DP doesn't believe in marriage

[EvilDrPorkChop]

Bit of background. I have been a lurker for many years but have used to post more frequently about 6/7 years ago.

Have been with DP for almost 2 years. Planning to move in over next few months. I have one ds. He has three dds.

He was not married to the mother of his daughters, although she wanted to. He does not see the need for marriage. His parents were divorced, he is not sure if this is the reason. Even though I am divorced, I still value marriage and think it is important.

I love DP dearly but am starting to really resent his attitude to marriage. He is a very stubborn sort, I think he is unlikely to change his mind. Does anyone have any experience of this? Before I uproot my son and move in with him, I need to have this straight in my head. Do I stick to my guns and therefore forfeit what is otherwise a good relationship? Or do I grin and bear it... and if so, how do I silence the voice in my head that is screaming "IF HE REALLY LOVED YOU, HE WOULD MARRY YOU!" (always wanted to do one of those!)

In that case, no.

He's not offering enough.

You want marriage and kids, he wants a live-in girlfriend.

If you move in you will be settling.

If I were 37 and divorced with 1 child I would be looking to start a new family with someone. That's not what he's going to give you.

Hmmmmmmmmmm spidookly, I see what you're saying. I will probably be flayed alive for saying this, but I believe I would be happy accepting one of the two. You don't get all you want in life. It trivialises it, it sounds like I want sandals and boots, but can only afford one so I have to compromise. But there isn't much movement on his side, is there?!

would you consider showing him this thread? I think he needs to understand what is at stake here, if you decide marriage is a deal breaker. You would have to walk away.

Coconuts. He is most sniffy about forums. Ridiculous I know. It would weaken my argument if I showed him, he would think I was being neurotic. So I think I shall keep this for my own private use and reference!

fair enough, I can understand that.

If this were me, then I would think its less about the marriage thing and much more about sort out where you all (children included) stand financially etc before moving in.

The devil is in the detail...

He pays for everything = he owes you nothing. It gives him control and the ability to walk away when he wants to.

If that is how he treated the mother of his three children you don't stand a chance.

Enjoy bring with him but don't change your life for him. 10 miles in London means a new area and a new school. A big upheaval by you but nothing in return for you.

Being not bring

EvilDrPorkChop - I would be very wary of moving in with him. The reason he is offering to pay for everything and "let" you pay for food is that nothing you pay for will count towards any settlement if you split.

If het let you pay towards the mortgage you would be entitled to part of the house if you split. He knows this. And is happy to leave you and the mother of his child with nothing.

This is not an equal relationship. He wants it all his way and has no real desire to share anything in his life with you. That is why he is against marriage.

If he thinks you are a golddigger because you want to take sensible precautions about your future security, then that tells you what you need to know about his attitude towards it.

Why are you the one doing the compromising here? The solution is not to get married, but not to move in together until you get married...

"He pays for everything = he owes you nothing. It gives him control and the ability to walk away when he wants to."

Yes, but if there are no joint children and PorkChop is not giving up her own mortgage to pay for his, and he is the higher earner, what exactly is it that he walks away with that PorkChop should have?

To be honest if I had 3 children and owned a house I am not sure I would marry my next partner if we were not going to have children and dp was the lower earner. I would be 100% happy to support the dp, pay the majority of costs etc if I were the higher earner, but marriage means that on any break up, or maybe in a standard will arangement the inheritance to the 3 dds would be compomised.

Why shouldn't someone have the ability to walk away if the relationshipbreas down, if there are no children?

However, OP, I wouldn't be so casual as to just buy food (whihc could in any case be v expensive). Why not draw up a budget of your household and domestic running costs, then each pay a pro rata amount according to your earnings into that account - then your cntribution to the mortgage will be veifiable. I would draw up acontract between you saying hat your cntribution will be.

But in truth, unless you are actually paying into the mortgage and / or have children and stop working to look afte them, I'm not sure what 'settlement' you would be missing out on if you split.

Surely if the relationship did not work out you would move out with your son to another rented accomodation?

As you would if he passed away.

Really no need to discuss future finances surely?

As time passes he may well change his will to make provision for you but it is far to early to be discussing it before you move in, it's a conversation for further down the line in a good few years.

The OP might buy her own property if she were not involved with him. She might end up paying money to maintain his property while having no claim on it. She might meet a more generous man if not involved with him!

Sorry, but everything about this man screams that he sees women as disposable and that he has a fundamental opposition to committment.

I'd want more security than 'I can just rent somewhere else if it falls apart' when moving in with my kid and all my stuff.

I'd also want to know any partner of mine wouldn't be out on their ear if I popped my clogs, if I was him.

