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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Support for those in emotionally abusive relationships 3

1001 replies

ItsMeAndMyPuppyNow · 24/07/2011 09:09

New thread - will copy our library of links in the following posts

OP posts:
bejeezus · 21/08/2011 20:16

Can I ask for your opinions- am I being unreasonable?

Been out had a lovely day with dcs today-in town shopping for Dsis birthday presents. Bout 2 hours after we got back DD1 starts complaining of bad headache and nausea. So bad shes crying (and she is normally NEVER ill) so she obviously feels crap (but is not dying).

I phoned up stbxh to ask if he could come home with some Calpol, as I have given her the Ibuprofen I had and it hadnt worked. He said he was at a friends house and they were cooking so he would get the medicine after that in about an hour. I asked if he could just come now with medicine and go back for the food. Friend lives a 5-10 minute drive maximum, you could walk it in 15-20 minutes. He said NO.

DD2 (9 months) was sleeping in cot. Friends which live local all have their own dcs to look after. So I took DD1 to elderly next door neighbour to be watched and gave them a key for the house in case I didnt make it back! Left baby sleeping!!!!

(Grrr...youll probably flame me for that...I know I know I should have taken them all with me but shop is a 1-2 minute walk down the road)

I feel so mad mad MAD with him and so frigging humiliated.
He should have come home shouldnt he?
shouldnt he?

bejeezus · 21/08/2011 20:17

sorry- i know i always come in and talk about me

babyhammock · 21/08/2011 20:44

yes he should have... I guess he didn't because dd1 being in pain just isn't more important than pissing you off... I think that given his previous behaviour that's probably what it amounts to.

hope she's going ok now

babyhammock · 21/08/2011 20:45

sorry 'doing ok' not going ok.... doh!

notsorted · 21/08/2011 21:03

Yes, a normal man who have nipped out to sort his DD's pain. But this is par for the course. He is busy, you are panicking (not unreasonably in the circs) have worked out that your request is reasonable given 3DCs and his whereabouts. So he gets to enjoy pissing you off, making you panic and come up with plan b instead.
It is always good to have a plan b as it lessens his power over you.
Hope calpol has done the trick.
And what you did is fine ... No solution is textbook perfect when you've a sick child.
My fun anecdote on that subject is me so ill with flu last year that I couldn't stand up for dizzyness. He'd just left the house when I tried to get DCs breakfast. Grabbed cereal, milk and bowls then crawled (literally back to bed). Told DC1 to do breakfast. Called him to come back but he was 'busy'.
So DC1 was instructed to cross road to neighbour's to take her to school and come back if they'd already left. DC2 (only 2 and a bit) had to get DVD so I could stick it on computer and bring books to my bed. At lunchtime I had to let him find the biscuits as I couldn't move.
I was utterly incapable of looking after DC2. I think ex got it when he turned up and found DC2 asleep and me clutching wall on way back from bathroom. But he still made me get up to supervise tea.

bejeezus · 21/08/2011 21:24

Aaaaahhh..is that what it is?! to piss me off? thats SICK! so how ill do you think a dc would have to be to be more important than upsetting me?

I feel sickened actually. By this

Hes back now. Without any Calpol. I am apparently being ridiculous, shes ok and I am just over reacting to make him look bad (WTF- to WHO exactly?? do you think he means feel bad-do you think he is actually feeling bad?)

thats what I was thinking though -AM I over reacting? she ISNT that ill. I DID find another way of getting the medicine. So its NOT the end of the world. I dont need to get mad with him....

he's trained me to think like that hasnt he??
light bulb moment

Im LIVID.
I SOOOOOOOooo want to beat him repeatedly with something big and heavy. Hes sat here on the other sofa. watching the TV. Asshole.

notsorted that is terrible. I would like to feel outrage and know that I should. But I can even minimise YOUR terrible ordeals. Christ. I cant wait to be reacting with proper, appropriate and full blown emotions. I bet you were to ill to feel mad? did you ever call him on it? did he ever explain why he wasnt helping you?

bejeezus · 21/08/2011 21:26

oh! yes calpol kicked in- snoring on sofa. hot though. and a funny colour

babyhammock · 21/08/2011 21:38

Glad DD's doing ok now.
Nope I would say he isn't feeling bad for a second..

