My sister's DH tried to get her to have an abortion at 23 weeks

[motorway]

I've name changed for this but I feel a bit deja vu because I posted about almost exactly the same thing a copule of years ago.

My sister's DH has been married before and already has teenaged children. Before they got married they had quite a lot of conversations/arguements about her wanting children and him not wanting any more. She (stupidly/naively) 'forgot' to take the pill and got pregnant. This resulted in loads of rows, and eventually he persuaded her to have a termination at 18 weeks. Amongst his arguments were him being too old, it not being fair on his existing children (even though they have a half sister with their mum and they love her to bits), they can't afford it (even though they both have very good jobs and end up with £1000 per month disposable income AFTER all the bills, mortgage, ex wife payments, etc have been paid). But the money is beside the point, it basically boiled down to him not wanting any more children. I posted about this at the time because she has such a horrible time, and went through with the termination because she was scared of bringing up a child on her own. I was the only person she told so I've had to keep that secret since. Part of him convincing her that a termination would be the best idea was him saying that once they were married he might change his mind about having more kids.

Anyway, they got married, and seemed fine but she phoned me last week and said she's pregnant again - 24 weeks gone! I was excited for her but she burst into tears saying that her DH hates her for becoming pregnant again, he has three times convinced her to book an appointment for another termination, but three times saw how upset she was at the thought of it and they didn't go. But then he booked her another appt at 23 weeks and took her there. She had 50 minutes of counselling, during which time she said she could feel the baby kicking. She has also in the meantime been going to antenatal appointments and had even found out the sex of the baby at the 20 week scan. Her DH hadn't gone with her to any appointments and refused to even look at the scan photo.

Anyway, quite rightly the counsellor said she definitely couldn't go through with a termination so they went home and her DH kept shouting at her saying she's ruined his life, wished he had never met her, etc. Part of me understands how he much feel cheated because he's had his kids, and now he's got his own lifestyle where he can go out all the time, go on lots of holidays, etc - he's also a very anxious person and is always tidying up - I think he may have mild OCD - so the thought of a baby 'messing that up' would probably really stress him out. But its happened, his wife is pregnant, they are both healthy, well off, etc so he needs to deal with it, and how he's treated my sister is shocking I think.

I asked her why she had kept the pregnancy secret for so long - they've known since October and she said she daren't tell anyone because she didn't want to end up with everyone slagging off her DH.

I know she was very stupid and not fair on him to 'forget' her pill twice as she knew he didn't really want a baby (this time she thought as they were married it wouldn't matter - she still should have told him she'd missed a pill). But how he's treated her since has, in my opinion, amounted to emotional abuse/bullying. I don't think they should stay together - they disagree on one of the biggest decisions of your life.

Anyway, I spoke to her this morning and I offered to go with her to tell our parents - she was nervous of telling them of her own because they would wonder why she had kept it secret so long and would get really upset. But she said this morning that her DH has suggested they both tell them together. I think this is so she can't tell them what he's been like. She's also said that he doesn't know that she's told me and she's going to 'tell me' at the weekend and I have to act surprised as though I didn't know. I'm guessing so that he can put on a happy face and pretend he's fine with it. I want our parents to know what she's been going through because I think they might be able to better convince her that her DH is being a bully. But that would be betraying her confidence and should I just stay out of it?

Thanks for reading if you've got through all that!

What a prize twat.

You know, it's hard enough with a baby without the doom cloud of feeling guilty, not being able to ask for help with anything because it was "your choice" to have the baby etc hanging over you.

She should kick him to the kerb. I wouldn't want someone like that in my life in any form, let alone as the person who is supposed to love me, be my partner, my best friend.

FWIW i forgot my pill many times (genuinely) without getting PG - only twice wouldn't usually result in a blue line.

he has married her - but treats her as though her happiness is irrelevant.

yet once more i am shocked at the out and out inhumanity of a man towards he woman he purports to love.

if you offered to pick her up and take her away from him, do you think she would go, in order to get her (and her baby) away from this unspeakable wretch?

I also remember your thread from last time and, like the others, remember it as being one of the most distressing I have ever read on MN. Have you had to bear the secret all alone since then?

It's important she tells your parents about the baby, plenty of excuses can be made about why it's so late in the day: some people genuinely don't find out til this stage. Presumably she's not showing much or people would have realised sooner.

At this stage, I'm assuming bets are off for a[nother] late-term abortion, I truly hope so. So his choices are: leave, stay and be a shit father or stay and not be a shit father. In cases 1 and 2 your parents will discover the relevant truth soon enough. Getting the news out into the open will be a massive step forward at this stage.

Whatever your sister's faults may be, this man strikes me as a shitbag of the highest order. I wish you and your sister happiness - without him in your lives, frankly.

This thread is the first time I've ever thought there might be a good reason to ban later abortions - it lessens the time abusive men have to try to bully their partners into terminating pregnancies when they don't want to.