The OP is entitled to security. Moving 10 miles probably doesn't sound much to those (like me) who live in the sticks. However in London, as in any big city, it is a considerable distance.

The OP will be moving from an area where she feels comfortable and where she and her dc have friends. Her dc will most likely have to move schools and make new friends.

To my mind that is a huge commitment. In return her dp gives her a shelf in the bathroom cabinet and part of the wardrobe. Not much is it? I wouldn't do it to myself or my Ds for nothing in return. I don't mean financial return but I do mean a level of commitment that this man doesn't want to give. If I wanted to get married and have more dcs I wouldn't be making the move the OP is planning.

I think he's entitled to his belief. I don't like this thing of feeling he has to be 'converted' -it's not right. Why can't you just respect his beliefs. If make him get married against his will then he'll resent you for it.

I don't want to get married. I never did and I never will. My DP knows this and accepts that's me and how I am.

You knew this about him but yet now you are trying to change him.
Can't you just get a Solicitor to work out a financial agreement?

Marriage doesn't make anything more secure, sure don't something like 50% go wrong anyway and then its huge expense/complications and mess to get out of it? Feeling secure is an illusion as many have learned to their bitter cost.

It's nothing to do with commitment. I'm totally committed to my DP but I believe relationships are as good as they are each day. That's all we have, the present. To me marriage just means 'i've got you legally trapped now so I can start relaxing/making no effort/resting on my laurels' etc

To me people who insist on marriage are insecure. It's like they want to legally bind themselves to that person so they can't change their minds. Why can't you just respect the mans feelings.

I've got my own house, money everything. I depend on a man for nothing and that's the way I like it.

As much as you have a voice in your head saying 'if he really loved me he'd marry me'

He could easily say 'well if you really loved me you'd drop the subject'

Yeah, if you really loved him you'd stop asking for all the things you want and just accept the barely anything he's prepared to give you.

Er... no.

Thankfully I'm in a marriage where the present is not all we've got. We've got a past and a future. You know, and children.

Don't get married if you don't want, but fuck off with your calling people who do want to get married insecure. Being unable to trust your partner to provide for you in any way sounds like insecurity to me.

Thanks so much to everyone who has contributed. I am really grateful and now I have a lot to think about. I vanished last night because ds came back, then had a three hour conversation on the phone with the man of the hour, trying to thrash all of this out. Not really much further forward!

It's a lot to think about but it isn't just you to consider, you have your Ds. Move in on his terms if that's what you want but also know what you would do if it didn't work out. Would you be able to move back to where you were living? Would you have to uproot your Ds again? How old is he? If he's 16 and at an age where he may be moving schools anyway then that is easier.

I'd advise you not to move in with this man, at least until you've got everything sorted and maybe not even then. He doesn't want to get married but it is important to you. Yes, his feelings are as valid as yours but your feelings are as valid as his. Then there's the child/no child thing, he definitely doesn't want children but you're not sure yet. Until you are 100% sure that a. you can live with this man without getting married and b. you definitely don't want children then don't even consider moving in with him because the resentment you could eventually feel, about not getting married, would have a detrimental effect on your relationship.

Then there's the other issues, such as leaving yourself financially vulnerable if you two split. I have to agree with Spidookily when she says that this man wants a live in girlfriend. He doesn't want marriage or kids but he does want to make life easier for himself by having you move in.

I'd ignore EveryDaysAnAudition's trying to put you squarely in the wrong. You're not, you just want different things to this man.

Mollie I will have to apply for ds secondary school in October hence moving in the Summer. The local school is actually excellent and better than I'm in the catchment for currently. The area isn't as good, however. If things didn't work out (and who can they say will?), I think realistically I would have to swallow it and rent something in the area and keep ds at the school.

That's exactly it Chaotic. I said to him last night that relationships are about compromise - we have differing beliefs - so we both have to work out how far we are prepared to compromise.

Good relationships are not about compromise.

They're about being with someone who shares the same goals and desires as you, who loves you and wants to build a future and a family together.

You have to find ways to compromise to live together and make things happen, but compromise isn't what it's about.

It would be good to write down a list of what compromises you would bs making and what compromises by him. Seeing it in black and white might help you focus on the things that concern you. From what you say he doesn't appear to be making any compromises at all.

My DH didn't want to get married having been screwed over by his ex wife, to which I replied well that's fine but we will not be having children together then because I have been screwed over by an ex DP and as a single parent of one was not prepared to end up a single parent of two.
We married 12 months later, no way was he having his cake and eating it, if it's important to you then do not back down.

I wouldn't have any children with him. Am really suspicious of "don't believe in marriage". If it's meaningless to him, and important to you, why won't he do it?