Support for those in emotionally abusive relationships 3

[ItsMeAndMyPuppyNow]

New thread - will copy our library of links in the following posts

seriouslynow that is so true. When you're in the peaceful part of the cycle you never ever have the energy to do anything more than just get through the day!!! But you really need to dig deep as they say. The abuse has you in a state of semi-anaethstetised auto-pilot just so that you can function. It's a defence mechanism I guess. And it sort of works. But the problem is that that same mechanism that helps you get through the days prevents you from galvanising yourself and having the energy to plan your future.

so dig deep as they say and leave during the peaceful cycle, even though it goes against your inclination to just 'enjoy' the relative peace and calm.

Actually I did leave in the peaceful cycle. The realisation that I was actually going, (for now as he thought) provoked physical abuse and verbal abuse but I still thinking knowing him, that it could have been worse.

notsorted I had two 'modes'

1. put up and shut up
2. challenging the bad behaviours that any normal person would have found strange/unreasonable.

Even in mode 1) put up and shut up - I could still sometimes annoy him with a 'miserable face' for example.

I just upped and left because I felt I was dying, I had come to the end of the line and just couldn't cope any more. It wasn't anything specific of his doing that caused me to or gave me reason to leave, I left because I felt I had to. That didn't stop him from claiming victim status and turning everything around on me though. I think no matter what you do when you leave an abusive situation you will be 'in the wrong'. The abuser will always blame the victim because he won't want to face up to what he has done, he won't ever take responsibility so you may as well just leave. Remember though, the day you leave you are no a longer a victim, you are a survivor!! Take that knowledge and feel empowered, don't allow him to make you feel guilty for putting yourself first and putting a stop to the abuse.

I think one of the reasons it's so hard is that victim is so accustomed to being blamed, we just take it on and sticking the blame where it belongs is part of the recovery stage and takes time.
Can I ask a question? Ok ex set up mediation, but now cos he's been assessed to have to pay he says he doesn't have the money so won't do it, FFS. Strong NS says surely finding a way to make a workable relationship with DCs is worth selling your granny for (metaphorically), the other NS wonders whether long-term benefit says she shells out one last time to move forward?

It's normal to want a 'reason' to end it. It's normal not to want to blamed for something that isn't your fault. But we're not dealing with 'normal' here.

I helped my ex divorce me for unreasonable behaviour! It doesn't matter what's written on the paper, what counts is the result.

notsorted, I let mine get away with all the money stuff - I made a lot of noise, but ineffectively. I was worn out. I'm still suffering the repercussions of all that, but at least I've only got myself to keep on half a shoestring. You have the DC to think about, so it must be worth playing hardball at least until this matter's settled. Have you, or can you get, a tough & fierce lawyer on your side?

Have got sol. He no longer has. I think he reckoned on legal aid but it's run out or may be his sol said NS is suggesting perfectly acceptable terms and he has stuck head in sand. He has one big asset - house that his parents bought him. He has spent any money he had on it rather than on the family ... nuff said.
Am feeling a bit more sorted so will wait it out until after me and the DCs return from hols.
One big mistake of our relationship was both of us rushing to sort things out without thinking/talking. But then that would be 'normal' ie talking sensibly wouldn't it?
Word to self 'this is not normal'.

Sounds sensible :) Glad you're looking forward to your hols! Have a nice time.

Hello all. I ventured in once about 18 months ago and was told I was having a mid-life crisis. OK, then, buck up, I thought. Move on and everything's the same, I always find myself in Relationships, tying myself in knots. Is it, isn't it? Am I just making it up? Have I decided it's EA, he's a narc and I just pick my evidence to suit that theory? (WHY would I do that, though? Don't think I'm a masochist/sadist!)

Yesterday wrote what was supposed to be my opening post but it turned into 5 pages of Word (anyone bored and want to read it for me?). I THINK I know I want out, but I feel so uncertain of anything, and so utterly stymied by the guilt I would feel.

I then wrote an OP about a stupid fish finger incident that had happened that evening (said didn't want, then tried to eat mine, then walked out of the house when I asked him not to, ignoring my calls and offers of the effing fish finger because I'm such a pathetic PLEASER - claimed later that he 'was just flapping about before leaving' - no apology, naturally) but was literally about to post when door opened and DH came in from night out (EEEK! close window).

We proceeded to have an almost-nice evening (i.e. I was everything he wanted me to be, apart from having sex which was commented on: 'we might as well sleep in single beds, it's not like we're having sex') drinking wine and I even slept (I rarely do) and woke up thinking 'oh, maybe it's not so bad'. But then I read things here and some of the parallels are so uncanny. Especially the Bandwithering (? I think) thing about 'what? you never told me that?' - happens almost every time. No idea whether he doesn't listen to a fucking word I say or he's just testing me. I don't think he even knows the truth as he's so compulsively dishonest with himself and is the worst kind of bullshitter i.e. has to convince himself his own bullshit is true so on some level he believes himself to be authentic.

Sorry, this is totally incoherent. Perhaps I should gather my thoughts, namechange again and come back.