"Maybe he forgave her and believed she wouldn't do it to him again."

This is how abusive men get away with it. There are enough people in the world who buy into their worldview.

Here is someone (maybe even a woman, but surely not?) who thinks that a man who bullied an unwilling woman into having a late abortion and whose attempt to bully her into a second one was only thwarted my a medical professional refusing to giver her the termination he wanted can only be criticised for being too forgiving.

Jesus fucking Christ.

I'm not condoning what she did but I do not for one minute think she tricked him. he chose to take no responsibility in not getting her pregnant - especially after the first time!

HE could have taken responsibility for himself, even if he didn't want a vasectomy he could have insisted he used condoms as well etc.

How bloody stressful for her. Did he not got to any appointments in case he caved in? I cannot imagine having a baby with a man that felt like that and quite sure i would have to leave.

Can you not approach him?

If he was so adamant he didn't want any more children, it's not difficult to stick a condom on in addition to her taking the pill to make doubly sure (especially after the first time).

op-this is possibly the most upsetting thread I have ever read on here.Really resonates with me as I have lost 3 dcs in late pregnancy and while I am pro-choice I would struggle with an abortion at 23 weeks massively.
But thats by the by-I think that you must tell your parents what has gone on. I know this will seem like a betrayal of trust to your sis but it will take the power away from this cunt and that is something vile bullies cant deal with. If other people know then perhaps your sis wont be able to deny to herself any longer how abusive his behaviour is?. Please let us know what happens in future.

Tell your parents

The man is an abuser..simple as..

your sister is 24 weeks pregnant with a baby who is legally viable..any man who tries to force his partner to terminate a pregnancy so advanced needs his dick cutting off..

"If he was so adamant he didn't want any more children, it's not difficult to stick a condom on in addition to her taking the pill to make doubly sure (especially after the first time)."

No.

After the "first time" (and there should never have been a first time - if your late 30s fiancee who is desperate to have children gets pregnant, you don't bully her into having an abortion) he should have set her free to find someone who would give her what she was completely open about wanting.

Anyone who blames this woman for engineering a second pregnancy after the trauma of her unwanted late abortion is inhuman.

This woman must be in so much pain.

OP, I really, really feel for you. I can't even imagine how upset and worried I would be if this were my sister.

Do whatever you can do to get her away from this marriage. I agree with pink4 - tell your parents. She doesn't have to know they know, but I think you need support yourself with this.

Also, maybe ring Women's Aid?

CP - sorry, in case it wasn't clear, I agree with you mostly and am certainly not accusing you of blaming her.

Just the other day I was thinking of posting a thread here to see if anyone knew what had become of this woman. I'm truly shocked and appalled to hear that this is what has happened.

Although I am glad that she's going to have a baby (despite the awful circumstances) and I hope it brings her some happiness and healing.

I dread to think what emotional abuse she has suffered to get her anywhere near the point where she would considering aborting a much wanted baby.

He won't leave however unwanted the baby is. He doesn't love her, he loves controlling her.

I suppose you can't tell your parents

Do what your sister asks you to do at the moment.

He does sound like a controlling bully, but if you betray your sister's confidence she won't be able to confide in you again, and she may have greater need to do so in the future.

I am of the opinion that, if you think she is in any physical danger, do as she asks and do not tell him or your parents what you know, then encourage her to leave as no one should live in physical danger. If you do not believe there is physical danger, do not engage in game playing and hiding things. His fear of shame is controlling everyone and it needs to be confronted.

Good on the clinic for refusing the procedure based on her presentation. Try to persuade her to see if there is any counselling available in her area via the GP or any good women's groups. She needs to explore why she has put up with being treated in this way? Why does she value herself so little? Why is she drawn into his image is everything game? Why did she push ahead with pregnancy in the naive belief that he would change?

What an emotive and sad story for everyone. The worst thing is, I don't think you can do anything about it, motorway.

Your sister seems to want to stay with her H and have his child. Despite his appalling behaviour the first time she got pregnant, she chose to do it all over again. I know she may be conditioned and vulnerable and I have little sympathy for her controlling H, who clearly has issues. But if she has not left him before, she is very unlikely to do it now, isn't she? Naturally, she is setting herself up for a life of misery, but no matter how hard you want to help her, the choice is ultimately hers. I would try to interfere as little as possible while remaining supportive.

To help your sister you should really tell your parents.....that way your sister won't have to keep up appearances. However it could backfire and you could lose her trust. Good luck

Hi again and thanks for all your comments.

