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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Support for those in emotionally abusive relationships 4

998 replies

MadameOvary · 30/08/2011 15:31

Hello everyone - end of last thread kind of took us by surprise!
Will copy in links etc

OP posts:
ItsMeAndMyPuppyNow · 07/09/2011 09:54

Oh my goodness, no, BreakFree, it's no way to live.

I don't know why you can't ring WA. It could be a collection of all the reasons you say. One reason you don't mention is this: maybe you're scared that they will make it all real, ie. confirm that this is as bad as it feels to you.

Trust your feelings. You know in your gut this is not right; that it certainly is not right for you or for your children. Why would you need to feel afraid of not being able to convince someone else? If it's not right for you, it's not right for you. No-one else needs convincing.

...and frankly, WA would be the last people to laugh at you for what you describe in your post. Call them; it will feel good to talk. Particularly to professionals who get what you are feeling.

foolonthehill · 07/09/2011 10:20

Boundaries....ahh yes, I used to have those. Along with some idea of what reasonable adult behaviour is and how to communicate without sounding like an autodictat!!!

CardyMow · 07/09/2011 10:24

I'm glad I wasn't wrong to turn my phone off. I wonder what Ex-P will say when he comes round to see DS2 & DS3 this afternoon when he gets here after he's finished work?

foolonthehill · 07/09/2011 10:26

Breakfree feel completely the same....think we are so used to trying to appear and make things normal that we also feel failure if we get help......sending webby strength vibes to you. He mustn't treat you like this find the strength from somewhere....any RL friends in the loop who could sit in a different room whilst you call so you are not worried he will suddenly appear in the middle???
This is one of my reasons I can't make calls ( completely unreasonable as sometimes I am even scared when he is in a different country with work........how devious can even he be???)

Think you might have made me so mad I can feel a possible phone call to WA coming on....just need to find space from the children.

foolonthehill · 07/09/2011 10:56

feeling guilty...MIL came and sat on my sofa for 3 hours last night whilst FIL at meeting nearby (very inconvenient as needed to do stuff....). Ended up telling her a little bit of what her offspring has been like to me for the last 13 years (not all of it) now feel like manipulative cow as I have always thought he ought to have a "safe" place where he can go and be listened to if he needs.
Also ended up crying in public (hate that) after dropping children off at school when someone I only know vaguely cheerily asked me how the summer had gone and I couldn't quite fix the grin and "fine thanks" fast enough.......

Hate, hate , hate being like this....felt almost better before I realised I was in abusive relationship....unravelling all over the place............

ItsMeAndMyPuppyNow · 07/09/2011 11:03

It's OK, foolonthehill. You are entitled to unravel. I unravelled a lot, and (maybe I'm lucky) the people who were around at the time responded so well and lovingly that I now have a handful of new friends who were previously just acquaintances.

Regarding your MIL: I had PILs who were always lovely to me. I told them what had been going on -- not everyting, but salient examples. They were sorry. They still love and support their son. I doubt they are able to see him as "abusive", though.

Your PILs will make their own choices in how they choose to view the situation. You will not be able to influence their view one way or the other. The best you can hope for is that they acknowledge how you feel, even if they don't share your feelings (I think I got that from PILs, but I have now cut contact since, like you, I felt that they were my ex's "safe haven", and therefore we had nothing more to share. They are a loss from my life, quite frankly, but one I accept along with all the other losses).

I don't know if I'm making sense. My point is: don't feel guilty. Your MIL is her own person. What she thinks or doesn't think will be down to her own self, not anything you say or do.

foolonthehill · 07/09/2011 11:18

I started reading this thread when a very helpful poster told my other self that what i was posting on was a relationship issue....dressed up as something else (Hooray for insightful MNetters)it has seriously changed my views on what the kids and I are going thru'.

There are so many things I have discovered over just a few days....when i read all your experiences and realise that I am outraged, stupified and angry that a man can treat their DP/DC like this...then realise that I am putting up with the same and thinking it's normal and i can make it better.

Cannot believe how stupid I am being.....so THANKKYOU for sharing your pain and your journeys...just perhaps I will work out what to do in RL eventually.Confused

ItsMeAndMyPuppyNow · 07/09/2011 11:29

You will! Smile

thisishowifeel · 07/09/2011 11:55

breakfree Print off your message and hand it to your GP. You need say no more.

Yes, they project their behaviour on to you. Everything he accuses you of is in fact him. Once I cottoned on to this, and had it confirmed by shrinky mates, it was really rather empowering. It tells you the state of his mind you see!

With mine, I went through a time of suspecting drug abuse, but the thing that makes me doubt this now, is the fact that he's never accused me of being a druggy. All the other stuff that ever accused me of is the stuff that's wrong with him! This knowledge is very powerful.

I have also become aware that he is "acting out" scenes from his childhood. I am usually cast in the role of his mother. I have been awake since 4.30 this morning going over various events, ad being able to match them up with events he's told me about from his childhood.