Let it all out, in bits if it helps. I had a compulsive liar too. It's the worst sort of power - 'If I get away with that little porky, then I can try this one on too. I'm the liar king.'
And when anyone gets near the truth of the matter, run for the hills or kick up dust storm of confusion.
Check out Lundy Bancroft on the web and any of the stuff at the top of the thread. And yes, you will start questioning yourself. It is a mindf*, but gradually the fog lifts.

When your sleep depends on your husband's moods, you haven't got a good marriage.

I am heartily in favour of agreeing that you must be paranoid/jealous/insane/menopausal/etc and that you'd better get some help to find out what's wrong with you and fix it. This means you get royal approval to see a counsellor - not only will it save you the headfuckery of trying to work out if you were imagining after all, but you also get help to see your way clear and get out :)

Worked for me. He's still convinced I was "so crazy, I had to see a psychiatrist" as far as I know, but that's no skin off my nose.

HelpmeMN, sorry you were fobbed off 18m ago, but tbh, perhaps you may not have been ready to have heard the truth then.

You have figured it out for yourself, and that is the best way, cos then you can actually decide what YOU are going to do next.

As the others say, it really doesn't matter what anyone thinks of you, as long as you have the truth in your hand.

The truth is that he is abusive not supportive,
he is working against you not with you,
he is trying to destroy your self esteem not build it
to bring you down not lift you up.
Your happiness makes him sad/angry/resentful
Your success upsets him.

So if HE thinks you are crazy, neurotic, paranoid, jealous, menopausal - who cares?

You are none of these things, you are simply refusing to be trodden into the carpet. HE is the one with real problems! Real problems that generally can't be fixed either!

Get yourself the Lundy book, have a look at this 'Losers' link and see if anything resonates with you.

Otherwise, keep posting here if it helps you, float stuff past us if it helps, use US as your sanity check.

Main thing is, not to doubt yourself; YOU think it's EA, YOU feel abused/manipulated/oppressed, that is all that matters. YOU are NOT happy.

If it quacks like a duck...

He lies in front of me, to me, tries to get me in on his lies with him. They're usually stupid, inconsequential things about whether someone's done something or said something, but it's just another example of trying to spin me away from reality, as far as I can see. He is literally impossible. I was on the phone to someone explaining what time we'd left, said 9.30, he interrupted saying 'no! it was 9.15!' and we both KNEW it wasn't - I woke up at 9.15. (sorry, very boring detail!). I then said 'um, it wasn't 9.15' when the phonecall was over, and he even tried to say 'yes it was', before saying it was only an exaggeration and so what.

On another level I still feel so weird about writing this down. It feels like I am betraying him and am making a mountain out of a molehill even though I know FULL WELL I only think that because that is what HE has conditioned me to think. ARGH! where is me in all this?

The thing is, I have no fear whatsoever of being on my own. It would be exciting! I don't even fear it's not the right thing for the kids, they're very lucky and have great relationships with both of us. We can afford it, luckily (only because we have savings (which I earned, btw) - neither of us has consistent work). I don't care what people think or say. I think I would retain the sympathy of a lot of our friends and that even his family would understand (possibly). I'm 33 and feel like the future offers a lot (e.g. sex with hot young men) that it might not in 10 years of constantly getting more 'ground down' (external comment - also get 'exhausted', and 'lost joie de vivre' - though only he says 'joyless' and 'no sense of humour' - this is when I don't find it funny being called 'knobface' because he had to repeat 'gizzkiss' three times.)

BUT I fear for him. He has no friends, really, he depends SO much on me for everything, every conversation, every opinion (ha! like he listens...). Money, organisation, clearing up all his shit he leaves all over the floor (and even literally in the loo lately - would introduce him to the loo brush but don't know what words to use that wouldn't cause offence); I do worry what kind of state his flat would be in if he were to move out and have the kids overnight! He's starting a business and it's all going tits up anyway and I worry that if I leave him now he'll be too upset to get a job, carry on with the business. He struggles to get on with people, is not close to his family (they're awful). My ideal would be that he hooks up with someone straight away of a more compatible personality type (and independent wealth!). His mum is about to start chemo.

I guess my only niggles are my concerns for him, the worries over the practicalities, and then the fact that I do spend a lot of time living in a fantasy world (I'm an aspiring writer), and that I'm still probably grieving for my dad whom I adored and lost very suddenly in March - but the concerns/behaviour predate that by a long way. AND (just to sound completely circular and bonkers) that I've already made the decision and I'm not putting enough thought into making it work.

thanks, yep, loads, and the verbal abuse one on page 1 too. So why do I feel so goddamn disloyal and guilty???? because I feel sorry for him? He has terribly low self-esteem but all my friends think he's SO confident, SO sure of himself. He is the father of my kids, though. I want him to be happy, safe, functional. I want us to be able to work together and not co-parent without speaking (!) like my parents did for 20 years. I think that will be made more possible by splitting now.