My sister and her DH invited my parents round to their house today and told them their 'good news', then my sister phoned me and 'told' me. I had to pretend I was all surprised and happy, which was odd but as it was only me and her having a conversation it didn't matter if I wasn't convincing. But then she put my mum on the phone who was crying with happiness and had already started on the champagne and my mum was talking all about it and I had to basically lie and say I had no clue and what a lovely surprise. I asked her how my sister's DH felt about it and she said he seems really excited and has just gone to get the scan photo (the one he had refused to even acknowledge a couple of days ago). I asked why they hadn't announced their news sooner and my mum said my sister had just told them she had a miscarriage two years ago so they didn't want to tell anyone until the pregnancy was far enough along to be safe.

Then my sister came back on the phone and I said 'miscarriage?' and she said yes it happened two years ago, just after her and DP got married.

I got off the phone really cross that I'd been put in a position where I had to lie to my mum. And now I really don't know what to do. Do I accept that in the space of a week my BIL has gone from saying my sister has ruined his life and taking her for a very late abortion to now being really excited and making a big show of announcing their news with champagne and celebration?

Or should I be worried about all the lies, the fact that he seems to have convinced my sister to lie to everyone, and now I have to lie to my parents - when I see the family all together I'll forever be thinking of how nasty my BIL has been to my sister but have to pretend I know nothing about it. The thing about the miscarriage is very weird. Either my sister had got pregnant three times (this miscarriage was over a year after her first late abortion when her DH said he wouldn't marry her if she had the baby). So has she constantly been trying to get pregnant without his knowledge? Or is she lying to me about the miscarriage and its just made up?

I'm going to feel very odd talking to my parents when I see them in the week - I'm a rubbish liar and I'll find it really hard to go along with being excited about being an auntie and sad for my sister's miscarriage - I'm assuming my parents now believe they've been trying for a baby since their wedding.

I want to tell them the truth, partly because I don't want to keep up this pretence and partly because I don't trust my BIL and think he is controlling my sister.

But will I just put my parents into the same situation I'm in where we know the truth but can't do anything about it without upsetting my sister?

The whole situation is making me feel really uncomfortable. I don't trust my BIL - I think he is controlling. But I partly don't trust my sister at the minute either - I wish she'd never told me.

Motorway - I'm so sorry your sister (and you) is going through this. It must be so upsetting to be stuck between telling your parents and possibly getting cut off from your sister and going along with the pretense of happy families to keep the peace.

The only thing I would be worried about is the emotional/mental abuse moving into physical abuse. Not to frighten you but what if he decides to 'terminate' the pg by himself? If she won't do as he insisted and have a medical abortion what's to stop her having an accident and losing the baby?

I think a phone call to Womens Aid would be a very sensible thing to do to see if you can get some advice from those in the know about domestic abuse.

Alternatively, could you go along with your sister to one of her midwife appointments and broach the subject together - with her permission of course. Maybe you could sell it as asking the MW how many reluctant fathers she sees that become doting dads and then steer the conversation to how reluctant he was? Do the MWs even know she had an abortion at 18wks? That might be important for them to know (rhesus factors/state of her cervix/etc).

I really hope she gets out and has the baby in happy home as regardless of the morality of the baby's conception s/he deserves to be loved and feel loved by all who look after them.

If it were my sister, I'd have to tell her that I won't lie anymore, that her husband is abusive and I won't collude in his abuse by lying for him because it goes against my conscience.

I'd then tell my mother the truth.

'I would just make sure your sister knows just how much you love her and that you will support NO MATTER WHAT.'

That should not have to include lying to her mother in order to cover up his abuse.

Personally, I have a horrible memory, too, if I told lies like that there's a good chance I'd slip up.

Rhade, she's not leaving this guy. She didn't leave him two years ago when he emotionally blackmailed and bullied her into have an abortion she didn't want at 18 weeks. She married him.

She got pregnant deliberately knowing he didn't want children.

It seems entirely unreasonable that poor motorway has been basically forced into keeping these secrets which she finds terribly upsetting. I can't imagine visiting that on my own sister, I would not want to burden her emotionally like that.

I think what this sister expects from motorway, for her to cover up his abuse, is completely unfair.

It must be taking a huge emotional toll on poor motorway.

How horrible.He sounds like a right twit.And now you are in a completely compromised postion.Frankly I think you should be able to tell your own mum whatever you like,and having to keep a secret like this is really unfair on you.

there is so much wrong on both sides, how on earth have they got to 23 weeks and are still thinking of termination!!!!!! he sounds awful and i cant see a happy ending to this TBH if an unplanned preg was going to be so dreadful for the relationship they both should of been much more careful, i have a friend who accidentally forgot several of her pills with her husband who really didn't want kids for several years, (he had suffered a breakdown and was just getting back on his feet) and she went ahead and got pregnant anyway accidentally on purpose, and it almost destroyed their marriage even now 15 years later he has not quite forgiven her, i know a man can stick on a condom, but the person (whoever it may be) who is in charge of the contraption should be ultra careful they have after all agreed to be in charge of that situation

contraption?? contraception!