I have read about acting out before, but feel the need to have another look.

It makes me wonder about my role too you see. My therapy maybe subconsciously stopped me from acting out the allotted role. My shrink friend said that the courses that he has done is often called the "divorce course" as so many people on it realise their own dusfunction, and begin tochange...which inevitably changes the fundamental dynamic of their relationships.

This is why personal therapy is so important for us on this thread. If we change...they have to! Or go. Simples...until you start living it. ;-/

bigbuttons · 07/09/2011 13:24

breakfree this is exactly how my twat behaves. Last time he had n outburst like the one you describe I phoned women's aid and the police. Don't be scared to phone women's aid, abuse is not about being beaten. Women's aid were very sympathetic and supportive.

foolonthehill · 07/09/2011 13:36

breakfree thanks...was so angry at your situation (mirroring mine so exactly) that actually phoned someone and made an appointment...hope you can do the same,

TIHIFgreat idea about printing the message for GP...lucky BF's post is so coherent, I mostly just do little sad vents!! your message also gave me kick up the BS

This is why personal therapy is so important for us on this thread. If we change...they have to! Or go. Simples...until you start living it. ;-/

stillConfused but maybe[smile} one day???

babyhammock · 07/09/2011 23:10

Anyone see horizon on BBC2 about psychopaths?
Interesting but didn't like the end.. they can't help it???? er does that make a difference. It was like it could be used as an excuse for them/by them.

On another note, I wonder how many P's on here have the big blank space in the middle of their brain

MadameOvary · 07/09/2011 23:23

breakfree that is horrific. Dont minimise it, please. It is another level of abuse when the children are involved. Find that tiny nugget of defiance inside you (we are urging you on!) and call Women's Aid.

OP posts:
CardyMow · 07/09/2011 23:32

Ex-P claimed he got busy and sidetracked when he was meant to ring. When I asked what he was busy with (as I knew he'd finished work an hour before he was meant to ring - he mumbled that he was on facebook and he lost track of the time...FGS fannying around on fb is NOT more important than phoning your 7yo son ON TIME when you have said you will, and phoning during dinner time will just get the phone turned off. I do the same with my NArc mother too.

We had a quiet chat away from the dc about how he needs to be responsible for timekeeping, and to phone when he says he is going to, as my phone will be switched off if it inconvenient for me to answer it. I will NOT have him messing my DS2 or me about like this!

I am being MORE than fair over access, he is allowed to come into MY home to see DS2 & DS3, as DS3 is too little to be apart from me, twice a week at least after work for 4-5 hours, plus he has DS2 overnight every other Saturday. I can't possibly BE fairer, all I ask in return is that he keeps his promises to the children.

He only got paid last Thursday (he is fortnightly paid ATM), and he is saying that he is 'too skint' to help me buy DS2 a new school sweatshirt this week. I was going to buy the other one. WTF does he DO with his money? Oh, I know - his payments on his top of the range laptop, and the new bike he has boguht himself this week. Because a flashy bike is more important to him than his son wearing school uniform that fits.

garlicnutter · 07/09/2011 23:58

He sounds more like your teenage son than the father of your kids, loudlass ...

CardyMow · 08/09/2011 01:12

Tell me about it...

CardyMow · 08/09/2011 01:17

I will, of course find the money from my arse to pay for both sweatshirts for DS2. He will probably give me the money when he gets paid. As long as I remind him on the day he gets paid.

Still, not as bad as Ex-H and his £1.36 a week maintenance that will stop in January when his partner has their second dc together. I also have to find the money from the tree in the back garden that obviously grows it to buy DS1 two school sweatshirts. Because he can't possibly afford to help me out with it when he pays his maintenance. I bite my tongue and try not to yell at him that it's called getting a fucking JOB you lazy arsehole.

Still, DD's dad actually gave me £50 this month to get her some uniform with. Of course, that makes up for the last 13 years when I've had to pay for all her clothes...

I DO pick them, don't I??

bejeezus · 08/09/2011 11:16

LOUDLASS have you spoken to the school about school sweatshirts? Our keeps some for people that cant afford them. School sweatshirts get on my nerves. The rest of the uniform is really cheap in Asda etc because they are made by child slaves in India but the sweatshirts break the bank

baby will watch that Horizon on demand, if its availoable

SOOOooooo.....we went for our first Mediation appointment yesterday. Its was worse than useless in my opinion and only served to enflame our situation, whilst the 'mediator' sat there barely listening and going 'hmmmm' 'uhu' etc. She said not to talk about the past but to concentrate on how to move forward. How is that possible????? the failure to resolve the financial issues are BECAUSE of the past.

He told lots of fibs, about how much he had contributed to the household bills/ how much money he had borrowed off me/ the equity value/ about his assets--and then irrelevant stuff about my character/motives and this fecking 'secret agenda' he attributes to me. I apparently FORCED him to take jobs he didnt want, I FORCED him to take us as a family to visit his family in his country, I FORCED him to have a second baby.

