmm] I wonder though, how did you have your moment of clarity? did you ever say anything to him/asked him?
I wonder how it works - who gets commision? the person showing a property to you, or the one who negotiates as he never negotiates - is it just divided between both? do they get extra for number of viewings??

so far, I haven't bought anything - I didn't go overboard on their place that i offered on, and it's gone.

They get judged on viewings. Commission on value. So the more they have making offers.......

Wrt to car lady.... Yeah she was stupid :)

you mean, i help beef up a final price with my non-winning offer? yes, but in case of the place i bid on, there was a lot of interest and a few above me anyway.

That posted before I was ready (which is a bit worrying as I tend to edit before posting - argh). YOu seem a straightforward kinda gal - you don't muck about, you get straight to the point and don't understand faffing about. You wouldn't give anyone the come-on if you weren't interested ( you don't do sly) and if you were an estate agent, your strength would probably be your directness and honesty, which buyers would value and appreciate.

imo you also seem to be someone who turns over every stone, analysing this and that. Obsessive? possibly obsessive in character, or possibly obsessive at the moment (?). though it can be a mark of intelligence to consider things from all angles. the obsessiveness could indicate you are vulnerable (at the moment?) - the lack of patience, the hurrying at breakneck speed.. which is no picnic and can lead to an inability to read subtle (or not so subtle) signals; instead, seeing things at face value.. and getting confused. My guess is that, as you are confused by this guy, you would've chewed this over with your friend - only she is otherwise occupied and you turned to a group of strangers, a lot of whom aren't like you (and your friend?). I don't think you are a stalker but I can see that people who are not like you would think you were. They're wrong imo - in all likelihood, what you think and what you do are two different things. I also think it is not adolescent to have a crush or agonise about confusing signals (if, by adolescent, people mean that adolescents are notoriously confused and vulnerable then hey, full-blown adults get that too and can go through similar agonies in relating).

This guy played you imo flower, all in the name of getting the sale. he probably thinks it was fun while it lasted but the end result for him is the sale and his juicy commission. We all meet people (all the time!) we fancy and would like to shag - it doens't mean we would or it would be appropriate. He doens't intend to pursue this that's for absolute certain imo. I'm sorry he played around with you, particularly when you are going through a vulnerable patch, and has led you up the garden path.

TSC I know how i sound - I'm letting my hair down here, with him it's now casual property chat, before maybe more flirty but also with boundaries (I'm quite shy really) - and he told me his chrsitmas plans, nothing intense. As to the fact i fancy him, I can't just wipe it off - whether it shows or not it's not in his face.

wrt the estate agent I got deranged about - very similar to you flower. I agonised, fantasised, wondered. I was quite off my head at the time after a gruelling divorce; he was a young sweetie (num num) who clearly thought I was a bit of alright - why not? I thought. I was far too vulnerable to take that kind of playful flirting.

I didn't ask him out, he didnt ask me out. though I did once ask some young sweetie out and will never do it again: he wasn't horrid but the clang was practically audible (fantasy/reality clash). it was a wake-up call for me - I thought, Springy, things aren't right with you at the moment pet. I went easy on myself after that and got out of the game for a while, gave myself some space. Booked myself a therapist

springy - thank you for yourthoughtful post - you could really be my friend if we crosesd paths as you get it all. Yes, I chew it over with friends, and a guy (not a close friend) advised me to ask him out, as many on here did. And yes, I am a bit obsessive but you'd petrified to show it to strangers or potential dates - I did get many dates in the course of my life, with younger guys including, so i didn't see it as something unusual with him, but on hte surface people normally think and say that I'm cool, even aloof sometimes! Obv if i like someone i'm flirty, but normally get a positive result and never would fdlirt with zero encouragenent. I'm very vulnerable at the moment as i', single, just had a stressful house move (had to move out even though i didnt buy yet) and am now staying here and there - I'm not used to it at all! I'm quite a homebody without a home! he was a bit of a ray of sunshine in all hte stress (i also didn't win two places i really wanted to buy), so I'm prone to be thinking about him as he brought me pleasurable emotions/I felt like a woman after being single since march. Everyone advised asking him out - it's just i got a bit knocked and hence came back here, because after he agreed to meet up, he hasn't done anything or hasn't mentioned anything last time we met - that's just happened and i did feel knocked/puzzled. You got the picture right. If he did followed up, I wasn't actually planning to throw myself into it - wanted some chat dates first, once a week maybe, I wasn't that onsessive, it's definetely more in thoughts than actions. Thank you.

TSC - you see still burning 10yrs on but people here think that my fancying since Sept is far too long! You see, I don;t get it - why then did he chat you up all the time? I'm indeed very straight forward - If I don't intend pursuing smth i would not keep flirting/giving them hope. An odd one maybe, but no more.
springy, I also thought , why not - maybe in your case he would ve said yes. You say he clearly fancied you - that's what i thought, but now everyone made me suspicious that the body language is not to be trusted..not with sales people anyway.

why the shame though? men ask women out all the time and get rejected and women don't see them as doing anything shameful. There is no shame in not being someone's type enough. I definetely don't still feel ashamed of any refusals from years ago. If there is enough acceptance to balance it with, why not feel it was just a try, so what. You really have to be prepared for various outcomes - I actually always was with this guy, esp with age gap, but he did confuse me, still I don't feel shame, just a disappointment that we can't even try and see how it goes. I would be ashamed though if a person wasn't discreet and boasted to everyone.

as to desire - you just can't switch it off at will after two-three months without blatant rejection! it will have to fade gradually.