SORRY this is so bitty. reams and reams and reams to say...

oh, the other thing is, my confidence isn't damaged. I just feel kind of righteous. I still feel OK-looking, clever, competent, capable. I think over the years I've just realised he's talking shit with his putdowns and in the end it's made me feel better about myself (he only needs to put me down because I'm so great ;-)). Does that sound really weird? and that's not at all a typical marker of EA, is it?

ps if anyone wants (!) to read my five page essay (it's in bullet points...) then please PM me. In a way I'd love to hear that I'm just being an oversensitive dickhead with romantic ideas above my station, but in a way I just really want to go. We've 'done' counselling twice (one session 3 years ago, about 3/4 sessions last Christmas) but each time I suggest it it's like I'm suggesting he cut off his bollocks for my personal entertainment.

STOP WORRYING ABOUT HIM!

He's not worrying about YOU!

You are 33, jesus, that is so young, you have a whole life in front of you, FGS, ditch this guy as soon as possible. Let him be whatever he can be.

I am 43, and my abusive relationship ended this year, having started 10 years ago. The options for a life I have now are VASTLY different to the ones that lie ahead of you! The sooner you leave this guy, the sooner you can get on with the business of living better, with someone that loves you properly.

I am sorry to hear about your Dad, but can you not gain further strength from his sudden death, in that we none of us know what is around the corner and owe it to ourselves to live the best life possible?

Oh and the day that anyone above the age of 5 leaves SHIT on the bathroom floor is the day I TELL them to clean it up in words of one syllable, not caring if I offend or not! Hand him the ffing brush and say 'You missed, A LOT!'

it wasn't on the floor, it was in the loo!!!! sorry, I knew I should have edited out that bit. it's just I always end up doing the brush bit for him.

does anyone else have that feeling of 'oh, he just looks bad, he's not that bad, I'm painting an awful picture of him, you'd be surprised how nice he was if you met him and think I was a dickhead'?

and yes, I think it was dad's death that really set me thinking properly about this. it really isn't a dress rehearsal, is it :(

Thank you xxx

and I know why, of course. it's because I've been taught for ten years that my opinion is no good and simply doesn't matter. and this is my opinion. and a mean part of me is going to enjoy him saying 'but you're wrong, you don't feel like this, you shouldn't want to leave' and me saying 'ok, well, I guess I'll just be wrong then'. and he teases me for always reading reviews immediately after watching films, to see what other people thought because I don't trust myself :(

I can't bear the idea of still feeling like this in ten years' time. and I honestly don't believe I'm ever going to NOT feel like this. Unless he has years of therapy and sorts out his issues.

he he, still my comment stands, hand him the brush and tell him to clear up after himself. disgusting!

EVERYONE on this thread will tell you that their H/P is/was highly thought of! All of them will have a ton of friends and neighbours that think they are wonderful... That is part of their plan - to isolate you further!

and I know why, of course. it's because I've been taught for ten years that my opinion is no good and simply doesn't matter. and this is my opinion. and a mean part of me is going to enjoy him saying 'but you're wrong, you don't feel like this, you shouldn't want to leave' and me saying 'ok, well, I guess I'll just be wrong then'. and he teases me for always reading reviews immediately after watching films, to see what other people thought because I don't trust myself :(

I can't bear the idea of still feeling like this in ten years' time. and I honestly don't believe I'm ever going to NOT feel like this. Unless he has years of therapy and sorts out his issues.

luckily he hasn't managed to isolate me from my friends, though he does slag a lot of them off and question their reasons for being my friend, AND tell me I surround myself with people who tell me what I want to hear. Er, but you surround yourself with me, and then make it impossible for me to tell you anything other than what you want to hear!

the mirroring is the worst bit for me. I KNOW I do a lot of the behaviour too. BUT I'm sure it's always reactive. I very, very rarely start stuff.

don't know if I used 'mirroring' right - we spend an awful lot of time together (not my choice, I complain about it and he says I'm 'weird' and 'wrong' not to want to be in each other's pockets 24/7) and sometimes it's so hard to see who's done what and who's behaving how - does that make any sense? I just cling to the fact that I have a LOT of highly functional relationships outside this one (friends, family etc.) and he... doesn't.

he's home soon, so am paranoid and have to go. but PLEASE keep commenting, it is SO helpful.

Give yourself another 10 years of this, and you WON'T have your friends anymore, that is the next stage....

TBH, if you stay in this relationship for another 10 years and it's just the same as it is today, you'd be LUCKY! In that it's no WORSE! when his methods to oppress and upset you fail, he will ramp them up, until they do!

Please read Lundy Bancroft - Why Does He Do That It will help you understand it all, help you understand that you didn't cause this and you can't fix it either. This book won't scare you, I promise, it forgives you, it removes all blame and gives you so much back. Trust me! I bought this book and it took me a year to pluck up the courage to read it, and I wished I had read it sooner.

Gave me a clarity and decisiveness I never dreamed of regaining.

HM - he only needs to put me down because I'm so great ... that's not a typical marker of EA, is it?

It's a marker of Narcissism. When you first met, did you seem to have a mystery connection? Was he pushy about getting married and/or having children?