He's doing a good job of making you feel bad though...and questioning yourself for being upset with him...
These are the facts:
You were quite rightly worried and wanted to help DD asap
You asked him a simple request that he refused because he's an arsehole
You then, because he refused to help, had to do something you weren't comfortable with to get the medicine she needed.
And you're being unreasonableConfused

x

notsorted · 21/08/2011 21:45

Dear BJ whatever you do is wrong. Of course, he thinks he is entitled to opine on state of DDs health, without even being there to see what she was like pre-Calpol.

Look after you DD, with a twat like that you cannot hope for any reasonable response to your feelings.
And as for my little story, of course he didn't apologise. Just said DC1 would misbehave if I wasn't sat at the table.
I managed about 5 mins before I couldn't keep upright any longer. I can't remember if it was before or after I'd had him moaning about toothache and not going to see the dentist ... he has manflu in spades and the idea of anyone very rarely being properly ill is impossible for him to contemplate.

HerHissyness · 21/08/2011 21:50

Even cuntface got me medicine for DS at 2am one time, Mind you, that was possibly because he was out, and because he couldn't hear his phone I called his cousin, who has a ringtone that can wake the dead. Grin

When I asked X another time to get the nappies he'd merely forgotten 4 flights of stairs down in the car, and no-one knew about it, he kicked up an almighty stink.... Then the time I had my 2 front teeth removed, and implant thingies drilled into the gums, he made me wait for hours until he went and got the pain killers..... I was in shock, I was delirious with the pain, but apparently was unreasonable to ask him to get me the pain killers prescribed for me...

Yep, it's all about audience, and all about how it affects YOU!

bejeezus · 21/08/2011 21:53

thanks babyhammock and notsorted

How can they look themselves in the face when they cant/ wont look after their kids?

NS - what kind of father cant cope with his dcs behaviour without his wife for ONE MEAL. mine does the same btw-calls me immediately if any discipline needs doing. Then wonders why they take no notice of him.

what someone said earlier up thread - they are always more tired and more sick than anyone else ever- is very true here.

I think seeing him be like this with the kids really really brings it home-its really not my fault (or any of yous neither).

babyhammock · 21/08/2011 21:55

I've just been saying that! They need to maintain that public image don't they.. it is all about who's watching

Misspixietrix · 22/08/2011 11:11

bejeezus they always do that, my stbx told me i was overeacting when dd got rushed to hospital! funny how he didn't have the guts to tell the paramedics he thought THEY were overeacting eh?!!!! do you know what? re my sit i'm not even upset with him anymore i'm p f**g angry and he jolly well knows it! what's changed in me? i'm no longer SCARED of upsetting him, i've realised I deserve better than this, so do my kids and by hell or high water i'm going to make sure we bloody get it! x

HerHissyness · 22/08/2011 13:09

"i'm no longer SCARED of upsetting him"

THAT is the turning point. Once you get here, there is no turning back!

Go Pixie GO!! We are all behind you!

Bandwithering · 22/08/2011 16:05

Bejeezus, that just shows you doesn't it, how highly he values your judgement!

Even in the absence of any direct knowledge himself he totally and utterly disregards your opinion. He thinks he can make a better guess at your daughter's well-being without being around her.

fumblebuck · 22/08/2011 22:31

Rallying call: here

ThereGoesTheFear · 22/08/2011 23:13

Pixie that warms my cockles :)

Bejeezus I hope your DD is fighting fit now. Reading about your stbxh, and NS's is making me absolutely livid. How dare they!

One of the useful things about this thread is the way I can all get indignant and angry about someone else's mistreatment at the hands of their abusive P/XP. And it's helping me find the anger I need to deal with all my H's bullshit. He also expects me to cater to his whims even when I'm very ill, but when he has the sniffles, the world has to stop. I'm ashamed that I let him do this to me so easily.