Autumn, I had a slightly weird experience with a younger and very dishy bloke last year. We had to do a project together during which time he told me where he lived, what he did at weekends, and offered me his mobile number in case I had any future questions.

It was all too good to be true - so I just left it.

Then I met him in the corridor last week and had a quick chat and he started blushing.

And I still left it.

My instinct is very honed now - this guy does not want to be asked out for a drink by me.

I'd go for dating and dinner clubs - my sister did and met her husband.

Good luck.

I think a lot of the posters on here have been v harsh on the OP.

You might not believe this bloke liked her at all, but that is just your opinion and as you weren't there how could you possibly know for sure? Not every sales man does the flirt-con. You have to have a certain type of personality to carry that off.

He may well be putting it on a bit.

Or he might think she's a bit of alright but consider her too old or be worried that she's after something serious.

Or he might fancy her but has a girlf.

Or he might be genuinely interested but wants to keep her at arms length until he is no longer dealing with her in a professional sense.

I have been with DH for 8+ years now, but before that I was the queen of the flirts (still am a bit, lol, but only when the bloke in question KNOWS how much I love my DH and it's 100% harmless), and I always knew when a bloke was interested in me. I knew it when they just wanted a shag or when they were sweet on me and I knew it when they liked me even if they shouldn't (i.e. those with girlfs). Eye contact is the BIG thing, And yes the schmoozers can do it, but the genuine ones look away embarassed.

Whose to say this bloke doesn't like her?
OP, I think (if possible), you should take a friend with you to the next viewing? Get a second opinion.

There is nothing wrong with fancying someone, and nothing wrong with asking him/her out. What is wrong, or at least a Bad Idea, is persisting when you are getting stonewalls and shutdowns from the other person every time you try to raise the game. Lots of people are friendly, lots of people like a little bit of mild flirtation, but don't necessarily want more than that. particularly in a professional context.
I used to speculate excitedly that anyone I fancied and actually had a conversation with must fancy me too (or he would have puked or run away or shouted loudly about his girlfriend or something), and was often wrong. But this was when I was about 15.

I also feel the stalker comments are uncalled for.

Stalking is a crime. It is the repeated and continued following, watching and harrassment of another person after they have made it clear they want no contact with you. It can leave victims terrified and traumatised.

For goodness sake, this woman has made one non-committal comment about meeting up at some point to this bloke and has flirted a bit. She has a crush. Perhaps in her head she's got a bit carried away with it all, but she is not a stalker. She hasn't done anything wrong.

I don't obviously know what this man's motives are but, just so you know, it's not all about the sale. Look at the Property / DIY section and you'll see EAs are also measured on how many people they bring round for viewings.

We were pushed to see blatantly unsuitable properties because of this.

Thank you vrey much to everyone who commented today! thank God I got replies from people now who are thoughtful and actually READ my posts properly unlike the agressive posters before who saw one sentence out of context and accused me of all sorts!
Makey - thank you! I thought it was obvious but not to those people!
SGV, just to confirm, I'm definetely not planning to persist regardless - all the discussion and my analysing is done here because it just helps to share with (friendly!) others, and get a perspective. I actually was never expecting him to say to a meeting - just thought I'd tried as many people suggested it plus i thought I won't see him again and i didn't have his phone number - i thought if he said No that's that, but did want to give it last minute try- as i sense we do like each other, though now after reading helpful comments i can see that fancying/liking is not always the same as acting on it or real interest. It's just as he did say yes to meeting i felt very positive - but next time we still had to meet he didn't mention it or anything else on those lines - and not surprisibngly i felt a bit puzzled/knocked back. The last thing i was going to do is pursue him regardless - it;s completely up to him if he was interested.
Grainger - that was exactly my line of thinking, all these possibilities! I was hoping for the last one - keeping distance until i buy something (with then or otherwise) - that's how i read his comment that the phone number will have to wait until then - though I did feel a bit uneasy (it meant he wasn't THAT interested) but thought he might be cautious. Strange with eye contact, as to strart with he was looking away and looked shy, but later it was very strong and he could hold it more than I could - now last time it was back to him holding back.
Line Runner - i wish my instincts were so good! I usually can tell for sure if someone fancies me, but not whether they aer 'sweet' on me or up to something serious (unless they say) that's my limit. How did you know with all the encouragement from that young guy, that he didn't want to be asked out? it sounds kind of similar to 'my' guy (just assuming he wasn't putting on a show).
Heads, with this agency a buyer seems to be assigned to one agent and either he suggests viewings or if i call the office they book me with him - though couple of times at the start he was busy and three wre others. So in a way he's not bringing more people having more viewings with me - I don't know whether the actual number of visits reflects in the pay. He did show me a few unsuitables - but more to the point when we had only one/two viewings they were very lengthy - didn't have to be at all, it was mainly chat, some on personal stuff (like what his parents do, etc). Other agents usually hurry to other viewings - i think he just books long slots with me. But maybe it's also tactics as people described.

'never expecting him to say yes' i meant

'I used to speculate excitedly that anyone I fancied and actually had a conversation with must fancy me too (or he would have puked or run away or shouted loudly about his girlfriend or something), and was often wrong. But this was when I was about 15.'

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