I am genuinely shocked that he lied to a third party. I dont think he is lying, I really think that IS his truth. He really believes what he says is true.

I would like to ask you all what you would do with this situation

We are both broke, with no savings and barely enough to pay bills. He will not move out until he has a share of the equity in the house. The equity is very small and I feel his share is cancelled out by assets in his country which we have aquired whilst being married. He thinks that those assets should not be considered and he wants a sum of money for a deposit and to set up home. He 'understands' (because he is sooooo understanding!) that I dont have £4000 (!?:@%$£) to give him and so he proposes that he doesnt pay child maintenence for 2 years so that he can recoup this money. His maintenece payments would be around £200/month but would make the difference of me really really struggling and being just OK. After mediation yesterday where I said I didnt feel I owed him any money, he has threatened that if I dont agree to him paying no maintenance then he will report me for claiming WTC and CTC as a single parent when I wasnt single!!!

He is referring to a time 3 years ago when he got arrested for drink driving; lost his license;lost his job; lost our home which was attached to job and also lost the opportunity of a fresh start in the country which was what the job was for. He also ended up in hospital through drinking-sedated and on a drip for 48 hours. I had had enough at that point and seperated our finances; he came back into the family home as he had no where else to go. And over a period of time my resolve vanished and we were back together. SO at some point in there I probably was claiming fraudulently; I mean I cant say what date and time we 'got back together'. And if the husband reports the wife then surely he will be believed anyway. I could really do without the hassle of having to prove myself (which might be difficult to do).

Although I feel he is taking the piss, I am verging on agreeing to wavering the child maintenance claim just to get him out of the house and to put an end to all of this. Surely its worth one last sacrifice?

Christ-thanks for reading!

bejeezus · 08/09/2011 11:19

so...who ever it was that asked for opinions on mediation yonks ago...No its shit, dont bother.

She kept saying to him 'yes, I can see you are hurting' 'I can see why you feel entitled to that'

yes--because he feels fecking entitled to everything! AND the only reason I am not visibly hurting is because I am now hard as nails having done prolonged agony for the duration of this liberty taking marriage

fucker

bejeezus · 08/09/2011 11:21

Loudlass

I keep sitting in coffee shops with wee dd2, hoping that inspiration for a book will hit me like JK Rowling!! Then I can sell my books at extortinate prices to other struggling single parents and make a fortune

reasonstobecheerful · 08/09/2011 12:08

Breakfree I feel for you, mine is just like that, what is it with them that at the first sign of someone saying something they don't like you instantly get called a bitch? Mine blanked my son completely yesterday, walked past him in my hallway as if he wasn't there, I happened to mention later that I thought he was rude and got told to fuck off that I'm a stupid c bitch. And then the accusations of wanting other blokes got trotted out, he's going to laugh apparently when I go to my son's wedding because my ex husband will be there and I'll have to spend all day with him but of course that's what I want isn't it blah blah. Think my phone will be off that day I'm not going to be bombarded with texts and abusive calls like the last time I dared to go out. Arrggghh.

foolonthehill · 08/09/2011 17:26

Ohh my Lord...is this what's coming?????????????????????????? think I want to go hide my head in the sand again.

Money !!!!!* poor girls...if these guys ever even had an inkling of what they had put you all through! But I guess that's the point isn't it?? They are so messed they haven't the foggiest and live in LaLa land where they're really "worth it".

bejeezus surely someone in the system can work it for you seeing what an absolute he is?? And I cannot believe that assets abroad bought whilst you were together don't count...they do if he dies or if you die...i know because I'm just sorting this out for some relatives...since you're both in the family home I would subtly photocopy all records of assets and bank statements that show you both paying for them (and everything else), the mediator might be useless but lawyers LOVE documents!!!!

notsorted · 08/09/2011 20:38

Dear Bejeezus, it was me asking about mediation (ex suggested it then when discovered it wasn't on legal aid cos of his circs, he pulled out - I'll only be an complete c* if it doesn't cost me anything).
I guess the thing about mediation is that it requires some honesty and maturity, but more than half the exes who end up there are probably incapable of either so it's likely to fail).
Do get as many documents/emails/statements etc as you can. If it goes to lawyers proof is worth gold. Hold your fire and your counsel until you have amassed all the stuff you need. Good luck

bejeezus · 08/09/2011 20:42

thanks fool and notsorted

to be honest, Im done in. Ive had it. I dont have it in me to fight him any more about anything. What IS left is a determination to GET HIM OUT. So I might have to settle for that as an outcome.

There is enough to sort out with divorce papers/ wills/ mortgage, going back to work, 2 dcs. Even if I had the energy, Im not sure I could find the time.

I just want some peace to be honest.

bejeezus · 08/09/2011 20:43

are you going through solicitors notsorted then if youre not having mediation? is he being difficult about money?