Blethermouse How do you know he is damaged and toxic as opposed to immature/ thoughtless/ a person who wants their own way a lot/ hates being slighted/ can't communicate That combination is, by its nature, toxic. Would you dream of behaving like that to a living soul? Far less to the people you're meant to love above all others? Of course not!

lloyd1 · 23/08/2011 21:40

Hi everyone. Back from holiday now. Was not entirely a success. Very emotive and just highlighted problems within my family. When I returned (D)h was full of remorse telling me he loved and missed me etc. I almost brought it until this evening.
I again got the classic what have you been spending my money on line. Apparently I shouldn't have spent £10 of his money on school bags for dc as they already have them. He of course doesn't know that one is too small and one is close to having holes in it.
Just don't know what to do. Feel so alone.

HerHissyness · 23/08/2011 21:55

You are not alone, never forget that eh Lloyd1? Sadly there are many of us!

So what do you think your next move is?

MadameOvary · 23/08/2011 21:55

lloyd1 - I would ignore the barb and say "I've been spending your money on your children. They need new bags as their ones are falling to bits. Can't have people thinking you're too mean poor to buy new schoolbags"

lloyd1 · 23/08/2011 22:34

Don't know. Don't feel I am up to making a life changing decision at the moment. Probably going to wait till children are back at school and than take some time to get my head together and weigh up options. Maybe also some counselling would be good.
Good idea Madame. Bit too late this time though.
Thank you.

notsorted · 23/08/2011 22:56

Lloyd1, think new school year is great time to gather your own strength. Read some books too, if you can ... internet stuff, gather thoughts and perhaps (scary thought) imagine how you and the kids would like to spend Christmas or what you are looking forward to as the nights draw him. Is he a part of it? Where would you like to be next summer? Nothing too concrete but think of good, dreamy plans and then you can address the big stuff

helpmeMN · 24/08/2011 12:18

Hello again all, hope you're all doing OK. Sorry to hear some of these horrible stories.

Disclaimer: stream-of-consciousness alert. My problems are so small compared to some of yours and I almost feel a fraud posting here but I have to write it down somewhere - please feel free to ignore!

We went away for the weekend and it was basically great, I think because we didn't have much time together and he 'behaves' in front of other people. Though tbh he's kind of behaving generally at the mo, picking himself up on things that he knows upset/annoy me - this is part of the cycle, right? Or am I just being circular and displaying confirmation bias?

The only incident really when we were away was when he asked our friend 'did your body feel really knocked about by pregnancy?' and she said 'no not really' and I said 'well it looks like it was', because I knew she would find it funny (she did, she looks amazing and she knows it) and he jumped on it and said 'SEE!!! that's the kind of thing I say to you and you get really cross about. you are a hypocrite'. I let it go at the time (I think, or they started talking amongst themselves and I said it then: 'the thing is, I knew X would find it funny'. Maybe I'M an abusive twat, though - maybe she didn't find it funny at all and just laughed out of politeness! Have worried about it enough since to think that I should just avoid all putdown humour in future.

The other thing was her husband (my friend of 15 years) actually speaks to her in a way I don't really like. Even H said 'he seems a bit of a chauvinist!' She doesn't seem to mind and it was again that thing of 'but X puts up with it, shouldn't I?'. I've seen this in at least two or three relationships and always think 'god, maybe I should just accept it/see the funny side/let it wash over me like they do'. But then the kids learn that it's an acceptable way to speak to someone, don't they?

I think he might think something's up. He's being alternately loving/supportive/cold and weird. Also saying things like 'I can't take any more negative news' 'family is really important' even gave DD1 a lecture on empathy this morning using us as an example 'when I say something to Mummy I think 'maybe she wouldn't like me to say it that way' so I change it...' actually he got a bit stuck at that point!

I do worry that it's just such a MINOR case. Maybe I should just put up and shut up. I totally empathise with the poster who said 'I wanted him just to hit me so at least it was something definite' (and hers had in the end, and PLEASE don't take that the wrong way, I know lots of you are being physically abused and it's absolutely not something to wish for, as well as it being one of those decisive moments that can never be taken back and at the moment I am dreaming of a cordial co-parenting relationship as I think it's a possibility.

Examples I wanted to post or see if anyone recognises:

illness - terrible hypochondriac: it's always worse (esp. than me, I don't think I have ever in ten years been ill without him instantly being symptomlessly iller). When I am ill (I have chronic dreadful allergies) it's my fault for not taking my medicine and it's actually an insult to him. Having said that, I have very little sympathy when he's ill - even when he's actually ill it's an effort to manufacture but I manage it for my own conscience.

compliments: he has virtually never given me a meal he's cooked without telling me it's amazing before I've had a chance to eat any. He also does this with other people. He does all the cooking and considers this one of his virtues, but I end up eating stuff I don't want all the time. He also shows people his work (esp me) and tells them how brilliant it is. It seems so sad that he's basically precluding real compliments and compounding his own low self-esteem. I have never cooked him anything he hasn't made 'suggestions' about, often adding stuff

extravagance: he seems addicted to spending money. I am a natural scrooge and am in a state of almost perpetual anxiety about our savings just disappearing. he can basically justify any spending by thinking of a reason to do it. this morning he said the girls need new watercolour pencils and I know they have some but I felt a strong suggestion that I shouldn't go and look for them (I did, they had disappeared). he then, as he was leaving, on the doorstep, DD1 already outside, suddenly gave me a list of stuff he wanted to buy and why he needed it and I just don't have the energy to argue - he'd sulk and accuse me of being controlling.

the thing is, I worry that I AM controlling. I HATE the lack of control, one of my massive fantasies is having the house the way I like it, everything tidy and in its place, without him coming in with something new (usually second hand, thank god) every day and just leaving it on the floor so I have to decide where it goes. I HATE him just spending willy nilly, buying food and forgetting it in the fridge so I have to throw it out, never accepting the idea of food planning, buying loads of shitty sugary expensive junk for the kids and himself. Maybe I'm just not a relationship/teamwork person. I also struggle in big groups when my role isn't clearly defined. This is a weakness of mine, surely.

But he does all this stuff like 'how are WE going to declutter this house, then?' and 'when are WE going to valet the car' as if mentioning it has discharged his own responsibility and it then becomes my business. I declutter the house about once a week (I am anal, by preference I would live in a white room with a bed and a desk - and obviously a lovely bright kids' room with lots of toys all ordered neatly) and it just pisses me off when he does stuff like that. he then huffs around the house looking for stuff that's mine (I honestly believe there's very little clutter of mine) and says 'what about this wall hanging you broke? what's this still doing here?' when he knows that DD1 broke it and he said he would glue it.

Isn't this all just normal stuff, though, that all women complain about? When someone else's H goes to buy a picnic for the train and comes back saying 'I did really well, only £23', what do they say? Am I just too weak, too doubting of myself to assert myself? With a more assertive, less crippled-by-doubt (always have been) person maybe he wouldn't get a chance to be abusive?

His putdowns have evolved and become quite insidious. If I get compliments he generally will just 'politely' highlight any other reason there might have been behind it e.g. 'she's very polite', 'he just wants to shag you', 'clever X, always knowing what you want to hear'

and still, SORRY, but still maybe he just isn't abusive at all? I'll send my (even) long(er) rant to BeJeezus now I am FINALLY on my own and able to use my laptop and cover my tracks (I could NEVER write whilst he was on the other sofa, he'd leap over and peer at my screen and ask what I was doing).

I really want to go but he's being so sweet and needy, I'd feel like such an enormous bitch. And the kids! And his mum is about to start chemo (he managed to massively offend her on the phone last night before I got back and then told me what had happened, it's so hard, though, to listen when I know how he retro-views the conversations we have).

Oh yeah, the other things I wanted to say were before I ever came on here and read about NPD and EA I had analysed that our arguments/my problems with him all revolved around 'my concerns are not valid' and 'you can't bend the world to fit you' (me to him). That sounds pretty narcy, right?

and what am I here for? is it just to get permission to leave?

ARGH!

rant over

helpmeMN · 24/08/2011 12:27

oh and I am in a constant state of panic about being on this thread. EEK! so worried he will see/I will leave my phone/comp logged on to MN. Why? shouldn't I be able to say all this to him? why do I feel I'm betraying him?

lloyd1 · 24/08/2011 13:55

I am the same. Delete browsing history is my new best friend.

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